Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Okay, as I said in my other thread, I will post today's results for critisism. I will post any significant hands here for flameing/glorified praise. I will not post boring hands such as me getting KK and everyone folding (which has already happened once).

Certainly no compaints about the first hand! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

HAND #1

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 9 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $18.50
BB: $35.90
UTG: $53.85
UTG+1: $48.60
MP1: $49.05
MP2: $18.45
MP3: $10.00
Dumb Fish x (CO): $11.00
BTN: $100.95

MP3 posts $0.50
Dumb Fish x posts $0.50
Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (9 Players)
4 folds, MP3 checks, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $3.00</font>, 2 folds, BB calls $2.50, MP3 calls $2.50

Flop: ($9.25) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">MP3 bets $0.50</font>, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises all-in to $8.00</font>, BB calls $8.00, MP3 calls all-in for $6.50

Turn: ($32.25) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 Players - 2 All-In)

River: ($32.25) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 Players - 2 All-In)

Pot Size: $32.25 ($1.60 Rake)

MP3 had A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (a pair of Aces) and LOST (-$10.00)
BB had 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (a pair of Aces) and LOST (-$11.00)
Dumb Fish x had J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (two pair, Aces and Jacks) and WON (+$19.65)

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Can you get away from either MP3 or BB's hand post-flop when playing against an opponent with so little chips?

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Hand #2

I think I got a bit excited here and could have wound up in very big trouble. I think I misplayed this hand badly. Critisism very welcome. Keep in mind, the play may look silly but I'm trying to strictly abide by Ed's strategy here.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 7 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $18.95
BB: $20.10
UTG: $69.65
UTG+1: $223.90
MP: $32.45
CO: $52.40
Dumb Fish x (BTN): $10.85

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (7 Players)
4 folds, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $3.00</font>, SB calls $2.75, BB calls $2.50

Flop: ($9) A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x bets all-in for $7.85</font>, 2 folds
Uncalled bet of $7.85 returned to Dumb Fish x

Pot Size: $9.00 ($0.45 Rake)

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Can you get away from either MP3 or BB's hand post-flop when playing against an opponent with so little chips?

[/ QUOTE ]

I suppose that's the whole point! (?)

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Can you get away from either MP3 or BB's hand post-flop when playing against an opponent with so little chips?

[/ QUOTE ]

He's playing the Short Stack Strategy. Correctly, this time.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

HAND #3

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $62.20
BB: $49.45
Dumb Fish x (UTG): $10.00
MP: $13.80
CO: $74.05
BTN: $18.95

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 Players)
<font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $3.50</font>, MP calls $3.50, 4 folds

Flop: ($7.75) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Dumb Fish x bets all-in for $6.50</font>, MP folds
Uncalled bet of $6.50 returned to Dumb Fish x

Pot Size: $7.75 ($0.35 Rake)

Followed directly by HAND #4 (same table)...I raised a tad more than normal here because I thought I'd get a call or two since I raised preflop last hand too.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 8 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $48.95
BB: $50.00
Dumb Fish x (UTG): $13.90
UTG+1: $20.00
MP1: $10.30
MP2: $74.05
CO: $18.95
BTN: $61.95

UTG+1 posts $0.50
Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (8 Players)
<font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $4.00</font>, 7 folds
Uncalled bet of $3.50 returned to Dumb Fish x

Pot Size: $1.75

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

You played both hands perfectly. Including the second one.

Hand 2 you had position and you had initiative as the pre-flop raiser. Your opponents showed weakness by checking. You bet, and they had no reason to doubt the pocket ace you were representing.

Your flop aggression is winning you pots, and your big pre-flop raises are making sure the pots you win have some chips in them.

You'll still get stacked occasionally, but use proper BR management and you should be able to grind out a consistent win rate.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

HAND #5

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 9 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

Dumb Fish x (SB): $12.35
BB: $21.50
UTG: $23.70
UTG+1: $82.35
MP1: $17.20
MP2: $64.65
MP3: $47.20
CO: $46.40
BTN: $49.25

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (9 Players)
UTG calls $0.50, 6 folds, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $3.50</font>, BB folds, UTG calls $3.00

Flop: ($7.50) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Dumb Fish x bets all-in for $8.85</font>, UTG folds
Uncalled bet of $8.85 returned to Dumb Fish x

Pot Size: $7.50 ($0.35 Rake)

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

You seem to have got the hang of it.

Careful though. Your last thread kind of sounded like a whine. This one is sounding like a brag.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Okay things are going down hill now...

The next 3 hands I have lost. (...it begins). Critisism wanted. Note that with the marginal hands I was the BB and got a free flop and flopped two pair both times to get beaten. These are the things that have made me a losing player with this strategy. This is how it usually goes...

Hand #6 I think I played poorly. Hands #7 and #8 demonstrate why I am seemingly always ending up losing in the long run.

HAND #6 - <font color="blue">LOSS</font> - Critisism Welcome.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 9 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $13.70
BB: $82.35
UTG: $16.70
UTG+1: $64.65
MP1: $47.20
MP2: $46.40
MP3: $55.85
Dumb Fish x (CO): $16.00
BTN: $20.75

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (9 Players)
3 folds, MP2 calls $0.50, MP3 folds, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $3.50</font>, BTN folds, SB calls $3.25, 2 folds

Flop: ($8) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets all-in for $10.20</font>, Dumb Fish x calls $10.20

Turn: ($28.40) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

River: ($28.40) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

Pot Size: $28.40 ($1.40 Rake)

SB had 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (two pair, Aces and Sixes) and WON (+$13.30)
Dumb Fish x had 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (two pair, Eights and Sixes) and LOST (-$13.70)


HAND #7 - <font color="blue">LOSS</font>

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 9 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $47.60
BB: $51.05
UTG: $23.70
UTG+1: $56.95
MP1: $44.00
MP2: $32.90
MP3: $31.95
Dumb Fish x (CO): $8.75
BTN: $42.70

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (9 Players)
UTG calls $0.50, 2 folds, MP2 calls $0.50, MP3 folds, Dumb Fish x calls $0.50, BTN calls $0.50, SB calls $0.25, BB checks

Flop: ($3) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 Players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP2 checks, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x bets all-in for $8.25</font>, 4 folds, MP2 calls $8.25

Turn: ($19.50) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

River: ($19.50) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

Pot Size: $19.50 ($0.95 Rake)

MP2 had A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (three of a kind, Queens) and WON (+$9.80)
Dumb Fish x had K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (two pair, Kings and Queens) and LOST (-$8.75)


HAND #8 - <font color="blue">LOSS</font>

Well - I seem to have lost Hand #8 somewhere! But I lost about $13 in similar fashion to HAND 7.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

HAND #9

Okay I've very iffy about Ed's SS strategy when I'm the BB and have just called a marginal hand like this example. I won, but did I play it right? Critisism more than welcome.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 8 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $53.60
Dumb Fish x (BB): $12.30
UTG: $31.85
UTG+1: $11.00
MP1: $77.10
MP2: $21.40
CO: $61.40
BTN: $27.85

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (8 Players)
UTG folds, <font color="red">UTG+1 raises to $1.50</font>, 5 folds, Dumb Fish x calls $1.00

Flop: ($3.25) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Dumb Fish x bets $4.00</font>, UTG+1 calls $4.00

Turn: ($11.25) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Dumb Fish x bets all-in for $6.80</font>, UTG+1 calls all-in for $5.50
Uncalled bet of $1.30 returned to Dumb Fish x

River: ($22.25) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players - 2 All-In)

Pot Size: $22.25 ($1.10 Rake)

UTG+1 had K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (a pair of Kings) and LOST (-$11.00)
Dumb Fish x had 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (two pair, Aces and Nines) and WON (+$10.15)

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

HAND #10 - <font color="blue">LOSS</font>

Another loss. Another hand in the BB where I didn't really know what to do. Help please. Edit: just realised I was UTG. No idea what I was thinking here. Seriously. Shoot me.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $26.15
BB: $21.15
Dumb Fish x (UTG): $10.20
MP: $54.00
CO: $19.95
BTN: $50.00

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 Players)
Dumb Fish x calls $0.50, MP calls $0.50, CO folds, BTN calls $0.50, SB calls $0.25, BB checks

Flop: ($2.50) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $1.50</font>, BB folds, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $5.50</font>, MP calls $5.50, BTN folds, SB calls $4.00

Turn: ($19) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets all-in for $20.15</font>, Dumb Fish x calls all-in for $4.20, MP calls $20.15

River: ($63.50) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 Players - 2 All-In)

Pot Size: $63.50 ($3 Rake)

MP had 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (a full house, Nines full of Queens) and WON (+$34.35)
SB had Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (three of a kind, Queens) and LOST (-$26.15)
Dumb Fish x had Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (three of a kind, Queens) and LOST (-$10.20)

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

HAND #11 - WIN

Here I took a gamble and limped in with pocket 5's. Yes, I realise I am not supposed to do this. However, consider I have been raising then going-all in on this table a few times and people are starting to auto-fold.

I would still like critisism.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 8 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $93.15
BB: $71.45
UTG: $19.35
UTG+1: $72.60
Dumb Fish x (MP1): $11.65
MP2: $70.10
CO: $19.35
BTN: $16.50

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (8 Players)
UTG calls $0.50, UTG+1 folds, Dumb Fish x calls $0.50, 4 folds, BB checks

Flop: ($1.75) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">UTG bets $1.75</font>, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $5.50</font>, BB folds, UTG calls $3.75

Turn: ($12.75) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
UTG checks, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x bets all-in for $5.65</font>, UTG calls $5.65

River: ($24.05) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

Pot Size: $24.05 ($1.20 Rake)

UTG had 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (a pair of Queens) and LOST (-$11.65)
Dumb Fish x had 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (three of a kind, Fives) and WON (+$11.20)

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

HAND #12 - WON

Okay, so due to the lucky win in hand #11, I'm not short stacked at this table anymore. In the previous wins I've just been getting up and moving to a new table, but I thought I'd stick around a bit.

Here I am playing a "conventional" round of poker. Advice?

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 8 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $60.10
BB: $67.35
UTG: $18.85
UTG+1: $16.00
MP1: $71.95
MP2: $23.05
CO: $71.85
Dumb Fish x (BTN): $22.10

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (8 Players)
3 folds, MP2 calls $0.50, CO folds, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $3.50</font>, 2 folds, MP2 calls $3.00

Flop: ($7.75) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
MP2 checks, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x bets $12.00</font>, MP2 folds
Uncalled bet of $12.00 returned to Dumb Fish x

Pot Size: $7.75 ($0.35 Rake)

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

END OF SESSION

Results: Wow! I've broken my losing streak. Maybe the extra-strictness that posting all my (novice) playing put on my concience to "play right" really did pay off! Woohoo.

$23 up!

I hope to find lots of advice and critisism here when I get back! (pretty please!)

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

I think I would've pushed here just because it'd seem "standard" for you. Suddenly betting $12 seems REALLY suspicious. I think if you shoved, you'd be more likely to get called. Glad to hear today's going better! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Okay things are going down hill now...

The next 3 hands I have lost. (...it begins). Critisism wanted. Note that with the marginal hands I was the BB and got a free flop and flopped two pair both times to get beaten. These are the things that have made me a losing player with this strategy. This is how it usually goes...

Hand #6 I think I played poorly. Hands #7 and #8 demonstrate why I am seemingly always ending up losing in the long run.

HAND #6 - <font color="blue">LOSS</font> - Critisism Welcome.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 9 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $13.70
BB: $82.35
UTG: $16.70
UTG+1: $64.65
MP1: $47.20
MP2: $46.40
MP3: $55.85
Dumb Fish x (CO): $16.00
BTN: $20.75

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (9 Players)
3 folds, MP2 calls $0.50, MP3 folds, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x raises to $3.50</font>, BTN folds, SB calls $3.25, 2 folds

Flop: ($8) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets all-in for $10.20</font>, Dumb Fish x calls $10.20

Turn: ($28.40) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

River: ($28.40) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

Pot Size: $28.40 ($1.40 Rake)

SB had 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (two pair, Aces and Sixes) and WON (+$13.30)
Dumb Fish x had 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (two pair, Eights and Sixes) and LOST (-$13.70)


HAND #7 - <font color="blue">LOSS</font>




I'm not too familiar with the ss strategy as i mainly play limit, but i think the strategy is to be the first to push...rather than calling all-ins. This board is too dangerous to call. if your opponent is holding a 6 or an A you have two outs. even if he doesnt, he still has plenty of outs if the A or any runner runner card higher than an 8 pairs. (as long as he has one card higher than an 8 as a kicker) because the board can counterfit you easily on this board your probably better off folding!.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

HAND 6 - Meh. [censored] happens.

HAND 7 - What are you doing calling pre-flop? Either raise big or fold. You want to see the flop with both position and the initiative as the pre-flop raiser.

Once the flop came, you had him crushed when the money went in. He was drawing to 5 outs, only a 20% chance for him to suck out. He did. [censored] happens. You still made a mistake pre-flop, but SB would have called you even if you had raised.

HAND 9 - "Okay I've very iffy about Ed's SS strategy when I'm the BB..." That's because you need to be folding the BB most of the time, and that feels "weak." Well, it is weak, or rather it would be if you were playing deep stacks or if you were playing 6-max. But your not.

As far as how the hand played out, that call would be 100% wrong if you were playing deep stacks. Since you're short, in fact you're both short[/i], I'm gonna say that pre-flop the play is either shove or fold. I think it's 50/50 either way.

Remember, it's not if you win the pot or lose the pot, it's if you played correctly. Calling is almost always a mistake, raising is wrong much less often, folding is sometimes wrong, but when you're OOP usually not.

Hand 10 - Calling pre-flop is usually a mistake. Calling UTG when you have a short stack is always a mistake. Playing these cards in this position is definitely a mistake.

Pre-flop mistakes are expensive. When you're playing the SSS, they will almost always cost you your buy-in. Stick to the starting hands guidelines you posted in your first thread.

Hand 11 - So the players were auto-folding to your pre-flop raises, eh? And this made you sad for some reason?

When you're playing the short stack, you don't have the implied odds to play speculative hands. Period. Calling pre-flop in this spot is a mistake. It doesn't matter that you won the hand. Luck can fool you into thinking that your mistake was, in fact, a good play. Don't let luck fool you. Stick to hands that can make you top pair on the flop, not hands that will flop overcards eight times in nine.

Hand 12 - "due to the lucky win in hand #11, I'm not short stacked at this table anymore."

So take the money and run. Type "Meep! Meep! Roadrunner!" in the chat window and find another table.

The SSS doesn't work when your stack approaches medium deep. Remember how I keep saying NL is all about implied odds? When you play short, you are denying your opponents correct implied odds to play against you. Opponents have to fold to your bets and raises, because they don't stand to make enough money off you when they hit their hand to pay for all the times they miss.

BTW, this is the last time I (or anyone else) is going to respond to a whole list of hands. The rule of thumb on the strategy forums is to keep it at three hands a day or less.

You can move over to the FR NL forum whenever you like. They'll make fun of you mercilessly for playing the SSS. That's because the SSS is +EV, easy to play and nearly unexploitable.

When they do (not if, when) tell them to post strategy or go screw.

Deep stack NL players hate short stackers. I don't hate short stackers myself. I just hate the good ones. But they are few and far between because, very much unlike yourself, most of them never bother to join a poker forum and find out if they're playing it correctly. Most of them limp pre-flop, play hit-to-win poker and go broke. Then they curse Ed Miller for giving bad advice.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

HAND #7 - <font color="blue">LOSS</font>

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 9 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $47.60
BB: $51.05
UTG: $23.70
UTG+1: $56.95
MP1: $44.00
MP2: $32.90
MP3: $31.95
Dumb Fish x (CO): $8.75
BTN: $42.70

Preflop: Dumb Fish x is dealt K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (9 Players)
UTG calls $0.50, 2 folds, MP2 calls $0.50, MP3 folds, Dumb Fish x calls $0.50, BTN calls $0.50, SB calls $0.25, BB checks

Flop: ($3) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 Players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP2 checks, <font color="red">Dumb Fish x bets all-in for $8.25</font>, 4 folds, MP2 calls $8.25

Turn: ($19.50) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

River: ($19.50) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

Pot Size: $19.50 ($0.95 Rake)

MP2 had A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (three of a kind, Queens) and WON (+$9.80)
Dumb Fish x had K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (two pair, Kings and Queens) and LOST (-$8.75)


Limping pre-flop? with a short stack?

You should have raised preflop, and shoved on the flop. It wouldnt have made any difference to the result in this case (unless he were to fold) because of the second Q but you got the money in while you were ahead and put him under maximum pressure.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Hand 7, 9, 10 and 11 are awful. Either follow Ed Miller's shortstacking strategy or use your own random one.

But dont come on and criticize his stratgy when you arent following it as he tells you.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Teddie,

I've obviously got up your nose a bit here. But I want to make two things very clear:

1. I try to make it clear than, and I quote, "I must be misunderstanding something". I'm not blaming Ed Miller. Although I concede in my frustration it may have sounded like that, I went to great lengths to make it understood that I thought the fault probably lay with me.

2. I'm asking for advice here. Not trying to annoy people. You haven't offered much advice, which is fine, but don't come on here and get mad.

There are reasons I played the hands you critisise as awful. Please enlighten me to the error of my ways. (seriously).

And for anyone else who is wants to show a beginner the error of his ways, here is my thinking....

Hand 11: I'm not convinced limping with a small pair on occassion is bad play, even for short stacks. Consider that people know exactly what I'm doing - raising preflop with a strong hand, then going all in on the flop. Everyone knew that's what I was doing, so why not mix it up every now and then so I'm not totally transparent? My logic is limping with a pocket pair is a little change to the standard play I have been employing for the last hour and will keep them guessing a tad. If someone raises preflop (unlikely on these tables, which is another consideration), or I don't hit a hand on the flop (likely) then I fold (which is another thing people are not accustomed to seeing me do on the flop). So all in all, it costs me 50c to be - at-least a little bit - unpredictable. And if I hit a hand, as in this example, I have a strong hand worth betting with. Yes, this is my little "variation" on Ed's strategy, but I am unconvinced it's a bad one. If you want to show me otherwise, I'm all ears. But just saying "awful, that's not what Ed said to do" isn't convincing me.

Hand 10: Yes, awful. A mistake, but I'm a novice. Learning the ropes. Throw me a bone.

Hand 9: Well give me a hint then! I really don't know what to do in the big blind. Are you and phydaux saying I should fold when I can see the flop for free? Seriously?

Hand 7: MY logic here is really a mix between Hand 9 and Hand 11. I have a marginal hand, but not too bad. And I can probably see the flop for free. My goal here is to be a teeny bit unpredictable instead of constant raise-flop-all-in. With this hand I am planning to fold the flop, unless the flop hits me and looks harmless enough, which would be a very rare occurance. So I'm just trying to be a little unpredictable at the price of a 50c BB. But in the rare place where the flop actually hits me really well, why not put my money in there while I am almost certainly holding the strongest hand?

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
BTW, this is the last time I (or anyone else) is going to respond to a whole list of hands. The rule of thumb on the strategy forums is to keep it at three hands a day or less.

[/ QUOTE ]

Whoops sorry mate. I had no idea.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

You may not be blaming Ed Miller, but as your thread title seems to suggest you are following his strategy, it is very easy for readers to assume otherwise...and then when you describe your hands and are not following his strategy in many of them.....

Phydaux's reply pretty much says everything you need to know about those hands, and i would second his suggestion that you switch to the other forum as they will be able to give more detailed help.

Your "variation" seems to go against the principles of Short stack play in general. If you limp with poor hands or are caught out of position by a late raise with a hand that isnt particularly strong you are going to have to fold or risk bleeding off lots of chips on the flop. Remember, the aim of the strategy is to put the money into the pot while you are a strong favourite against your opponents range...you dont want to be dominated.

It is to keep things simple...if you want to bluff or trap opponents then you play with a big stack..short stacking is about being predictable...(playing within a smaller range of hands than other people are playing).

Perhaps you need to read up on implied odds..in fact
i suggest you read up on Millers strategy again, as it should explain some of the things you are questioning.

As for hand 11 - what are the odds of you hitting a set or better on the flop?

With a short stack, on the few occasions you hit, you risk not making enough from other players to make it +EV.

check fold the flop if it doesnt help.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Thanks for you help.

What does +EV mean?

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

EV stands for Expected Value.

Some plays have a negative expected value. Craps &amp; Roulette are all -EV. The trick with poker is to recognize situations where you have positive expected value and then bet to maximize your earn.

You don't need to "mix it up" when your short stacking. You mix things up so that your opponent can't exploit your play. One of the features of a proper SSS is that it is nearly unexploitable. Yes, you opponent knows exactly what you're going to do when you enter a pot with a big raise pre-flop. His problem is that, because of your short stack, he doesn't have any implied odds. His only options are either to have AA/KK pre-flop, or to fold.

And because your short stack doesn't offer your opponents any implied odds, it doesn't offer you correct implied odds to play speculative hands, either.

Think about it this way - A small pair will flop a set one time in eight. Say you limp with a small pair in MP, the button raises 3bb and you call. You miss your set on the flop and have to fold. This happens eight times. Then you call a bet with a small pocket pair, make your set and double through.

It has cost you 24bb to try and hit a set the eight times you missed. And the time you hit, you double your stack. But you're a shortie! Your stack is only 20-30 bb to begin with! So by playing a small pair for a raise pre-flop, your best hope is to break even. And if you hit your set, shove and your opponent folds, then you lose money.

And if you limp with your small pairs and fold to a pre-flop raise them you're just pissing your money away by limping.

Believe me, I totally sympathize with you wanting to play real poker. The SSS is boring. Unless you're playing eight tables, it's really boring. So don't play Shove. Buy in deep and play poker. It's much more complicated, but it's also much more fun. You'll learn more. For a while you'll lose more, too, because real NL poker is hard.

But if you buy in short, stick to the SSS as outlined.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
You can move over to the FR NL forum whenever you like. They'll make fun of you mercilessly for playing the SSS.

[/ QUOTE ]

For precisely that reason, I don't think trying to discuss SSS on any of the NL forums is useful, unless things have changed greatly while I was gone.

Note the false assumption here: playing deep stacks is advantageous if you're a better deep stack NL player than most of your opponents. Why on earth would you assume that about a beginner, even a beginner who posts on a pretty good site? Because there used to be even worse players in all the online games, once upon a time?

Then again, some people will earnestly argue that you should start out playing deep stacks so as to learn every aspect of NLHE all at once. I'd love for my opponents to learn NLHE this way, since I'm sitting in their game and can be well-compensated for giving out lessons.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

While I'm getting owned today. 15m down and I'm down $25 playing strict SSS. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Thanks for the post there phydaux. My rational for playing SS is just as an introduction to "winning poker". Then I'll gradually expand, playing bigger stacks and more complicated strategies.

Half way through Harrington Vol 2 now - so picking up a clue or two.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

If you're still playing NL50, a SS is $10. You're down 2.5 short buyins (or 0.5 full buyins, which is what most people mean when they say to prepare for swings of 10-20 buyins). That's frustrating but nowhere near the worst downswing you'll experience in your poker career.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Hand 11: As people have said, you cant set mine with the SSS. EV is explain in Small stakes holdem book.

Hand 10: Fair enough a mistake, but you made the same mistakes yesterday and said you were busy with something else and it's the only time you have ever done it. I get the feeling you probaly get bored having to follow a strict SSS and lose your discipline and then you lose your stake.

Hand 9: Flop for free? What? You called a EP raise with A9s, thats complete garbage. You will never be profitable if you continue to call raises with dominated hands.

Hand 7: Again, where are you getting the idea your seeing a free flop?! You are calling $0.50 to see a flop, thats not free. The only time you see a free flop is when your are the big blind and its limped to you and you can check it.


I havent read Ed Miller's SSS but from what i get from your opinion's on how you played the hands you dont see to understand it yourself. I'd recommend re-reading it a few times until you do.

You also dont seem to have the discipline too play it it correctly. It seems you get bored, see a pretty hand and go "oh sure i might limp it, its only $0.50".

The way your playing it at the momemnt you will never be profitable playing with a SS, so i'd recommend dropping down to micro limits depositing enough so you are full rolled for the smallest limit and grind it up from thre with a full stack.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

ugh, i cant stand short stack players.

its not really playing poker.. its playing cook-book poker.
wait for high % hand, raise.. push flop...
hit-n-run. I could teach my cat to do that.

while the SS player occupys a seat with the mini buy-in, screwin up the action, someone with some real money cant get in.

you pull that nonsense in the real world and someone would gut you and leave you lying in the sewer.

Do yourself a favor. Learn to play poker.
Drop a level or 2 or 3 until you are comfortable, buy-in for the Max, and play.

The hit-and-run kiddie game isin't teaching you ANYTHING useful.

-hyp

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
you pull that nonsense in the real world and someone would gut you and leave you lying in the sewer.

[/ QUOTE ]

Um, no, I've done it in public cardrooms all the time. The cardroom publishes a minimum buy-in on the rake card. If they really meant the minimum were $200 for a $1-2 game instead of $50, they'd say $200. I've never had anyone gut me and leave me lying in the sewer, and the prospect doesn't keep me awake at night. I have, however, had people call short-stack reraises with A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] or JTo. Guess that'll show me.

However, given your anger management deficiencies, I certainly hope you don't play in public cardrooms. Someone might buy in for the wrong amount, and this post might end up as evidence at your trial. Along with all the surveillance videos, of course.

[ QUOTE ]

(Edited for truth)

Do me a favor. Learn to play poker in a way where I have an edge against you. Drop a level or 2 or 3 until you are comfortable, buy-in for the Max, and play, then come back and donk off all your chips to me because you're playing a deep stack game you don't play well.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, that's very benevolent advice of you, but neither the beginner nor the cardroom is primarily concerned with maximizing the number of the beginner's chips that end up in your stack.

[ QUOTE ]
The hit-and-run kiddie game isin't teaching you ANYTHING useful. (And yet I feel compelled to bitch and moan about it, probably because I don't know how to beat it.)

[/ QUOTE ]

Run along to uSNL or somewhere now. Time to cry, moan, and wail about those mean beginners who won't just walk up and present you with a wad of Benjamin Franklins before sitting down.

This forum is for beginners, and I'm going to continue flaming people who post such self-serving, beginner-hostile drivel.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

going south with money is not allowed in public card rooms.

You cannot buy in for $50, double up, leave then come right back and play for $50.
There is usually a time penalty before they will seat you at another table.

At a private card room, you will get seriously hurt. Illegal gambling institutions are not filled with the nicest people. But there is a code. Ive never felt threatened walking out of a private card room with a pocket full of cash, because even though alot of the people are criminals, they respect a code of conduct. and i NEVER hit and run.
its just bad form.

This is hardly hostile to beginners, its just the truth.
Im trying to give the kid good advice. you dont play limit to learn how to play NL, and you dont learn SSS if u want to play deep stacks.

Its only gonna take longer to learn to play for real. Hes gonna be armed with some preflop ideas, but lost postflop.
how is that helping him?

From the sheer amount of his posts, it seems he wants to play for real.
If i took it the wrong way, then i sorry, go back to your SSS game.

My advice was to drop levels until he feels comfortable playing. and obviously move up when hes comfortable moving up. Losing money and taking hits is the way it works. If your afriad to take a hit then dont move up.

My big issue with people playing micro-short stacks is its an exploit. Its terribly "cheap" (please excuse the pun).
nothing more than a novelty.

Its almost like shooting angles in live poker.. sure, you can do it.. but its a real douchbag move. I dont think douchebaggery should be encouraged, lord knows theres already enough of it online.

I just feel this method is steering the person down the wrong path if they want to learn to play with deep stacks.

-hyp

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
going south with money is not allowed in public card rooms.

You cannot buy in for $50, double up, leave then come right back and play for $50.
There is usually a time penalty before they will seat you at another table.

At a private card room, you will get seriously hurt. Illegal gambling institutions are not filled with the nicest people. But there is a code. Ive never felt threatened walking out of a private card room with a pocket full of cash, because even though alot of the people are criminals, they respect a code of conduct. and i NEVER hit and run.
its just bad form.


[/ QUOTE ]


Quality post. Criminals respect a code of conduct now?! lol, didnt know that. It's a shame they arent so respectful with the law.


Dont play in illegal cardrooms full of scum if they are likely to "gut you" for breaking there gay little code of conduct.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Yes, Criminals and gamblers usually do have an unwritten code of conduct. Its called being civil and respecting fellow players.

I know im sounding like a fuddy-duddy.. but the new breed of internet players seem to lack that respect of the game.

-hyp

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
You cannot buy in for $50, double up, leave then come right back and play for $50.
There is usually a time penalty before they will seat you at another table.

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course, but what does this have to do with anything? No one's suggesting ratholing. Miller himself suggests continuing to play your now-deeper stack after doubling up, to gain experience. But if you misplay it and donk it off, at least you're donking off profit. Alternatively, cash out, go to a game you're more comfortable playing in, wait the hour, or what have you.

Perhaps your advice is intended to be helpful. But i'm always pretty suspicious of advice that ends up helping the sharks as the beginner loses money on "lessons". Whether short-stacking is a flaw in NLHE is a fair question, one that Miller touches on very briefly in GSIHE, but sort of irrelevant to the beginner. To the cardroom, deep stacked NLHE is a flawed game because the fish bust out too fast and there's not enough variance to keep the game stable.

To an extent I agree with the endorsement of moving down stakes and learning deeper stacks -- once the beginner knows basic preflop theory, at least. But that's mostly an online option. If you prefer to play B&amp;M but aren't bankrolled for the lowest game on the board then you can either grind out some bankroll, practicing good preflop play as you go, or give up and go play online. Personally as boring as SSNL is, I'd much rather play it than grind online (although I am grinding online because I live 4 hours from the nearest poker room).

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

well, if the SS decides to stay around and play with the profits then they are ok in my book. From the content of some of the posts, it seemed like the norm was to win a pot then split.

If Miller suggest staying around to gain expeirence, then i can see the benifit for a very new player.
Otherwise the only lesson i can see being learned by SSS is preflop selection. If you can even call it a "lesson". One can commit beginner preflop selections to memory in 1 or 2 sessions.
After that, the player is left in the dark. With no Post-flop skills, they are going to get destroyed.

The SSS may instill a false sense of security. The new player will win some money playing supershort, then when playing deep, or even medium they find themselves making very costly mistakes on the turn and river.

I never had the problem with having to learn NL as a total beginner in a card room. When i started playing they didnt really spread NL. Mostly 7-Stud and Limit (Jersey loves its 7-stud) These games were a bit more beginner friendly, especially low-limit stud.

Now NL is where the $$ is, so i followed... to make the swtich i split my buy-ins into 2 or 3 smaller buy-ins rather than 1 large chunk. Smaller buy-ins are definatly good for people who arent made of money. Its the micro-buy ins that i think are dangerous. Only having enough for the flop before one is commited doesnt help you learn post-flop play.

Im not hating on online either... I live less than 2hrs away from AC, and there are TONS of illegal card rooms coming and going, yet i still grind it out online cuz i can do it anytime, anywhere. Not to mention i can sharpen my game by seeing countless hands at a fraction of the price. Online poker IS one of the greatist things to happen to the game, but with it comes a price.

(oh, and if you live pretty far from a legal poker room... maybe you should start an "underground" one in your area [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img], or search one out... the ones around here run a tight ship. Free (good) food, all different stakes, rake isint bad, and the players are usually looser than in casinos.
Of course you always run the risk of getting Gutted if you go south [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] )

-hyp

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

Anyone got a link describing Ed Millers system? Curious to see what its all about. Found one post about it but it was pretty vague.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

I've intentionally tried to keep the details off the wiki to avoid eroding the value of GSIHE. Of course there's still a lot of value in the text telling you how to use it (not to mention, it builds on concepts explained in the limit section) but I still didn't want 2+2 accusing the wiki of undermining demand for their books.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Can you get away from either MP3 or BB's hand post-flop when playing against an opponent with so little chips?

[/ QUOTE ]

I suppose that's the whole point! (?)

[/ QUOTE ]

YES! You get it!

---

And I can't find the relevant portion of the thread so I'll glom it on here. The question came up whether a typical 2+2er really understands NLHE enough that they should be playing deep stacks, or whether digging into deep stacks is the best way to start learning.

Well, not to pick on any individual (because I've certainly made similar misplays), but this hand history is typical of what we do before we learn to adapt our play to effective stack sizes. We call reraises with QJs, hoping to get lucky, and forgetting to account for the fact that the reraiser has already stuck in 15% of her stack or more.

But if you play 20 BBL short stacks, you're only playing one stack size (yours). Then as you learn to do it properly, you learn a new size, somewhere around 40 BBL. Now you're playing mostly 40 BBL effective stacks with a few shorter ones. As you get better at adapting to those different stacks, you add in some 75 and 100 and even 150 and 200 BBL stacks when you get them.

Or, on the other hand, you can start out buying in 100 BBL deep to impress the cool kids on uSNL -- no kiddie poker for you, no sir -- and make poor plays because you keep forgetting that your effective stack size varies from 0.5 BBL to 100 BBL or more.

Start out playing scales, keep practicing, and maybe one day you'll work your way to the Rach 3. Or start out picking out the Rach 3 note by note because "baby piano" just isn't for you. Your choice.

Re: Ed Miller\'s Short Hand Strategy on Full Tilt...
 

[ QUOTE ]
If Miller suggest staying around to gain expeirence, then i can see the benifit for a very new player.
Otherwise the only lesson i can see being learned by SSS is preflop selection. If you can even call it a "lesson". One can commit beginner preflop selections to memory in 1 or 2 sessions.
After that, the player is left in the dark. With no Post-flop skills, they are going to get destroyed.

[/ QUOTE ]
Hyp, you've reached the essence of the SSS. Beginners don't have post-flop skills. That's why removing that aspect from the game helps them. And while they're sitting at the table folding their trash (and speculative hands that you might want to play) they get to see the rest of you play post-flop...and maybe begin the learning process. So why don't you let novices play in a way that saves some bankroll so that they don't learn to despise the game?

Short stackers aren't the players who should steam you. Rat-holers are. Nobody likes them.