On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

Any of you OOTers have opinions on real estate in NYC right now?

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

No opinions, just advice. Get the best location you can afford and negotiate like hell to get a good price. Also, plan on staying a while.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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No opinions, just advice. Get the best location you can afford and negotiate like hell to get a good price. Also, plan on staying a while.

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Location is covered. Negotiating was near impossible due to the place being priced aggressively in a desirable building and only on the market 2 weeks. And I plan on staying a while, but some aspects of my job situation mean that I always have risk of having to move.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

lock in your mortgage interest rate now

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

I hear a lot of stuff about the market overheating now, but think there are plenty of deals to be had, I got a great deal on my place. co-op or condo? if co-op, see what the board's policy is as far as renting the place if you have to move.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

It is a condo, and I can't say it is a great deal. It appears to be a good deal compared to the other 20 or 30 apartments I've looked at in my neighborhood over the past year or so.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

do you still want to live in it ten years from now? if not, don't buy.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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do you still want to live in it ten years from now? if not, don't buy.

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I do want to, but there could be factors which make it not possible.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

I'm not an expert, but stuff I would think about is will I be able to fix the place up (possibly increasing resale value) or is it all brand new interior? where is it in relation to public transportation (properties close to the subway in nyc are usually more in demand and tend to do better even when the market is tanking).

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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I'm not an expert, but stuff I would think about is will I be able to fix the place up (possibly increasing resale value) or is it all brand new interior? where is it in relation to public transportation (properties close to the subway in nyc are usually more in demand and tend to do better even when the market is tanking).

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Yeah I think i'm doing well in these regards. It is a recently renovated place in prime location 3 blocks from teh subway in a desirable building. Because I'm worried about real estate getting beat up, I think getting a reasonably priced high-end place is probably better than trying to get a steal on a marginal place.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

if it's somewhere you want to live longterm, i'd go ahead and buy. you're going to take a bath if you have to sell in the next 3-7 years though.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

What are the specs? Price/location/# of rooms/size/how you're financing/etc.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

Move to NJ and pay 1/5th the rent... Just kidding good luck with your decision.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

Curious what you are looking at Size bedrooms and what the prices are. Being CDN we hear that NY prices rae outrageous.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

Congrats! Park Slope?

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

Park slope. 3 br. 1450 sq ft. newly renovated, in great shape. loft like. 3 blocks from F train and 1.5 big blocks from the park. who wants to guess how much?

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

1.5+ mm.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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1.5+ mm.

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Easily.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

nah, only 1.1

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

seems great to me man, I think you should go for it. that's def less than similar sized apts in my neighborhood are going for.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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seems great to me man, I think you should go for it. that's def less than similar sized apts in my neighborhood are going for.

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It is pretty similarly priced to some new construction in North Slope, but the new construction is not quite as desirable I think. It looks really good compared to the stuff in brownstones and such.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

Paluka,

As I mentioned to you, a number of friends of mine have sold their places in NYC over the past year with plans to rent for a couple of years before buying again. Whether or not their assessment of the market is any good is not something I am qualified to evaluate.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

fwiw, and this is a personal thing, I wouldn't want something that had been newly renovated, one because I enjoy doing renovations and that type of thing and two if you do a nice job it can really help your resale value. just something to consider as far as fixer uppers go.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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Paluka,

As I mentioned to you, a number of friends of mine have sold their places in NYC over the past year with plans to rent for a couple of years before buying again. Whether or not their assessment of the market is any good is not something I am qualified to evaluate.

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One thing I should mention is that for whatever reason, Park Slope has an extreme lack of quality rentals. It is actually quite weird.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

What would a comparable place rent for?

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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What would a comparable place rent for?

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My best guess would be $4800

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

I still would wait to buy, but this is probably as good a rent/purchase ratio as you can find right now.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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nah, only 1.1

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Is it wrong that I think this is under priced? Good luck.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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I still would wait to buy, but this is probably as good a rent/purchase ratio as you can find right now.

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I will say that the $4800 figure is based on the quality of the apartment. I live in a slightly larger apartment right now in basically the same location and only pay $3300, but the apartment needs renovations badly. But even if my $4800 guess is high, I'd say i'm 95% confident that it would be $4000 or higher.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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Any of you OOTers have opinions on real estate in NYC right now?

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I have been following the Manhattan market for a while now. Notwithstanding the fact that I had until recently a blog dedicated to the New York housing bubble, circumstances forced my wife to look at apartments to purchase and we have done so over the past 6 months.

My take is the following. Cracks in the U.S. housing bubble are starting to show everywhere, including areas outside of NYC such as Westchester and Long Island. However, they are showing much less (if at all) in NYC (including Brooklyn). My view is that (1) NY is lagging behind the rest of the country and will continue to do so and (2) unless the market tanks (which it may) NY may well be more resilient than other bubble areas because of the relatively strong job market. (Contrast with purely speculative markets such as Phoenix, Las Vegas, and Florida.) Still "resilient" doesn't necessarily mean appreciation; it just may mean that NYC gets hurt less than other areas. Notwithstanding the above, it would not at all shock me if avergae prices in NYC were off 15-10% within 18 months.

In NYC, where we have looked, inventory is definitely up and prices have levelled. There seems to be the classic standoff between sellers, who don't want to accept that they may not get 2005 peak prices anymore, and buyers, who want to see if prices are, in fact, dropping and, if so, how far.

When we go to open house now there are far fewer people than 1 year ago and you hear comments from other prosective purchasers that they may just wait a little lnger to see where prices head.

I live in the village and there are still not that many good listings which keeps prices up. However on the UES, inventory seems to be soraing IMO. I think that will push prices downward. I don'r know about Brooklyn though.

My bottom line is that I think the downside risk of prices falling far outweigh the upside potential of them appreciating much, if at all, in the near term.

Our plan is to wait things out in our rental unless we find a good deal. For us good deal means we can afford it and we will not have to move for a while . I would not want to buy anything I wans't planning to stay in for at least a minimum of 7 years as I think there could well be a rough patch ahead even in NYC.

If you have found a place that is affordable and suits longer term needs maybe you should go ahead. Three bedrooms give you some room to expand so you shuld be good for awhile. However, don't be surprised ifthe same apt. is significantly cheaper in 6 - 12 months.

Also, check out the following rent v. buy analysis tool that is specifcially geared to New York:

NY Rent v. Buy Calculator

Also, for the best collection of articles relating to the Housing Bubble in general, see:

Ben's Housing Bubble Blog

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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Park slope. 3 br. 1450 sq ft. newly renovated, in great shape. loft like. 3 blocks from F train and 1.5 big blocks from the park. who wants to guess how much?

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How many bath's?

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

colgin,

What you wrote is virtually identical to what friends of mine in NYC who have recently (well, mainly six to nine months ago) sold their places told me. None of them have any regrets about their decision.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

Colgin thanks for the info and the links.
I'm basically going in with the idea that I'm not really gaining anything financially by this purchase. It is reasonably close to break even with renting making some pessimistic assumptions. I'm hoping that I'm making a breakevn decision at worst which lands us in a nicer apartment and makes my wife a little happier.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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colgin,

What you wrote is virtually identical to what friends of mine in NYC who have recently (well, mainly six to nine months ago) sold their places told me. None of them have any regrets about their decision.

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If you view buying/selling a place purely as an economic decision, I think the risk of doing what your friends did is extremely low. (Yeah, prices could shoot up again, but barring serious inflation this is really unlikely; more likely you can always rebuy the same place for less.)

There might be other reasons not to sell, like your eally love your place. The other issue is that in NYC, even if you are willing to spend a good amount on rent, the housing stock is just not that good (as Paluka stated), particularly as more and more rental buildings convert to condos. There have been some nice rental developments in NYC that were built in the last 5 years or so, but while they all have nice amenities, the apartments tned to be small. But you know what, the apartments most people can afford to buy here are really small too at $1,000 +/- per sq. ft.

We are lucky in that we are in one of the nicer village full service buildings that went condo years ago and the owner of my unit rents it out as an investment property. Right now we spend $3,000/month, which is actually under market rates for this unit. However, to buy the unit would cost me about $850K give or take. So, I would have to putdown $190K (including closign costs), and my gross monthlies would be a litle over $6,000 (incl. maintenance). I would epxect ot get back about $1,800 in tax savings but would forgo about $900 a month (before taxes) in risk free investment income (short term T bills).

Thus, unless you think there is going to be continued appreciation, renting seems like the better deal when compared to buying equivalent properties. Part of the problem in NY is that there are not thos eequivalent proerties in that much of the rental stock just sucks. Elsewhere in the U.S. I understand this is not a problem. I am not sure why people in California or Florida bubble areas are buying now where you can rent a nice house for far less than it costs to buy. That is just crazy!

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

fwiw this was basically my attitude as well, but add in the utility of being able to upgrade/customize the apt with some potential ROI.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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I am not sure why people in California or Florida bubble areas are buying now where you can rent a nice house for far less than it costs to buy. That is just crazy!

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Because everybody tells them it's a good investment.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

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Colgin thanks for the info and the links.
I'm basically going in with the idea that I'm not really gaining anything financially by this purchase. It is reasonably close to break even with renting making some pessimistic assumptions. I'm hoping that I'm making a breakevn decision at worst which lands us in a nicer apartment and makes my wife a little happier.

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Sounds like you are going in with the right attitude. Best of luck.

Your post also makes me think I need to look in Brooklyn. $1.1MM for 1,800 sq. ft. is so much cheaper than Manhattan. Every time I suggest it to my wife, she balks. Oh well.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

I've been looking to buy for the past 2 years and have not found anything that is both a good value and a place that I would actually want to inhabit. My boss tells me that Chappaqua has a scary number of vacancies (those cracks that colgin mentioned). It's gotten to the point where I'm considering buying overseas.

Re: On the verge of buying apartment in Brooklyn, opinions?
 

FWIW, my 1 bedroom search in the city (from Wall Street to mid 60s up an down) has been pretty depressing so far....any new building with a doorman is like $850K for a cookie-cutter 1 bedroom, while 2-bedrooms are more like $1.25mm +. I thought market would have dropped at least a bit but from what others are saying it hasn't, although my broker told me the other day that she's seen a lot of recent clients bargaining.