What if God told you to kill the president?
 

Let's say you are praying to god one night and he communicates to you that you must kill the president. What's your line and why? Assume that you believe in god and are basically a good member of your religion.

edit: also, who the president is and what you think of him doesn't matter for this question IMO. I hate Bush, but that doesn't matter in my decision.

edit: FWIW, I would probably obey god or just stop believing in him altogether.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

I dont think I would ever do a bad thing on the grounds that god told me to. In my opinion, it is more likely that I am imagining things than that a good god would want me to do a bad thing. Therefore I should refrain.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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In my opinion, it is more likely that I am imagining things than that a good god would want me to do a bad thing.

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Ok, but who says that killing the president is bad? God? No. He just told you to kill the president. He thinks it's a great idea!

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

God doesn't exist.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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God doesn't exist.

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Bad move. There goes your insanity plea.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

easy, check myself into a mental institution.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

I would go on a spiritual journey to find out why god told me to kill the president. And my spiritual journey, I mean I would go to taco bell.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

Interesting question! It should sort out the wheat from the shaft, those whose "relationship" with god is only pretence and therefore are not dangerous to society, "talkers" rather than "doers", and the the others, who are better of being subjected to very regular mental health checks and kept under observation.

Lets not forget the Abraham tale. Some may hope that god is just testing them and in his widom will somehow freeze the trigger at the appropriate moment.


I have said numerous times on other posts, this is the danger of faith and why it should be curtailed and why it is a form of evil prejudicial to society and humanity wellbeing.

No one should ever surrender their reason to the irrational.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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In my opinion, it is more likely that I am imagining things than that a good god would want me to do a bad thing.

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Ok, but who says that killing the president is bad? God? No. He just told you to kill the president. He thinks it's a great idea!

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I would be doubting god was the source of the message, hence it would not be true that god thought it was good - it would seem to me that I had lost my mind and that god (and anyone else) would think it a bad idea.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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I would go on a spiritual journey to find out why god told me to kill the president. And my spiritual journey, I mean I would go to taco bell.


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Wow. I thought there was only one correct answer to this question. I was wrong.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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In my opinion, it is more likely that I am imagining things than that a good god would want me to do a bad thing.

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Ok, but who says that killing the president is bad? God? No. He just told you to kill the president. He thinks it's a great idea!

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I would be doubting god was the source of the message, hence it would not be true that god thought it was good - it would seem to me that I had lost my mind and that god (and anyone else) would think it a bad idea.

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Well back this up a little, i think the OP is stating a put yourself in Abrahams shoes type question. So lets say not only did you hear that message from god but your religous leader clergy pope whatever called you and said they just received a message from god stating the exact same message. Then what?

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

There's really no reason to make this about the President. Use the Abraham scenario itself. God told him to kill his own son--he was ready to do it (despite that whole little Thou Shalt Not Kill thingy which is always swept aside when inconvenient). For this, Abraham is held up in the church as a model follower. If that doesn't tell you all you need to know about the church and its followers...

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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Well back this up a little, i think the OP is stating a put yourself in Abrahams shoes type question. So lets say not only did you hear that message from god but your religous leader clergy pope whatever called you and said they just received a message from god stating the exact same message. Then what?

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Sorry - I guess I misunderstood the point of the question. No I wouldnt do a bad thing just because god told me to.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

Alright, I'll bite.

I would ask God why he didn't do it himself. After all, he is God, and should be able to manage it easily through means of a lightning strike, a sudden weather event that causes the President's plane to crash, or something of that nature.

If he answers me, I would try to continue the conversation as long as possible to find out as much as I could about the nature of God and the Universe. In that conversation, I would attain absolute proof that the being telling me to kill the President was in fact God. I would then try to negotiate some benefit for myself for doing God this favor. Immortality or a gauranteed place in heaven would probably be high on the agenda. If everything worked out, I would probably then go do it.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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Let's say you are praying to god one night and he communicates to you that you must kill the president. What's your line and why? Assume that you believe in god and are basically a good member of your religion.

edit: also, who the president is and what you think of him doesn't matter for this question IMO. I hate Bush, but that doesn't matter in my decision.

edit: FWIW, I would probably obey god or just stop believing in him altogether.

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Hey, I am a Republican! Did you not see the Planet of the Apes series? Ape cannot kill ape, period! [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

The answer depends on how certain I am that it is actually God commanding me and not some delusion or hullucination. If I have some doubt, I must take the safe route and abstain from attempting assassinations.

If I somehow knew with absolute certainty it was God who was commanding me then I think I would do as he commands.

In practical application I can't imagine a way God could prove to me with virtual certainty that he exists, therefore I am not likely to be doing any assassinations.

Stu

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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Let's say you are praying to god one night and he communicates to you that you must kill the president. What's your line and why? Assume that you believe in god and are basically a good member of your religion.

edit: also, who the president is and what you think of him doesn't matter for this question IMO. I hate Bush, but that doesn't matter in my decision.

edit: FWIW, I would probably obey god or just stop believing in him altogether.

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Haven't read responses, but if you feel God telling you something that directly contradicts the Bible, guess what? That's not God!

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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Haven't read responses, but if you feel God telling you something that directly contradicts the Bible, guess what? That's not God!

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What makes you think killing the president contradicts the bible?

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

I'd tell him to do it himself. Pretty small task for God I would think.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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Haven't read responses, but if you feel God telling you something that directly contradicts the Bible, guess what? That's not God!

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What makes you think killing the president contradicts the bible?

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Is that a serious question?

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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Let's say you are praying to god one night and he communicates to you that you must kill the president. What's your line and why? Assume that you believe in god and are basically a good member of your religion.

edit: also, who the president is and what you think of him doesn't matter for this question IMO. I hate Bush, but that doesn't matter in my decision.

edit: FWIW, I would probably obey god or just stop believing in him altogether.

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Haven't read responses, but if you feel God telling you something that directly contradicts the Bible, guess what? That's not God!

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No. God telling someone to kill someone is SOOO unbiblical. Just avoid the old testament and you could believe that.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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Haven't read responses, but if you feel God telling you something that directly contradicts the Bible, guess what? That's not God!

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What makes you think killing the president contradicts the bible?

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Is that a serious question?

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I don't see why not. He's made requests like this before.

http://keptar.demasz.hu/arthp/art/l/la_hire/abraham.jpg

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

Killing people or having people killed is standard for god.

memento mori
 

What if SNOWBALL138 framed a ridiculous hypothetical question - would you answer it?

Re: memento mori
 

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What if SNOWBALL138 framed a ridiculous hypothetical question - would you answer it?

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Of course, it is no consequence, unlike a "believed" order from god to kill, for which there is historical evidence if you follow the bible, or many others, so called, "sacred" books!

Re: memento mori
 

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What if SNOWBALL138 framed a ridiculous hypothetical question - would you answer it?

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I like sloppy Joes. 7/11 is too expensive. My computer speakers are good.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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If I somehow knew with absolute certainty it was God who was commanding me then I think I would do as he commands.

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You've just explained every atrocity committed by religious fanatics.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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Killing people or having people killed is standard for god.

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This might help you put the issue in context:
http://www.tektonics.org/lp/nokilling.html

The Bible also says we are to obey our nations laws, which obviously does not condone the killing of our president:
http://www.tektonics.org/lp/obeylaw.html

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

Then I'd try to kill the president. Of course. Like, what else would you do?

That being said, God's never told me anything remotely as direct as "kill the president."

Edit: Ok, now that I've read your post:

I don't think that your response that you would EITHER obey or choose that moment to disbelieve is a valid one. At that point you should believe (unless you believe yourself to be insane). Your choice is to obey or not.

I'd also like to add that I'm not a member of a religion and that my overwhelming faith is that there's a God and that God is Good.

But sure, I'd kill the president. I'd definitely ask why (assuming I wasn't too busy crapping myself to do so), but if he decided not to answer, I'd still kill him.

A more interesting question would be something like: Would you kill your wife/lover/child/best friend / preacher/ etc. etc. etc. if God asked.

That would be much harder. I might choose to just disobey and ask forgiveness for that one. I wouldn't be doing that because i saw god as being incorrect or whatever, just because I'm a regular guy that doesn't like to do that sort of thing: enough that I'd quite possibly disobey god for it.

I'll reiterate that I've never had God talk to me, in a manner where I could say undeniably taht it was god, and certianly not in english or something that could communicate as clearly as "kill the president".

OOC, what's the point of this question? (Although, I suppose it's better than my inwards vs outwards meditation question.)

--Dave.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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I would go on a spiritual journey to find out why god told me to kill the president. And my spiritual journey, I mean I would go to taco bell.

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lol

That's not as bad of an idea as you believe. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

Smooth. [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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You've just explained every atrocity committed by religious fanatics.

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How do you come to that conclusion? More likely these religious fanatics just used God as an excuse to commit thier atrocities just like George Bush used WMD as an excuse to invade Iraq. Please tell me you don't believe everything that people tell you.

Stu

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

What if the president told you to kill god?

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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How do you come to that conclusion? More likely these religious fanatics just used God as an excuse to commit thier atrocities just like George Bush used WMD as an excuse to invade Iraq. Please tell me you don't believe everything that people tell you.


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You said if you knew it was really god telling you to kill the president, you would do it. I don't see how this is different than religious fanatics who "know" their god wants them to bomb an abortion clinic, torture a heretic, burn a witch at the stake, etc. They are not making it up - they believe god is instructing them just as much as you would in the case of George W.

It just points out the absurdity of abandoning your own human sense of right and wrong, at the order of some diety. If god really "ordered" you to murder someone, the only proper response for a decent human being would be to tell him to f**k off, IMO.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

I'd ask him to perform a sign that would convince me that this is the right thing to do...like maybe deposit $1B into my bank account.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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Alright, I'll bite.

I would ask God why he didn't do it himself. After all, he is God, and should be able to manage it easily through means of a lightning strike, a sudden weather event that causes the President's plane to crash, or something of that nature.

If he answers me, I would try to continue the conversation as long as possible to find out as much as I could about the nature of God and the Universe. In that conversation, I would attain absolute proof that the being telling me to kill the President was in fact God. I would then try to negotiate some benefit for myself for doing God this favor. Immortality or a gauranteed place in heaven would probably be high on the agenda. If everything worked out, I would probably then go do it.

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Now instead of president, lets substitute "all the Jews."

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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You said if you knew it was really god telling you to kill the president, you would do it. I don't see how this is different than religious fanatics who "know" their god wants them to bomb an abortion clinic, torture a heretic, burn a witch at the stake, etc. They are not making it up - they believe god is instructing them just as much as you would in the case of George W.


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There is a big difference between "believing" and "knowing". You are simply confusing the two as is evidenced by your using them interchangeably. Beliefs are influenced by your own wants, interests, political agendas and other outside influences including knowledge. You can "believe" a tax cut is going to beneficial to the economy. You "know" 2 + 2 = 4.

You only believe religious fanatics are "not making it up". Its impossible for you to know that, unless of course, you have some special ESP powers that allow you to hear a persons thoughts. Even if you did have those special ESP powers, you could only "know" those people "believe" God is telling them to go out and kill. Such powers would never allow you to "know" if God is actually commanding them to kill or not.

As I have said earlier. To go out and kill an innocent person simply for no other reason than God commanded it, It is not enough to simply believe God commanded it. You have to know it. I don't think its possible for humans to really "know" anything. If God made it possible for me to "know" he is commanding me to go out and kill an innocent person, it would shatter all my beliefs about God.

Stu

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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You "know" 2 + 2 = 4.

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I don't think its possible for humans to really "know" anything.

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ergo, you are not a human.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

Not follow it. I believe in what god represents more than him as an authority figure. If he asked for that, He would not longer be that which I beleive in, and I could not in good faith do it.

Re: What if God told you to kill the president?
 

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You "know" 2 + 2 = 4.

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I don't think its possible for humans to really "know" anything.

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ergo, you are not a human.

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Beat me to it. I was going to end it with "NOW who is arguing semantics!" but your quip is much funnier.