Do online tells exist?
 

Tells are a big part of live play, but I'm finding it difficult to pick up any when I'm playing online. Does anyone have a strategy or method for this when playing online?

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

Its the eyes that give it away.

There are some subtle things like time to bet etc but these can be very misleading. The real tells are betting patterns more than anything

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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The real tells are betting patterns more than anything

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e.g. a difference : min raising AA/KK preflop but limping suited cards

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

There are timing tells for sure. Delays don't mean anything because the player could be distracted by another table or whatever. But actions that are close to instant carry information. To make up an example at random, suppose you raise at NL and get called in position. The flop comes T83 rainbow, you bet and the other player instantly calls. He is less likely to hold hands he would need to consider raising with. Hands like 98s, which are definitely calls and definitely not raises, are most likely.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

Ya, insta calls usually mean a draw.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

Betting patterns are your only solid TELLS. I have heard people talk about timing a lot but timing really never is a very good tell at all. People will insta with the best of it and insta call with a draw or a bluff, but betting patterns are very good indicators if you KNOW the villian.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

Mostly, there are timing tells and betting pattern tells online. An insta-call can also mean a weak made hand ex; top-pair no kicker. I have found that using PT/PA is great tool for picking up players' betting patterns.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

Yeh - insta calls usually mean fairly weak hands - either draws or weak made hand like 2nd pair or weak ace on an ace high flop in a raised pot- if the turn misses it's often worth 2 barrelling.

Also a slight pause from a player can often indicate strength - just because people take more time to consider their options with strong holdings rather than marginal hands - you can use this when firing CB's - if I put in a slight pause before firing in a CB at just under a round number (like $9 into a $16 pot of whatever) - the more observant opponets start to smell a big hand a fold more often - the effect can be quite noticeable. Of course a longer delay can mean 101 things but a little pause before acting can be worth looking outfor.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

When multitabling, I there are often delays in between my moves, whether long or very short... and sometimes the move is instant b/c I have another hadn to attend to

I wouldn't give much credit at all to time tells.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

I'm one of those who believe in timing tells....some people call they are BS but they work for me

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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Also a slight pause from a player can often indicate strength

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Or he might have been sipping a cup of coffee, kissing his girlfiend before she goes out, picking his nose.........

Not saying these tells don't exist just be very careful how much you read into them.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

an Insta shove or raise indicates strength too.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

It might be worth noting, when you see somebody for example insta-checking a weak hand on the river or insta-donking on the turn with a monster.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

waiting till timing out and shoving in microlimits is 95% sure strenght

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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Betting patterns are your only solid TELLS. I have heard people talk about timing a lot but timing really never is a very good tell at all. People will insta with the best of it and insta call with a draw or a bluff, but betting patterns are very good indicators if you KNOW the villian.

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QFT

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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waiting till timing out and shoving in microlimits is 95% sure piss/beer/pr0n break

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Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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waiting till timing out and shoving in microlimits is 95% sure piss/beer/pr0n break

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lol ... so many people saying timing is a TELL and I think this is absolutely wrong. There are as suggested above so many other reasons for timing... especially with multi-tablers. Betting patterns are the only REAL online tells you will get. Focus on betting patterns and not timing.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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waiting till timing out and shoving in microlimits is 95% sure strenght

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I tend to do this when im bluff-shoving the river sometimes, just to exploit that conception... can't tell you with any certainty if it puts ppl off my "scent".

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

i suppose the actions leading upto the shove are what qualifies this move as credible or not. I know that sometimes you can snap call a timed down shove, and be fairly certain its a bluff..... ok, ive confused myself now. wtf.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

Timing is definitely a tell. I use it plenty and I read an interview with durrr where he said he gets a ton of information from timing. The time-down-to-one-second tell is the only reliable delay tell, though. The rest are all instant action.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

yeh..durr...aba..and green plastic must be wrong then...because they all believe in timing tells...

Of course betting patterns are critical to getting reads online - but the question was 'do timing tells exist?'

The correct answer is 'yes', especially when you observe an opponent for a while and note use of things like check/fold boxes or insta-calls with weak made hands or draws.

They are not as reliable or useful in general as going off betting patterns and you can be a winning player and entirely ignore them, but they DO exist..

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

Timing tells do exist online, but there are players who wait till they've almost timed out before they make a move. I haven't quite figured whether that's to piss you off or because they don't want to give any tells away.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

a checkbox call pf right after raise usually is a very strong hand ime.

doesn't happen very often, though.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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a checkbox call pf right after raise usually is a very strong hand ime.

doesn't happen very often, though.

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I would think a checkbox call PF is a sure sign of weakness. AA/KK need to consider how many are in the hand in order to size bets. An insta-call usually is a hand that is willing to play for the big blind or first raise but no more.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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Yeh - insta calls usually mean fairly weak hands - either draws or weak made hand like 2nd pair or weak ace on an ace high flop in a raised pot- if the turn misses it's often worth 2 barrelling.

Also a slight pause from a player can often indicate strength - just because people take more time to consider their options with strong holdings rather than marginal hands - you can use this when firing CB's - if I put in a slight pause before firing in a CB at just under a round number (like $9 into a $16 pot of whatever) - the more observant opponets start to smell a big hand a fold more often - the effect can be quite noticeable. Of course a longer delay can mean 101 things but a little pause before acting can be worth looking outfor.

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I agree with the above paragraph completely.

When I pause, it's usually to figure out how much to raise, or less often, thinking about pot/implied odds on a close call.

Either way, I have either a made hand or a decent draw, and I haven't figured out how to take the time I need without giving off a tell.

It's not a big problem in micro tournaments, becasue of the quality of the opposition, and the fact that they don't have a lot of time to get a read on me.

Still, it's a tell that I need to work on eliminating. I think it's just a matter of getting faster with the math, and seeing situations often enough that it gets more automatic.

One thing I have started doing is just waiting an extra 5 or 10 seconds every to act every so often, so as not make it so certain that I'm pondering a good hand.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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an Insta shove or raise indicates strength too.

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Just the opposite but when I was starting out online and bluffing/semibluffing I found myself insta shoving alot and thinking before pushing my big hands.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

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I would think a checkbox call PF is a sure sign of weakness.
AA/KK need to consider how many are in the hand in order to size bets. An insta-call usually is a hand that is willing to play for the big blind or first raise but no more.

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That's what i thought, but after reading a similiar thread in an other forum i startet to flag those hands (checkbox-call preflop one or two positions after a raise) and found that more than 90% of them were group 1 hands.

btw i differed (as best as possible) between checkbox calls and "manual" insta-calls an.

Re: Do online tells exist?
 

In a raised pot, if it's checked instantly to the original raiser, does that mean they all missed?