Holdem is dying/read article
 

posting full articles is a no-no. When it's from another long time 2p2ers blog, it's just gross.

http://www.joetall.com/blog/ is what you're looking for.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

the 1k stud 8b and 1k hose events were probably the 2 softest bracelet event fields outside of the main event

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

No limit betting is sexy. Limit betting is boring. It's ridiculous to think that we're just a few years away from the $50k HORSE's prize pool eclipsing that of the Main Event.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
No limit betting is sexy. Limit betting is boring. It's ridiculous to think that we're just a few years away from the $50k HORSE's prize pool eclipsing that of the Main Event.

[/ QUOTE ]
So mayby big bet rotation games will be the new thing?

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

bsd is dying.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

NL holdem will be around for a while, maybe some new game will replace it in 5 years

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

It would be great for professional players if o8b or stud 8 became popular because the variance is low an the edge of a good player over a fish is big. However for that very reason the fish are unlikely to take to them.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

i agree with scorer

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

Just finished a 16 hour session playing 40-80 LHE in Los Angeles. For about 10 hours EVERY pot was 5+ handed with 2 or 3 bets in preflop. AT LEAST 4 players dropped $4000+ while I was there. Yep, holdem is dying...

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
the 1k stud 8b and 1k hose events were probably the 2 softest bracelet event fields outside of the main event

[/ QUOTE ]

The SHOE field was amazingly soft. I took HORRIFIC beats on day one and made day two with 70% of avg chip stack. But even then, a solid Hold'em tournament player was at my table all day and he played better than everyone but made fundamental mistakes in Stud8 where he could of saved a ton of chips.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
bsd is dying.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol

this will go largely unappreciated

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
bsd is dying.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol

this will go largely unappreciated

[/ QUOTE ]
You don't have to be kreskin to see where he is coming from.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just finished a 16 hour session playing 40-80 LHE in Los Angeles. For about 10 hours EVERY pot was 5+ handed with 2 or 3 bets in preflop. AT LEAST 4 players dropped $4000+ while I was there. Yep, holdem is dying...

[/ QUOTE ]


Arrgh....
I need to get to these games. Wow.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

but you have to know wtf bsd is in the first place to even begin to get it.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
bsd is dying.

[/ QUOTE ]
[ ] does not deliver
[x] delivers

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just finished a 16 hour session playing 40-80 LHE in Los Angeles. For about 10 hours EVERY pot was 5+ handed with 2 or 3 bets in preflop. AT LEAST 4 players dropped $4000+ while I was there. Yep, holdem is dying...

[/ QUOTE ]


Arrgh....
I need to get to these games. Wow.

[/ QUOTE ]

Two weeks left till the WSOP is over and the good players are back in LA, gogogogogogogo!

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
posting full articles is a no-no. When it's from another long time 2p2ers blog, it's just gross.

http://www.joetall.com/blog/ is what you're looking for.

[/ QUOTE ]

OP, what is your opinion about FTP being rigged and TT flopping a set more than any other pocket pair.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
No limit betting is sexy. Limit betting is boring. It's ridiculous to think that we're just a few years away from the $50k HORSE's prize pool eclipsing that of the Main Event.

[/ QUOTE ]

As the ME declines and the 50k HORSE increases, I like my chances.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
No limit betting is sexy. Limit betting is boring. It's ridiculous to think that we're just a few years away from the $50k HORSE's prize pool eclipsing that of the Main Event.

[/ QUOTE ]

As the ME declines and the 50k HORSE increases, I like my chances.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well the 50k HORSE got only a handful more players this year than last year, but the 5k and 2.5k events drew very well and drew lots of the "TV" pros that get people interested. Long live limit games!

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
posting full articles is a no-no. When it's from another long time 2p2ers blog, it's just gross.

http://www.joetall.com/blog/ is what you're looking for.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nice blog entry. One comment: other 2p2 HE players who played in HORSE and stud-type tourneys at the WSOP this year --

TStoneMBD
Gigabet
DJ Sensei
FossilMan

are there even more?

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

Specific forms of poker may come and go, but the game itself will always be around. My thought is this:

Games where people get to use their superior skill to best other people with lesser skill, mentally, over a long period of time, have a lot of staying power.

Games where you not only have the above, but you also have poor players winning in the short term...now you have a game that will never go away.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
posting full articles is a no-no. When it's from another long time 2p2ers blog, it's just gross.

http://www.joetall.com/blog/ is what you're looking for.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nice blog entry. One comment: other 2p2 HE players who played in HORSE and stud-type tourneys at the WSOP this year --

TStoneMBD
Gigabet
DJ Sensei
FossilMan

are there even more?

[/ QUOTE ]

Fossilman is a mixed game specialist, he doesnt play a lot of NL tournaments - this is a common mistake about him. Also TStone <u>was</u> a limit hold'em specialist (even though he is known for the NJ tournament), but he is now playing more mixed games than anything else.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just finished a 16 hour session playing 40-80 LHE in Los Angeles. For about 10 hours EVERY pot was 5+ handed with 2 or 3 bets in preflop. AT LEAST 4 players dropped $4000+ while I was there. Yep, holdem is dying...

[/ QUOTE ]

How did you end up?

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

Ok, thanks. Never knew that about Greg. Even so, a lot of "devout" HE players are dabbling in stud type games recently, including Brian Townsend playing 20/40 razz several different nights before the WSOP.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
Ok, thanks. Never knew that about Greg. Even so, a lot of "devout" HE players are dabbling in stud type games recently, including Brian Townsend playing 20/40 razz several different nights before the WSOP.

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Agreed that this is happening, its actually happening slower than I predicted last year when Schneids won but its happening none the less.

Whats really interesting is to see the tourny pros who only play Chines Poker, BT or rotation cash games. Some of these guys wont be caught dead playing hold'em, cash games - its very odd!

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just finished a 16 hour session playing 40-80 LHE in Los Angeles. For about 10 hours EVERY pot was 5+ handed with 2 or 3 bets in preflop. AT LEAST 4 players dropped $4000+ while I was there. Yep, holdem is dying...

[/ QUOTE ]

How did you end up?

[/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ]
dropped $4000+ while I was there.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]


Whats really interesting is to see the tourny pros who only play Chines Poker, BT or rotation cash games. Some of these guys wont be caught dead playing hold'em, cash games - its very odd!

[/ QUOTE ]

Those games have major gamble and fill that need for fast money. The swings are huge in B/T and Chinese is a past-time gamble game that is a lot of fun. Playing tight in a cash game is extremely boring compared to those rotation games.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

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Fossilman is a mixed game specialist

[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't that an oxymoron?

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Fossilman is a mixed game specialist

[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't that an oxymoron?

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no

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Fossilman is a mixed game specialist

[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't that an oxymoron?

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yes

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fyp

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Fossilman is a mixed game specialist

[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't that an oxymoron?

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Yes and no. He is well balanced between the games he plays, think of him as a junior big-gamer player (Ive seen him play from 100/200 up to 300/600, anyone know if he plays bigger?) whose edge is by playing all the games in the mix fairly well when most players in these games are usually only good at one or two of the games. Don't get me wrong, he has his weak spots like we all do... but he is fairly well balanced between the games which gives him a slight edge in mixed format.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

i know what he meant. the statement itself is simply an oxymoron.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
The motherboard got a hold of my last pot and there is some agreement about what I have said.

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Not really. What you are putting forth *might* be true, but the evidence you provide is anecdotal at best and somewhat underwhelming. Of course the higher limit HE games you and your friends play in are getting tough. People suck at poker, are under-rolled and go broke.


[ QUOTE ]
The ME showed about a 20% decrease from last year, I think. I have yet to look at the actual numbers.

[/ QUOTE ]
You aren't using this to back up your claim I hope. Should be pretty obvious why.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
As the ME declines and the 50k HORSE increases, I like my chances.

[/ QUOTE ]
Has it occurred to you that the ME's decline was a) a "streak" of one year and b) largely related to online qualifying being way down in numbers?

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

NL poker is just getting started ...

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
No limit betting is sexy. Limit betting is boring. It's ridiculous to think that we're just a few years away from the $50k HORSE's prize pool eclipsing that of the Main Event.

[/ QUOTE ]

My observation from being a very low limit recreational player, with recreational player friends is that LHE will make a come back, at least at the 2/4 - 5/10 range. I recently spent time at the Commerce and in LV for 3 days where there aren't nearly as many LHE games running as a few years ago. My reasoning is that NLHE is sexy as stated, but it is also more scary to the casual player, and they can more quickly lose their bankroll. A buddy of mine who only wanted to lose $150 a day sat down and lost his daily roll in about 45 minutes ... time to tour Vegas. I, playing 3/6 - 5/10, could go on a pretty bad stretch and still get some entertainment time in. When we got back my buddies who know NLHE from local neighborhood tournaments wanted to learn more about LHE because they think their dollar can stretch longer there.

I actually find the 3/6 - 5/10 LHE really juicy because the "better" players are taking their shot at NLHE. I was surrounded by tourists and wives of NLHE players who would run through a rack of chips and another would take their place. Keep in mind I am not comfortable playing cash NLHE, and I am not implying those games aren't juicier. Just that if we are going to rely on making money from the fish, at some point the fish are going to go where they feel more comfortable and where they think the have better shot to win money or at least extend the enjoyment of their time at the table.

Then again, I could be wrong.

NCAces

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

badugi baby!

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
badugi baby!

[/ QUOTE ]

Matty baby!

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

I have noticed a significant increase in the number of players in the low ($3 to $24) buyin MTTs (HORSE, Stud HL and Razz) on Stars. By significant I mean where a low buy in HORSE MTT, just a few months ago, may have had 50-70 runners it is not uncommon to see 225-275 today. Full Tilt has also seen an increase but nowhere near as large as Stars.

The HORSE sngs on Stars also seem to be becoming more popular. Again the low limit buyins (ie $3 to $16) fill up without a long wait. These are great for increasing your bankroll as most of the players understand holdem and maybe one other game and therefore make significant errors. They also seem to have minimal understanding of the ABC style of sngs. Juicy - but don't tell anyone.

Re: Holdem is dying/read article
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
As the ME declines and the 50k HORSE increases, I like my chances.

[/ QUOTE ]
Has it occurred to you that the ME's decline was a) a "streak" of one year and b) largely related to online qualifying being way down in numbers?

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course, just think of how much bigger the 50k HORSE would have been if online qualifying was up to last years standards. The fact the that 50k went up while the ME went down is a start in the direction that I am speaking about.