Online Poker Article
 

Politico Article

Not to harp on what Mason brings up here regarding transparency, but the opposition is apparently going to use this against us.

"There is the anonymity angle. You just do not know where the money is going. McClasky also questions where PPA obtains its funding, suggesting it could be obtained through impure practices."

Re: Online Poker Article
 

Thanks for posting this. This should be required reading for everyone here.

Re: Online Poker Article
 

Let's post some comments.

Re: Online Poker Article
 

I posed this question in the 'Let me introduce myself' thread and didn't get a response:

How can we get our hands on a copy of the PPA's form 990 for the most recent year?

For those not in the know, the PPA is a 501 (c)(3) non profit organization (the 501 (c)(3) referring to the section of the code under which it is organized), which is required to prepare and submit a 'Form 990' annually. This form is essentially the tax return of the organization and, among a range of financial information, includes sources of funding. These are supposed to be publicly available documents (in unusual circumstances, organizations may be able to obtain exemption from having to make these public).

There are a number of websites that allow you to search for charitable organizations and obtain their Form 990's (or Forms 990, excuse my grammar). I'm in the accounting profession and despite the tools at my disposal to find such information, I can't.

I'm sure having this would (or should) put to bed the issue of where the PPA's funding comes from and goes to.

Re: Online Poker Article
 

Wow. An article that seems on its face to be fairly neutral. Nice find bro.

Re: Online Poker Article
 

[ QUOTE ]
I posed this question in the 'Let me introduce myself' thread and didn't get a response:

How can we get our hands on a copy of the PPA's form 990 for the most recent year?

For those not in the know, the PPA is a 501 (c)(3) non profit organization (the 501 (c)(3) referring to the section of the code under which it is organized), which is required to prepare and submit a 'Form 990' annually. This form is essentially the tax return of the organization and, among a range of financial information, includes sources of funding. These are supposed to be publicly available documents (in unusual circumstances, organizations may be able to obtain exemption from having to make these public).

There are a number of websites that allow you to search for charitable organizations and obtain their Form 990's (or Forms 990, excuse my grammar). I'm in the accounting profession and despite the tools at my disposal to find such information, I can't.

I'm sure having this would (or should) put to bed the issue of where the PPA's funding comes from and goes to.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll ask.

Re: Online Poker Article
 

There is no way that the PPA could be a 501(c)(3) with its activities. Lobbying efforts alone would pretty much finish that possibility. They are a 501(c)(4) membership organization.

I found their 2005 Form 990 from their website here:
http://www.pokerplayersalliance.org/...5Public990.pdf

It should be noted that their 2006 form was probably extended and would be due on the 15th of this month.

Greenberg law firm has to go, cut to the chase and back Wexler Bill
 

Good third party article on the players as seen in DC.

It is unclear whether the Greenberg law firm is counsel to the PPA or serves on the Board. However, either way, they have to be cut loose. (I am not knocking their abilities or past service, just stating that their legacy from Abramoff makes them too hot politically to retain.)

Again, also, so long as the PPA is tied to the Frank Bill, it will draw fire from the NFL. The NFL is an essential part of the opposition in this endeavor because it sees the "evil" of sportsbetting, clearly it is time to cut ties between the PPA and "perceived threat" of sports betting allowed under the Frank Bill. (The "opt-out" language of the Frank Bill for the NFL likely is not enough to blunt their opposition, so try something else .... like pushing a POKER bill like the Wexler Bill.)

It is less likely to draw NFL fire if it pushed the Wexler Bill, and may even be more likely to get allies among the "skill-game" crowd.

Just my view,

Milton

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, cut to the chase and back Wexler Bill
 

[ QUOTE ]
Again, also, so long as the PPA is tied to the Frank Bill, it will draw fire from the NFL. The NFL is an essential part of the opposition in this endeavor because it sees the "evil" of sportsbetting, clearly it is time to cut ties between the PPA and "perceived threat" of sports betting allowed under the Frank Bill. (The "opt-out" language of the Frank Bill for the NFL likely is not enough to blunt their opposition, so try something else .... like pushing a POKER bill like the Wexler Bill.)

It is less likely to draw NFL fire if it pushed the Wexler Bill, and may even be more likely to get allies among the "skill-game" crowd.

Just my view,

Milton

[/ QUOTE ]

PPA is pushing the Wexler bill very strongly. They are also working on the issue with the NFL.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, cut to the chase and back Wexler Bil
 

One of the better neutral articles I have read.

My sense in reading the article that the sports leagues are a bigger obstacle to us than Focus on the Family. I posted an article a month back that FOF is laying people off due to rising health care costs and a shortfall in donations. I think we could put up a good fight against FOF, but the sports leagues have unlimited resources and no way we can be bigger, faster, stronger than they are. I also don't see us making enough noise to concern them. Heck they cater to corporate America nowadays anyhow.

I really hope the religious right wing continues to suffer losses.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, cut to the chase and back Wexler Bil
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Again, also, so long as the PPA is tied to the Frank Bill, it will draw fire from the NFL. The NFL is an essential part of the opposition in this endeavor because it sees the "evil" of sportsbetting, clearly it is time to cut ties between the PPA and "perceived threat" of sports betting allowed under the Frank Bill. (The "opt-out" language of the Frank Bill for the NFL likely is not enough to blunt their opposition, so try something else .... like pushing a POKER bill like the Wexler Bill.)

It is less likely to draw NFL fire if it pushed the Wexler Bill, and may even be more likely to get allies among the "skill-game" crowd.

Just my view,

Milton

[/ QUOTE ]

PPA is pushing the Wexler bill very strongly. They are also working on the issue with the NFL.

[/ QUOTE ]

Glad to know Engineer, compared to where we were with the PPA 6 months ago, it is an extraordinary improvement.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, cut to the chase and back Wexler Bill
 

[ QUOTE ]
Good third party article on the players as seen in DC.

It is unclear whether the Greenberg law firm is counsel to the PPA or serves on the Board. However, either way, they have to be cut loose. (I am not knocking their abilities or past service, just stating that their legacy from Abramoff makes them too hot politically to retain.)

[/ QUOTE ]

Greenberg Trurig's reputation was not diminished the least because of Jack. In fact the firms reputation was to some degree enhanced due to the fact it fully cooperated with the Feds in their investigations.

Given that the firm employes not only some of the best lobbists in town but also is perhaps the best source of gaming law talent in the world throwing them under the bus would be the equalivant of throwing out the baby with the bath water.

As far as I know no one from the firm is on the PPA board.

[ QUOTE ]
Again, also, so long as the PPA is tied to the Frank Bill, it will draw fire from the NFL. The NFL is an essential part of the opposition in this endeavor because it sees the "evil" of sportsbetting, clearly it is time to cut ties between the PPA and "perceived threat" of sports betting allowed under the Frank Bill. (The "opt-out" language of the Frank Bill for the NFL likely is not enough to blunt their opposition, so try something else .... like pushing a POKER bill like the Wexler Bill.)

It is less likely to draw NFL fire if it pushed the Wexler Bill, and may even be more likely to get allies among the "skill-game" crowd.

Just my view,

Milton

[/ QUOTE ]

You're view on the uphill challenge faced by the poker community given the desire of many of the players that could support us to get unrestricted on-line gaming as well as sports betting is indeed a problem.

Given the nature of the PPA vs the AGA in their current form making an enemy of them isn't wise. But we also can not ally ourselves to closely with them for the very reasons you mention. Look at the AGA board and you will find the Managing Director of the Bank of America among its members. This is an ally that could indeed help us but it is doubtful given the size of sports books alone we will ever get or hope for much more than a nominally netural stance.


D$D

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, cut to the chase and back Wexler Bill
 

Reply posted, we need to own that response section everyone!

obg

Re: Online Poker Article
 

Thanks broiler, I appreciate you posting that link. While I recognize the distinction between a C4 and C3, I had misread that they were a C3 (and was confused by that given the nature of their lobbying activities).

I had also overlooked the 990 on their site, so I've managed to bat .000 in relation to this.

Thanks

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

"Greenberg Trurig's reputation was not diminished the least because of Jack. "

Maybe you did not pay attention during the Perfect Storm which resulted in the UIGEA. However, Jack Abramoff's name, and his firm identification, were one of the principal reasons the UIGEA made it through.

There is no questioning here of the firm's general abilities, they are undeniably a political liability for THIS issue.

Jack Abramoff and his former law firm would be sticky mud outside the Beltway, D$D. Can't you see why ? The FoF guy basically showed you a card they ARE going to play.

(Whether the firm is "the best source of gaming law talent in the world", is irrelevant. They are tarred with a brush on online gaming issues because one of their partners, who was a principal lobbyist on online gaming issues, came up extremely dirty in a gaming-related financial fraud.)

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

Eh, I tend to agree with D$D on this one Milton.

I see your point, but I don't see tangible evidence that the firm is viewed in a negative way.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

Why wait for "the law firm of Jack Abramof, convicted swindler and lobbyist for online gaming" to hit the press releases ?

The tangible evidence is the FoF ability and likely plan to smear the PPA with the association.

I am not knocking the firm, I know their history in this industry. I am just saying cut them loose from lobbying because this is online gaming.

If the Titanic had turned a little sooner, we would have been spared a really terrible movie.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

That's a fair consideration.

Can the charge be used effectively? I'm skeptical, but it does make for a catchy soundbite.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

some info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenberg_Traurig

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Eh, I tend to agree with D$D on this one Milton.

I see your point, but I don't see tangible evidence that the firm is viewed in a negative way.

[/ QUOTE ]

By the way, and this may be old news, but Patton Boggs is apparently also making the rounds on the issue.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

[ QUOTE ]
By the way, and this may be old news, but Patton Boggs is apparently also making the rounds on the issue.

[/ QUOTE ]


Sweet.

Patton Boggs ....
 

They do carry water for Indian Gaming interests, which as we've seen in Washington State, is not always on our side.

Re: Patton Boggs ....
 

[ QUOTE ]
They do carry water for Indian Gaming interests, which as we've seen in Washington State, is not always on our side.

[/ QUOTE ]

Considering who they've been making the rounds with, I don't think that's an issue. They've also carried water for one of the Brit sportsbooks, if I remember correctly.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why wait for "the law firm of Jack Abramof, convicted swindler and lobbyist for online gaming" to hit the press releases ?

The tangible evidence is the FoF ability and likely plan to smear the PPA with the association.

I am not knocking the firm, I know their history in this industry. I am just saying cut them loose from lobbying because this is online gaming.

If the Titanic had turned a little sooner, we would have been spared a really terrible movie.

[/ QUOTE ]

Given the role Greenberg plays in this effort the FoF's position is very weak.

I don't mean to harp on an issue I had hoped would die down soon but we as a group deminish Greenberg's role and visibleness the more member driven our actions become. Greenberg's role has never been to lead the fight, and my issue is the feeling that perhaps the PPA has become to reliant on their talents.

But to suggest that we throw them under the bus just because a FoFer realized they are involved and in truth are more scared of them than us is simply folding to a bluff weak raise in the press.

If Greenberg Trauig had a hint of loosing its ability or was painted with the same brush I would be the first to point that out. I have a personal friend caught up in that mess, his political life was destroyed as well as that of his wife and he may end up in jail because of his association with Jack.

I am well aware of getting tarred with the same brush game that is played well in DC. I've seen good people loose their jobs and ability to survive in DC because they happened to work for or were friends with the wrong person.

It is a constant parlor game here, it is part of what makes this place the swamp it always was. It doesn't matter sometimes the value or loyality of the individual, you can get "killed" just as quick in DC as you can in a Manhattan poker room, for simply being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

If you look deeply into this you'll find Jack joined GT late in his career. GT had been around and well established long before Jack came around. Had the circumstances been different perhaps we might have to worry, but as it is there is no need for concern.

Right now it would be like refusing to go to a world class hospital who had the best doctors for your condition because a doctor they hired was screwing candy stripers and the hospital promptly fire him. If the hospital has defended the doctor knowing he was an idiot at the least then you might have cause for concern.


As it is you are over reacting.


D$D

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

Is there any data on how many people watch football (and other sports, but football is the biggie in the U.S.) because they are betting on the games or following their fantasy players? It seems very hypocritical to me that the NFL wants to make sports betting illegal when much of its revenue very likely directly or indirectly comes from people with money riding on the games or players in the games.

Yeah, I know, I'll use Google. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, D$D, it is not even close ...
 

If it comes down to a war of association with FoF we may have to throw names around. Im not sure how connected Ralph Reed was to FoF but he and Abramoff were both complicit in two-sided gaming lobbying. If it comes down to a panel in the House covered by CSPAN we need a fast retort in our pocket drawing a line to a Rep ex Rep in jail they gave money to involved in this somehow. Maybe Ney or Cunningham or someone has a close enough degree of separation we can use. Ney is the best bet as he was in leadership at some point. Something along the lines of you and jack abramoff both gave money and lobbied together in the UIGEA effort with Rep X or Sen X. The more disgraced or name recognizable the Republican the better. You can't win on the merits of an argument as much as its one-liner appeal and saying Abramoff lobbied for Party is just enough true they can use it, we just need a comeback schoolyard style.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, cut to the chase and back Wexler Bil
 

To go with Berge's concern, we still don't have an answer Im comfortable with when people ask me, well who/what is the PPA.
Its going to come back to haunt us, and maybe we don't need to go as far as Mason wants, but we need to be fully transparent and transition swiftly to a democratic board.

Re: Greenberg law firm has to go, cut to the chase and back Wexler Bil
 

[ QUOTE ]
To go with Berge's concern, we still don't have an answer Im comfortable with when people ask me, well who/what is the PPA.
Its going to come back to haunt us, and maybe we don't need to go as far as Mason wants, but we need to be fully transparent and transition swiftly to a democratic board.

[/ QUOTE ]

IMO the kind of transparency especially the financials would likely hurt more than help anything. Because it is my opinion that it would show the amount of money raise from other than industry sources is pretty poor relative to the totals.

Call it a Field of Dreams moment in an organizations evolution. "They have built it", were are the point where it is up to us to "come." If we the regular members step up and do what needs to be done, then the issue of the amount of seed money to the organization goes away.

IMO the PPA is at fault for not providing a nice enough field or atractions to the park before things like the DC fly-in to over come this "are they worth it" common objections. It has also been somewhat lacking in using a number events to spark member motivation and involvment. I will not belabor this point, but there have been quite a number of issues where little sparks could have been helped into nice little brush fires of activity.

But the PPA currently is at a point where we and it has to decide what it wants to be, either an industry funded lobbying group that calls itself a grassroots organization, or a grassroots organization that has execlent lobbing and consulting help.

But I do place an equal share of blame on the members and non-members. Politics isn't rocket sicence, but it is hard work. Done right it can be a lot of fun. Too many people in this country are accustomed to sitting on the sidelines or barely participating and simply bitching about the system and the result they get from minimal participation.

This standoffisness has been all to evident in the almost 2 1/2 years of the PPA. Not building beyond the freeroll stage of membership has been the key problem IMO.


D$D