300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

Villain has tag stats. He's 3-bet a bit, and I decide to exercise some muscle. My image is pretty normal/good, I've just been stacking donkeys and stuff.

What is your line with
1) AA
2) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
3) AKo
4) Do you like the flop check with any of these hands?

Party Poker, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

SB: $17.50
BB: $137.18
Hero (UTG): $472.30
MP: $126.31
CO: $296.62
BTN: $96

Pre-Flop: XX dealt to Hero (UTG)
<font color="red">Hero raises to $3.50</font>, MP folds, <font color="red">CO raises to $13</font>, 3 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $36.50</font>, CO calls $23.50

Flop: ($74.50) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">CO bets $38</font>,

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

1.) I 4bet more, bet flop and go broke 100%
2.) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] I could c/r or lead... obv going broke on flop
3.) c/f
4.)see above

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

I only like a flop check with AA. Going for c/r obv, and shove turn. AKo check is ok, but I'm c/f it.

75cc I'm b/3b overshoving.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

I think c/r with 75cc just leads to too many awkward spots on turn when he calls.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

a flop check with AA is so gross imo

ikestoys is right ont he money as usual

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

I like check with AA sometimes, to cr and not fold on that flop.

75 Id usually lead

AKo cf

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

I'm thinking its ok to check our whole range here, or bet it all. Also I think check/shove with all these hands is probably fine

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

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a flop check with AA is so gross imo

ikestoys is right ont he money as usual

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Do you think he's checking behind JJ-KK, do you think draws are too big a part of his range, or do you think the c/r makes our hand look too strong?

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

1) I'm leading the flop and getting it in, if he called for set value god bless him (I'm assuming this is incorrect play 300bb deep against overpairs, haven't run the math). Don't really see the point to a flop check.
2) Interesting, since we really do want him to fold overpairs. The stack sizes are a little awkward for a bet/3bet (unless you lead flop small) I would consider check/shoving strongly since you have a whole lot of fold equity with such a massive overbet. Obviously the c/r size depends on his bet size, but whatever line makes him fold queens the most is best.
3) Most likely give up
4) Sure.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

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I'm thinking its ok to check our whole range here, or bet it all. Also I think check/shove with all these hands is probably fine

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check/shoving ak is 100% spew

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

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a flop check with AA is so gross imo

ikestoys is right ont he money as usual

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Do you think he's checking behind JJ-KK, do you think draws are too big a part of his range, or do you think the c/r makes our hand look too strong?

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I'll take all of the above, with #3 being most important, #1 being second important and #2 being least important.

The biggest reason tho is that we have a lot of money behind that we want to get into the pot, we shouldn't be [censored] around.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

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I'm thinking its ok to check our whole range here, or bet it all. Also I think check/shove with all these hands is probably fine

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check/shoving ak is 100% spew

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You say he checks behind JJ-KK, and sets are hard to flop. So his range would be pretty polarized, and weighted towards bluffs since he can't win the pot any other way with 9 high or whatever. So I don't think it will ever be really bad, considering the math of it.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

I meant to say he may check behind JJ-KK... and relying him to fold JJ-KK is a rather dubious proposition.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

1. AA - bet/get all-in. i probably bet $48-$52 although I'm not really sure about that bet size. If i were c-betting the flop that's what I would bet but I really can't see myself bluffing at this flop.

2. 75cc - will do the same as w/ AA.

3. AKo - probably c/f.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

[ QUOTE ]
Villain has tag stats. He's 3-bet a bit, and I decide to exercise some muscle. My image is pretty normal/good, I've just been stacking donkeys and stuff.

What is your line with
1) AA
2) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
3) AKo
4) Do you like the flop check with any of these hands?

Party Poker, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

SB: $17.50
BB: $137.18
Hero (UTG): $472.30
MP: $126.31
CO: $296.62
BTN: $96

Pre-Flop: XX dealt to Hero (UTG)
<font color="red">Hero raises to $3.50</font>, MP folds, <font color="red">CO raises to $13</font>, 3 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $36.50</font>, CO calls $23.50

Flop: ($74.50) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">CO bets $38</font>,

[/ QUOTE ]

Grunch.

1.) AA, 4-bet more preflop to deny odds and get more $$ in. As played, just bet out and go broke.

2.) 75 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], pre is fine, flop c/r is sexy.

3.) AKo, pretty much hate the 4-bet, just small-ball it. As played, give up.

4.) 2 and 3.

This could all change with reads obv but in general this is how I'd play when this deep.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

1) if you check you are fkin terrible
2) bet 50 on flop, shove turn
3) c/f

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

dont like cr w/ 75. jam it

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

General Thoughts: I think your 4bet size sucks with atc. Also I think this is reallllllly simple as a whole given the situation and hands you provided us with

1) bet
2) bet
3) check then fold

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

[ QUOTE ]
General Thoughts: I think your 4bet size sucks with atc. Also I think this is reallllllly simple as a whole given the situation and hands you provided us with

1) bet
2) bet
3) check then fold

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Agree with these lines 100%

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

bet
bet
c/f

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

Don't really like the 4-bet size. Underpotting it deep OOP?

1. Bet
2. Bet
3. Check/fold (but I don't think CR all in is horrible at all)

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

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3. Check/fold (but I don't think CR all in is horrible at all)

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Don't you think that we're often going to be drawing to 4 outs on a good day if called?

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

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3. Check/fold (but I don't think CR all in is horrible at all)

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Don't you think that we're often going to be drawing to 4 outs on a good day if called?

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4 outs how?
Also I like how ikestoys said to c/f AKo and everyone is like "yahyah c/f obv"

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

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3. Check/fold (but I don't think CR all in is horrible at all)

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Don't you think that we're often going to be drawing to 4 outs on a good day if called?

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4 outs how?
Also I like how ikestoys said to c/f AKo and everyone is like "yahyah c/f obv"

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I'd love to have an argument on whether or not to c/f with AK. Plz provide the counter point to:

-A very significant portion of villains range is KK-JJ.
-Expecting the villain to fold JJ-KK to a c/r is very dubious.
-Its unlikely he'll bluff the lower parts of his range

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

sorry, I meant 3 outs. And I was mainly referring to the crai that Isura mentioned.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

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3. Check/fold (but I don't think CR all in is horrible at all)

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Don't you think that we're often going to be drawing to 4 outs on a good day if called?

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4 outs how?
Also I like how ikestoys said to c/f AKo and everyone is like "yahyah c/f obv"

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I'd love to have an argument on whether or not to c/f with AK. Plz provide the counter point to:

-A very significant portion of villains range is KK-JJ.
-Expecting the villain to fold JJ-KK to a c/r is very dubious.
-Its unlikely he'll bluff the lower parts of his range

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I actually agree that c/f is the best line fwiw, just making an observation

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

[ QUOTE ]
1.) I 4bet more, bet flop and go broke 100%
2.) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] I could c/r or lead... obv going broke on flop
3.) c/f
4.)see above

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I was considering Cbeting AK (maybe a leak), but I think c/f is better.

Re: 300bb 4-bet pot lets play poker!
 

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-A very significant portion of villains range is KK-JJ.

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Agreed.

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-Expecting the villain to fold JJ-KK to a c/r is very dubious.

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A 100NL TAG is not bet/calling QQ or less for 300BB's. Usually isn't betting QQ/JJ though, but will fold it to a push most of the time even when he bets thinking he got the info he needed.

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-Its unlikely he'll bluff the lower parts of his range

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Disagree.

We gave him good odds preflop, he is in there with a lot of stuff. He is only bet/calling KK+ and sets. Sets are hard to make, less AA/KK out there since we have AK.

I still prefer c/f, but I don't think CR is all that bad. Tags at this level are weak as hell in deep pots. No way in hell is he felting JJ or the like here unless heros image is that of a batshit crazy lagfish.