Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

I just sat down a few hands ago and have been fairly active. Don't know villain at all, but he seems pretty aggressive. He's playing like 50/15 so he's probably pretty fishy. But that's only over like 20 hands. Here is the only hand we've played together.

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $3/$6
5 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $600
CO: $268.85
Button: $607.05
TWP: $929.25
BB: $588.70

Pre-flop: (5 players) TWP is SB with 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">TWP raises to $18</font>, BB calls.

Flop: 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($36, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">TWP bets $24</font>, <font color="#cc0000">BB raises to $48</font>, TWP calls.

Turn: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($132, 2 players)
TWP checks, BB checks.

River: 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($132, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">TWP bets $84</font>, <font color="#cc0000">BB raises to $384</font>, TWP folds.

Now a few hands later, here's the hand I have a question about.

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $3/$6
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $214.85
UTG+1: $607.05
TWP: $779.25
Button: $730.70
SB: $1558.50
BB: $663

Pre-flop: (6 players) TWP is CO with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">TWP raises to $18</font>, Button calls, 2 folds.

Flop: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($45, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">TWP bets $30</font>, Button calls.

Turn: K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($105, 2 players)
TWP checks, Button checks.

River: 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($105, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">TWP bets $84</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Button raises to $168</font>, TWP...? Call or fold?

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

You gotta call imo. Not even a flush board. So I don't see how he has you beat here. Also might have KJ or such.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

wow its 3 bet or call, i wouldnt consider folding

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

Since he could conceivably play KJ in such a way, I would call, he could also have air from time to time.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

bet turn. as played, wtf, how is folding an option, obv call.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

I can't really imagine finding a fold here.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

Wow. Come on man.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
wow its 3 bet or call, i wouldnt consider folding

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

ok, trick question, i didnt consider folding. but reraise (how much?) or call?

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
ok, trick question, i didnt consider folding. but reraise (how much?) or call?

[/ QUOTE ]

But you really should have bet turn, But since u didnt, 400 seems about right.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

I'd just call, but I bet the turn every time.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

shove

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

Just calling wouldn't be too bad. If you did elect to raise, $375.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]

bet turn. as played, wtf, how is folding an option, obv call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

$444. id call a shove too fwiw.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

twp, im convinced you're a troll. thisi s either a 3bet or a call.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
twp, im convinced you're a troll. thisi s either a 3bet or a call.

[/ QUOTE ]

ironic bc the main characteristic ive noticed of you as a poster is that you pretty much always agree with twp.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

min 3-bet and fold to shove (but call min 4-bet).

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

reraise to $400-$500 and snap call push. if he's made overbets in the past, he's likely doing it again with monsters, so i'd rule out a boat. ruling it out will never be 100% correct results wise, but theory wise i think so.


edit: when i say snap call, it's becuase you know given his hand range, his potential '[censored] it im drunk' or '[censored] it i want to go get dinner' and so getting such good odds it makes it a 'urgh, didnt want him to shove but i got to call anyway'

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

i'd shove but a call might be better

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
twp, im convinced you're a troll. thisi s either a 3bet or a call.

[/ QUOTE ]

ironic bc the main characteristic ive noticed of you as a poster is that you pretty much always agree with twp.

[/ QUOTE ]

thats a pretty fken cruel thing to say to someone

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

its not supposed to be mean! its just what ive noticed.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

Obv, if you beleive he is fishy a raise has +EV. Against anyone half decent I call and wish I had raised.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

I'd definitely reraise him.

Hands you're behind:

K10, K3, 33. But, if hand one is any indication, he'd probably make a raise of some sort on the flop with all of these holdings.

Hands you beat:

Kx. Given that you checked the turn, he could easily mistake a whiffed c/r for a now thin valuebet/bluff and therefore think his Kx is good.

If I reraise, I might shove b/c this is one of those situations where if he'll call a raise, he'll probably call a shove.

I'd only raise to a small amount if I thought he was bluffing most of the time here...maybe he'd come over the top (???). Doesn't seem likely that he'd shove over the top though, so I'd prolly push.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
twp, im convinced you're a troll. thisi s either a 3bet or a call.

[/ QUOTE ]

ironic bc the main characteristic ive noticed of you as a poster is that you pretty much always agree with twp.

[/ QUOTE ]
bc he's my BFF.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

yeah twp and bobbo are on the same boat, it's just that bobbo is chillin in the back of the boat so he's harder to see

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

fwiw, there was a huge thread a while back where TWP and I did not agree, I'd dig it up but it's somewhat irrelevant... if jfish was discretely calling me a troll, kudos to him, it was a nice clever ruse.

[ QUOTE ]

yeah twp and bobbo are on the same boat, it's just that bobbo is chillin in the back of the boat so he's harder to see


[/ QUOTE ]
being on a boat is better then in the water i suppose!

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

no worries, im not that clever [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
shove

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
twp, im convinced you're a troll. thisi s either a 3bet or a call.

[/ QUOTE ]

ironic bc the main characteristic ive noticed of you as a poster is that you pretty much always agree with twp.

[/ QUOTE ]

thats a pretty fken cruel thing to say to someone

[/ QUOTE ]
Results: I shoved.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

I don't like being that guy that says not betting the turn sucks, but I think it sucks

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like being that guy that says not betting the turn sucks, but I think it sucks

[/ QUOTE ]

why not you're always that guy and you're prob right

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

Does not betting the turn suck in the first hand, too?

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Does not betting the turn suck in the first hand, too?

[/ QUOTE ]

uhh, not really, i'd just be looking to make a straight there vs a donk and bet a lot of money

you see against bad people, imo it is better to bet when you have made hands and not nine high

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

i like how you played the first hand

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

I don't really like a bluff on the river in hand 1, but if you're doing it I'd bet closer to full pot. Maybe overbet. This guy seems bad/stationy.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

agreed. but he's a donk bec he's overaggro. i figured he'd bet a weak hand on the turn in the second hand. and from playing with him more, i'm 95% sure I was right. however, he loved to slowplay big hands. so i think betting the turn is only good when he has the case K. when he has anything else, it's better to check it. and since he'll have no K a LOT more often than he'll have a K, checking is better than betting. in this case, however, he happened to have the K and therefore checked and I think all you people saying to bet are being results oriented. If I had checked and he had bet, I doubt you'd all be saying that.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

the value in the bluff in hand 1 is that you win the pot when he doesn't have anything

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

I don't think villain turns up with total air here that often.

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think all you people saying to bet are being results oriented.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL come on TWP.. don't be such a [last word deleted by flynn in the spirit of brotherly love, peace on Earth, etc.]

Re: Haven\'t played or posted in a while (trips 3/6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
agreed. but he's a donk bec he's overaggro. i figured he'd bet a weak hand on the turn in the second hand. and from playing with him more, i'm 95% sure I was right. however, he loved to slowplay big hands. so i think betting the turn is only good when he has the case K. when he has anything else, it's better to check it. and since he'll have no K a LOT more often than he'll have a K, checking is better than betting. in this case, however, he happened to have the K and therefore checked and I think all you people saying to bet are being results oriented. If I had checked and he had bet, I doubt you'd all be saying that.

[/ QUOTE ]

checked and done what? check raised?

either way i'd be saying this