AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

Villain is a normal meowchow TAG regular. (Actually, I just found out it's 2p2'er deaders. So, somewhere between meowchow and teh awesome.)

Full Tilt Poker, $1/$2 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

CO: $393.60
BTN: $329.45
SB: $363.95
BB: $426
Hero (UTG): $207

Pre-Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (UTG)
<font color="red">Hero raises to $7</font>, 2 folds, SB calls $6, BB calls $5

Flop: ($21) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($21) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 Players)
SB checks, <font color="red">BB bets $16</font>, Hero calls $16, SB folds

River: ($53) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">BB bets $27</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $94</font>...

Comments welcome on all streets.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

uhh...i dont get it

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

preflop: like
flop: like
turn: ok
river: don't mind turning your hand into a bluff here, since if he's truly ABC this river bet looks like an obv bet/fold.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

post your thought process please

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

you deleted my post?

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

so i assume you have villain on a queen which is why you are making this raise, or maybe a worse jack that he never pays off with here

hes never folding 2pair+ so why are we turning our showdown hand into a bluff. what queen from a meowchow reg (like myself) does he have that actually folds this river. i guess only KQ and void of a great read that hes capable of folding TP2K in this spot i dont like it.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

I like it all.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

I like it.

its rare that villain is very strong here. he's likely got 1 pair at best, theres a good chance you might have the best hand, and if not its a [censored] tough call for him with AQ/KQ

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

this is bad vs a good player, youre not repping anything besides back door diamonds i guess... i really dont like it

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

[ QUOTE ]
I like it.

its rare that villain is very strong here. he's likely got 1 pair at best, theres a good chance you might have the best hand, and if not its a [censored] tough call for him with AQ/KQ

[/ QUOTE ]

i think villain gets here with AQ and this line about 5% of the time, and i dont see TPTK block betting this river, seems more like a c/c to me so it wouldnt be in a tough spot like this

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

I like your play up until the river.

I fold river though. I think you get looked up a decent amount

edit. just saw deader post stats. i like it more now.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

Its also relevant that he has pretty nitty stats, in my db something like 19/14 by memory. I think he played it nicely though.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

18.5/15 ftw!

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

why would you c/c the river with tptk on this board?

you'd let villain chk back all his medium strength hands and value bet you to death when he backs into a flush. seems like a pretty standard spot to bet/fold, no?

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

Pretty hot. although I think deaders could easily have a pretty big hand to bet turn/river (like QJ, 99, 77) that would stubbornly call. But most likely hands based on his river bet size is something like KQ or worse. so yeah, not bad

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

Its hard for me to comment objectively because I know what happened obviously but there arent very many hands that I am going to bet fold on the river there.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

So, the turn call is standard?

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

im trying to think of anything that you dont beat that would fold, especially if you have had any history of aggression

edit: added word "dont"

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

[ QUOTE ]
So, the turn call is standard?

[/ QUOTE ]
sure if you expect him to have a draw often. i would have expected him to c/c that river and let you bluff though unless maybe he had a fairly strong made hand, or he himself is bluffing. polarized ranges, lol.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

I was thinking, as played, if he checks river, I check behind. If he bets something like $32+ I fold.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

im trying to think of he could have that an 18/15 is calling out of the blinds with and actually makes sense in the big picture of the hand. not a lot of hands fit the picture unless he's afraid to squeeze with pretty good hands. maybe a set that missed c/r? he was in perfect relative position for a c/r on that flop. depends on his tendencies i guess. the river is tough.

if hes the type to fire a draw on two streets, then decide on the turn whether to call down (barring bad scare card), or to just let it go then.

if hes gonna give up on the river with missed draws, which i think is pretty unlikely on this board, then go ahead and call the turn for sure.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

[ QUOTE ]
why would you c/c the river with tptk on this board?



[/ QUOTE ]
we dont have TPTK. were beat by any queen. im saying we should call behind not c/c (its late im tired)

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

IDK. Blocking bets hate raises. So raise. But all u r repping is backdoor flush I think. But that could still be enough to get him to fold better.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

as far as im concerned, if i'm villain, qt=99 here.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

this is crazyness, you think hes folding a Q? i bet youre ahead enough to call.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

[ QUOTE ]
I was thinking, as played, if he checks river, I check behind. If he bets something like $32+ I fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

if he checks its valuetown IMO

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

[ QUOTE ]
meowchow TAG

[/ QUOTE ]
What does this mean?

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

fold turn

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

Why do you think he can't show up with a monster here? Just because of his bet size on the river? Why does everyone think the best hand he can have here is some sort of queen?

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

aj
i like everything up to the river. which hands do you think are folding to your river raise that you don´t beat anyways by just calling?
imo villain does not have a lot of hands that b/f the river.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

Since deaders is overcalling from the BB getting 3:1 I think his range includes lots of random QTs and stuff that might bet/fold.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

flop check behind is fine. as is the call on the turn

river is strange. i take it to be a bluff, as you think villain is valuebetting a better hand, but you think it is a bit thin, and he will fold alot to a raise.

i spose it's ok, i'd just call the river bet personally

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

I don't think AJ has very much showdown value at all. it would be really sweet if deaders knew AJ's line was FOS and snapcalled the river with like JThh though.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

idk why the turn play could even be in question as both folding and raising are pretty lol.

i don't see why deaders has to have a Q here. he obviously knows you don't as you would Cbet a Q+ on this flop and any draw. i would probably Vbet/blockerbet a J if i was deaders and you don't have to be right that often (about 1/4). pretty easy call on the river imo

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

I don't like it at all. We are representing back door diamonds. What else gets there on the river? If representing one hand is a good bluff, then I guess this is exceptional.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

oh also the river is a good raise, can't really call profitably and hes also going to find a tough time looking you up, but like i said i fold turn

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

i'd just fold turn

and like everyone else has said - you're basically repping some very rare hands (rivered two pair, backdoor flush) so I don't like it

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

I like how this was played except if I were going to bluff the river, I'd just shove.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

On the river you only represent AdKd and AdTd, no?

Not sure if he can drop a Q here.

Re: AJs - All Streets Debatable
 

The river raise is good against a standard nittish opponent.
Personally in villains spot, I would contemplate for awhile and the call with a Q. Not sure bout J10 tho...