Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

Villain is standard TAG, hasn't gotten out of line. Include plan for further streets and reasoning why.

If you fold or reraise preflop, chime in there too.

Full Tilt Poker, NL Hold'em Tournament, 60/120 Blinds, 9 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

UTG+1: 5,651
UTG+2: 19,089
MP1: 4,045
MP2: 6,318
CO: 16,593
BTN: 3,654
Hero (SB): 14,190
BB: 8,695
UTG: 2,928

Pre-Flop: (180) 8http://www.legopoker.com/hh/images/club.gif 7http://www.legopoker.com/hh/images/club.gif dealt to Hero (SB)
5 folds, <font color="red">CO raises to 333</font>, BTN folds, Hero calls 273, BB folds

Flop: (786) Jhttp://www.legopoker.com/hh/images/club.gif T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Ahttp://www.legopoker.com/hh/images/club.gif (2 Players)
Hero?

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

If there is no history, and you being gobbo doesnt mean anything to him then i would check call planning to lead the turn. If it does mean something I'd check call planning to check the turn.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

check raise

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

ansky. im really super meh on that idea. i think stack sizes are pretty [censored].

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

check, then either raise or call based on bet size. I'm much more likely to CR a 400 bet than 800 obv.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

That's a sweet spot flop for a standard tag + stack sizes = I don't like C/R esp if gobbo's image is what it usually is.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

gobbo checks, CO checks.

Turn: (786) 5http://www.legopoker.com/hh/images/club.gif

Hero?

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

bet plz.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

Lead turn for like 525.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

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check raise

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And lead the turn. And triple barrel the river, because no one's flatting twice on this super drawy board with a hand that can withstand a third barrel (unless something goofy happens with the board). Folding pre is OK, because the stack sizes are less than ideal for playing suited connectors OOP. I've never actually folded pre in a spot like this in my entire life, but the reasons for doing so flash through my mind from time to time.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

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check raise

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And lead the turn. And triple barrel the river, because no one's flatting twice on this super drawy board with a hand that can withstand a third barrel (unless something goofy happens with the board).

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this is horribly wrong if the opponent knows how to play poker at all.

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Folding pre is OK, because the stack sizes are less than ideal for playing suited connectors OOP. I've never actually folded pre in a spot like this in my entire life, but the reasons for doing so flash through my mind from time to time.

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i'd rarely call pf vs a good player.

gobbo no offense but if villain is at all good u prob arent turning a profit calling preflop. The only thing that makes me want to call is his small pf raise.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

can u expound on ur logic behind check-call, lead turn? ty

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

[ QUOTE ]
gobbo checks, CO checks.

Turn: (786) 5http://www.legopoker.com/hh/images/club.gif

Hero?

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gotta bet, I doubt he'll do it for you.

P.S.
Happy Bday Ansky.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

I don't check raise the flop because we are getting 3-balled too much and I don't really feel like trying to make someone fold AK.

I play this hand like the stereotypical noob on a draw. I check-call flop with the intention of donk-folding or check-folding a blank turn depending on my image (as 'gobbo' I cf)

As played obviously bet, 500-650 is nice.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

fold pf; if u wer on the btn this hand would play totally differently.

You should bring the bb along so there's some pot odds justification. He's unlikely to squeeze as the stacks are deep.

I don't like playing this hand OOP since inorder to win a big pot ur going to hav to come from behind.

The good flops are vulnerable to overpairs; domination (even same suits) and the nuts 9tj is going to be fragile.

I'd prefer 45s.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

bet 525, 4 bet a raise..on the flop

if it goes check check on the flop i lead turn

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

600 on turn. flop check is good.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

I check, planning to check/raise.

River is the 2s. I lead for 650, he makes it 2100.

You?

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

Call river, and he turns over an extremely well played KQo.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

[ QUOTE ]
I check, planning to check/raise.

River is the 2s. I lead for 650, he makes it 2100.

You?

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I call without really much consideration, hero has to be good three times in ten, no?

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

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I check, planning to check/raise.

River is the 2s. I lead for 650, he makes it 2100.

You?

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I call without really much consideration, hero has to be good three times in ten, no?

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I'm never considering folding here, it's whether or not to 3bet for value.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

I wouldn't get there like this.
I think preflop is fine, but I might three bet.
Flop I would probably check call and lead a lot of turn c/r puts you in awkard turn spots I don't think bet/call is bad either.
As played definitely bet the turn if your c/r and he three bets what do you do?
As played I think I three bet the river and get him to call with 22.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

[ QUOTE ]
I check, planning to check/raise.

River is the 2s. I lead for 650, he makes it 2100.

You?

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make it 5K and shrug fold if he shoves since you'd have lost way more than that on the hand if he played it well.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

[ QUOTE ]
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I check, planning to check/raise.

River is the 2s. I lead for 650, he makes it 2100.

You?

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I call without really much consideration, hero has to be good three times in ten, no?

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I'm never considering folding here, it's whether or not to 3bet for value.

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Oh right, I'm an idiot.

Yea, idk, although it'll happen rarely not getting to showdown here would be really sickening; not that I think he's 4b shoving much, but I don't think he's calling a 3b much either.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

youre thinking about things all wrong if you want to c/r this turn

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

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youre thinking about things all wrong if you want to c/r this turn

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can you explain why? my first thought as i read the turn was to c/r..

edit: it gives him a chance to stab at the pot w/ a hand that hasnt connected at all, and i can see a lot of villains bet-calling a c/r from us with a pair+a club.. also i dont expect them to have checked behind w/ clubs on the flop very often. i dunno, but i'm interested to haer why you think that sucks.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

i call river and a laugh when he has KQcc or when u beat 222

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

I don't get checking the turn at all.

I'd just call the river. I don't see how he can have a smaller flush nor call with anything else. There probably is value in three-betting it though because just because raise-calling with worse seems a really bad idea doesn't mean than he, I, or anybody else won't do it. You're going to have to call a shove though if you do three-bet, IMO.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

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check raise

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Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

c/r flop is good in tourneys u wont get 4 bet here very ofter. leasd the turn for like 550. call the river bet but dont raise

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

3bet this river all day, your hand is incredibly under-repped - I think the times he has KQ/horribly played sets outweigh the times he has a bigger flush by a lot ...

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

bet 450 on turn

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

3bet pf. I think Ansky is right that it will be tought to turn a profit OOP here and I never fold 78s 150bbs deep so 3bet.

On the flop I probably c/c c/r is pretty meh if he folds to the flop c/r you can prob take it away from him on a later street anyways.

On the turn as played lead villain is rarely betting let him call.

Once you get to the river I think its a raise just make it like 5k or w/e he's never folding and you have the best hand an awful lot.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

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youre thinking about things all wrong if you want to c/r this turn

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can you explain why? my first thought as i read the turn was to c/r..


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you get more value from hands by betting turn and riv than c/r turn and hoping they call riv. not many hands bet call turn and call a river bet, but alot of hands will call two bets into them.

also giving a freecard sucks

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

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3bet pf. I think Ansky is right that it will be tought to turn a profit OOP here and I never fold 78s 150bbs deep so 3bet.

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You guys are all a bunch of spew monkeys. The more BBs you have, the more position matters, and the more you should fold.

Flat call my CO raises from the SB w/87s, 150BBs deep, and I will eat you for dinner and dispose you in the toilet during the 5 min breaks.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

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[ QUOTE ]
3bet pf. I think Ansky is right that it will be tought to turn a profit OOP here and I never fold 78s 150bbs deep so 3bet.

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You guys are all a bunch of spew monkeys. The more BBs you have, the more position matters, and the more you should fold.

Flat call my CO raises from the SB w/87s, 150BBs deep, and I will eat you for dinner and dispose you in the toilet during the 5 min breaks.

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I think this is absurd and a call here is slightly -EV if that and it's ridiculously high variance, in the shortrun, just like playing deepstacks anywhere else. High variance plays in the right hands in an MTT aren't that bad because of hidden benefits of having a big stack.

If you think this is so ridiculously -EV, are you folding JTs? KQs? I'd be surprised if the EV difference was that huge.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

JTs and KQs are significantly better than 87s gobbo.

Also, I think going for a check raise on the turn is real bad.

When he checks behind on the flop, he is very likely to check behind again on the turn. His most likely hands are marginal hands w/ decent showdown value, that if they bet they are very likely to fold to a raise. If you bet and bet again however, he is very likely to try to snap you off. Check raising this turn would be ok if it set up a ~ pot sized river bet, but given how deep we are it doesn't really work.

Also, regarding preflop:

Gobbo might be able to make a profit here, there are plenty of ppl who can. My point was merely that too many ppl seem to think that 130bbs deep or whatever this is is "DEEP" stacks, when it really isn't. You do not magically have implied odds vs big hands when you call here out of the small blind. POSITION IS REALLY IMPORTANT.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

I agree with the posts saying I should bet the turn. I even told myself recently that I should stop bluffing the turn in spots like this because they always have a marginal hand that's calling one turn bet. I need to start doing it with hands I actually want to get value out of. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Betting turn and c/r'ing river would've been a much better way to c/r at some point. I might not have c/r'ed the river though, it depends.

I just called the river and he turned up A2s. I might still just call but it's quite close.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

no way you should check raise the river.

just bet it.

Re: Interesting multipart hand in FTOPS main event.
 

Gobbo,
FWIW I think two barreling turn and river here is good and betting turn and c/ring river is really sexy although I think people will look you up lighter than me because you have that image even though it isn't true. It's so rigged that he had A2s and not 22 otherwise I would have had such a sick soulread earlier.