Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

Weekly 1/2 game, decent players. UTG raises to $10, I call with 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] along with 2 other callers. UTG and I each have around $750.

Flop is 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. UTG bets $30, next player folds to me.

What do you do on this flop. Obviously, I hope he has a hand he will drop his whole stack with. He's pretty good, so this won't happen with AK or an underpair. At this point, I can only hope he has a strong enough hand. So, I raise to $80. Good raise or not?

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

this is a whole level thing. raising is probably good. if there's any chance to stack him, u have to start creating a bigger pot.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

Does he C-bet into 2 players w/ just overs? What's his UTG range of hands?

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

No decent player is folding 99+ here and a lot of players will Zeebo down to 22. On the flop, I only call if I think the player left to act will call, otherwise your raise seems fine (assuming it was a 'normal' size raise for this game.) Value bet turn and river and pray he check raises one of them.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

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Does he C-bet into 2 players w/ just overs? What's his UTG range of hands?

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He MIGHT C-bet into 3 players with AK or AQ, but I doubt it. If this was a C-bet from him, I would expect something roughly around $15-$20, hoping to not be blown off his hand by any pocket pair.

His range is any pair, but probably 66 or higher, AK, AQ, maybe KQs.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

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No decent player is folding 99+ here and a lot of players will Zeebo down to 22. On the flop, I only call if I think the player left to act will call, otherwise your raise seems fine (assuming it was a 'normal' size raise for this game.) Value bet turn and river and pray he check raises one of them.

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This is more or less what happens. I didn't really consider the player behind me since A. He's the worst player at the table. and B. He's very short stacked (maybe $80) and isn't folding a boat here.

UTG and I are definately two of the better players in the game, and have a tendancy to play some big pots against each other, so the $50 raise was pretty standard. He then reraises me to $200, which I call after a very slight hesitation.

Turn is a brick, he checks, I bet $150. He makes small talk, says only hand that beats him is quads...continutes to ask if I have it. I only say it would be pretty bold of me to raise the flop with quads. He pushes with QQ and wonders why he had JUST added on $400 so he could get his stack even with mine.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

Sounds like you played it fine. I really would not consider a player who stacks off with QQ for 300+ BB to be very good. What worse hand is expecting you to felt here?

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

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Sounds like you played it fine. I really would not consider a player who stacks off with QQ for 300+ BB to be very good. What worse hand is expecting you to felt here?

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You might be correct. He only knew that I didn't have AA or KK. And he's right, of course I reraise PF with those. I guess he's hoping I have TT or JJ.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

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Sounds like you played it fine. I really would not consider a player who stacks off with QQ for 300+ BB to be very good. What worse hand is expecting you to felt here?

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No decent player is folding 99+ here and a lot of players will Zeebo down to 22.

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interesting.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

edit: you played the hand well, although i would bet more (shove?) on the turn

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

I guess you somehow need to assess if your opponents are too aggressive or too passive and base your action on that.

If they are too passive: raise flop to $90, bet $200 on turn and $450 river, ship 1.5K pot

If they are too aggressive: I'm tempted to slowplay it on the flop to get calls from other opponents or to get value out of a second barrel, but raise the turn for sure since you somehow want to get it in vs a good hand at the end without making a huge overbet.

But how you played it seems perfect as well. I think it doesn't really matter since he had QQ, the money was going in anyway without an overcard on the board.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

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But how you played it seems perfect as well. I think it doesn't really matter since he had QQ, the money was going in anyway without an overcard on the board.

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This is mainly what I'm looking to hear opinions on. I think you are correct in that it didn't matter what I did in this case, with QQ, he was probably dropping the stack, barring an overcard. I'm wondering: A. Should I make more of an effort to get him all-in on the flop or turn before a scare card hits. B. Should I play him slower, just in case he has a marginal hand/pair and may not call a huge bet?

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

i'd just raise, its easy to talk yourself (as the pf raiser here) that someone is just making a move on a pretty board, figuring you don't have a piece. I could easily see him not wanting to let go of a lot of his range, even if it was only AK, AQ etc.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

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i'd just raise, its easy to talk yourself (as the pf raiser here) that someone is just making a move on a pretty board, figuring you don't have a piece. I could easily see him not wanting to let go of a lot of his range, even if it was only AK, AQ etc.

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ike,

As the villian, at what point do you realize your QQ is toast?

Bad players stack off with most any boat and good players stack off with AA and KK most of the time. QQ is a hand that a lot of people *raises hand* have trouble dropping. Sure for a 100 bbs I guess it's not horrible, but 300+ bbs seems very spewish.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

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i'd just raise, its easy to talk yourself (as the pf raiser here) that someone is just making a move on a pretty board, figuring you don't have a piece. I could easily see him not wanting to let go of a lot of his range, even if it was only AK, AQ etc.

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ike,

As the villian, at what point do you realize your QQ is toast?

Bad players stack off with most any boat and good players stack off with AA and KK most of the time. QQ is a hand that a lot of people *raises hand* have trouble dropping. Sure for a 100 bbs I guess it's not horrible, but 300+ bbs seems very spewish.

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it seems spewish, but to call someone a bad player b/c they go broke here seems a little harsh. As for at what point does it become spew? It really depends on villain's view of OP. It sounds like they get into some wars, so although it seems a little spewish, I'd hesitate at calling villain bad b/c of the way he played here.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

You played it fine, although not crazy about the table talk you did.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

ike,

I agree that bad is probably harsh becuase I am looking at one hand in a vacuum. For a 100 bbs I'd say it's pretty standard to stack off QQ against most players.

At 300+ bbs, I'm pretty sure that QQ is drawing very thin/dead a high % of the time when all the money goes in. I'm just trying to figure out at what point you just have to fold them.

Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

I think you really should raise the flop, villains will not fold overpairs here and imo it doesn't look as strong as calling flop/raising turn.

Btw don't say this![ QUOTE ]
I only say it would be pretty bold of me to raise the flop with quads.

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Re: Flopped quads deep stacked: now what?
 

now what? this is where i usually come.