Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

I'd like to hear opinions on this topic...

Situation:

5/10 NL ring game
Average strenght opponents, no rocks, no kamikazes
Everyone is evenly stacked
You are just before the cutoff

Seat 1 (UTG)...FOLD
Seat 2...RAISE to $30
Seat 3...FOLD
Seat 4...CALL $30
Seat 5...CALL $30
Seat 6 (YOU)...???
Seat 7 (cutoff)...???
Seat 8 (D)...???
Seat 9 (SB)...???
Seat 10 (BB)...???

Pot: $105

You have A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and you want to reraise. You have 4 players still left to act after you.

WHAT DO YOU DO???

Do you just call hoping that one of the players left to act will rereaise so you can reraise again?
Do you raise the pot making it ~$200 to go?
Do you over raise the pot, ~$300+, hoping the players left to act fold and only the initial raiser calls?
Or do you do something totally different?

I am faced with this situation quite often and I always find it as a difficult decision on how much to raise. I am VERY interested in finding out the opinions of others.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

Umm ... what stack sizes are you assuming here? 'Cause I daresay you're gonna get a much different consensus opinion if you're in this spot with $250 stacks vs. $2,500 stacks.

Beyond that, the only point I have to offer is this: If I had ten bucks for every time I've seen someone lose their stack by slowplaying AA preflop - especially in a potential multiway pot - I'd be rolled for 5-10NL myself and not slumming at the 5-10 limit tables instead. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Mook

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

my own opinion is that both those raise suggestions are too large, assuming 100X stacks...... you want to raise. make them pay pre-flop. not too many callers. so go 3-4X for reraise.

do you really have that problem that often? with AA? the raise and two callers seems like a great spot already. decent pot already, and likely some callers when you raise...worse is holding KK, limping early then seeing 5 more callers.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

[ QUOTE ]
Umm ... what stack sizes are you assuming here? 'Cause I daresay you're gonna get a much different consensus opinion if you're in this spot with $250 stacks vs. $2,500 stacks.

Beyond that, the only point I have to offer is this: If I had ten bucks for every time I've seen someone lose their stack by slowplaying AA preflop - especially in a potential multiway pot - I'd be rolled for 5-10NL myself and not slumming at the 5-10 limit tables instead. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Mook

[/ QUOTE ]

Assume deep stacks.

And it clearly says it is 5/10 NO LIMIT!

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

[ QUOTE ]
my own opinion is that both those raise suggestions are too large, assuming 100X stacks...... you want to raise. make them pay pre-flop. not too many callers. so go 3-4X for reraise.


[/ QUOTE ]

Explain to me what you mean by 3x. The initial raiser did raise 3x. So now I want to reraise the 3 times the pot.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

I usually reraise 3x the persons raise amount, or 4x if there are one or more callers.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

Just re raising period will show strength at this point. Doing that should get you into a HU situation. I would say 3 or 4x the raise so somewhere around $100

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

[ QUOTE ]

WHAT DO YOU DO???

Do you just call hoping that one of the players left to act will rereaise so you can reraise again?


[/ QUOTE ]

This might make sense with very deep stacks or if you have an opponent behind you with Fancy Play Syndrome who tries the squeeze play too much (and an opening raiser who is perceived as loose). It doesn't sound like you have such a table.

[ QUOTE ]

Do you raise the pot making it ~$200 to go?
Do you over raise the pot, ~$300+, hoping the players left to act fold and only the initial raiser calls?
Or do you do something totally different?


[/ QUOTE ]

If you raise to 300, the only hands that will call you might be ones that would have reraised, so you're missing a lot of action. I usually want to be called when I raise preflop with aces. If I knew that shoving all-in pre-flop would get 3 callers, that's what I would do with aces.

A pot-sized raise would be to $155 if I did my math correctly. I would probably raise to a number between $100 and that. An alternative strategy based on your reading ability might be to think about what is the maximum raise that the first raiser would call with a hand like TT or AQ and pick that amount.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

i would limp only if I have very aggressive players behind me who can't stand the thought of a unraised 5 way pot that he doesn't try to steal. Otherwise, its a tragedy to go to the flop unraised with AA.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

The original question cant be answered without knowing stack sizes, you are turning your hand face up by 3betting an EP raise + 2 Callers in the hijack, which means villain(s) can play perfectly vs your range (QQ - AA, AK) with pps and suited connectors. With $3k effective stacks a raise to ~150 will be called by all opponents, with each one getting better implied odds with 22, 77, JTs, 87s. With $1k effective a raise to $150 is far more acceptable.

Also limping here would be suicide, you would need an incredibly good read, as very rarely are the blinds going to try a squeeze vs an EP raiser and 3 callers in a ten handed game, esp when they will be getting crazy implied odds with PPs, SCs, SAs.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

[ QUOTE ]
i would limp only if I have very aggressive players behind me who can't stand the thought of a unraised 5 way pot that he doesn't try to steal. Otherwise, its a tragedy to go to the flop unraised with AA.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think that it is a tragedy in certain scenarios, such as if the stacks are very deep and your opponents are very good.

Also, this is a raised pot, not an unraised pot.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

[ QUOTE ]
you are turning your hand face up by 3betting an EP raise + 2 Callers in the hijack, which means villain(s) can play perfectly vs your range (QQ - AA, AK) with pps and suited connectors.

[/ QUOTE ]

That assumes that your re-raising range is actually that well-defined.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

You should min raise and then push in the dark on the flop and then complain on how unlucky you are when you have the 4th best hand by the turn. Oh wait this is 5/10 not 1/2.

Does anyone consider jamming here. I always think a jam shows more weakness (like JJ trying shut down a hand) than a 3-bet. With 4 players in the pot already, you have to kill the odds for set mining, the problem is, if you don't bet enough and the original raise calls (even with ace k/q), subsquent cold callers have better and better odds to call and see flop with pps. I like the 3 to 4xs rule, but with 4 in pot, don't think bumping it higher hurts. worse outcome is you shut down the hand, just a bad layout for aces.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

I make it $133 or $144...

which is just around the pot size

You probably want original bettor and an overcall from this scenario and then play poker from this spot... $100 is too small ...

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

A pot-sized raise would be to $155 if I did my math correctly. I would probably raise to a number between $100 and that.

I would probably make it closer to $175 - $200 to go.

The logic is that you'd rather take your aces against 1 or 2 opponents with some dead money in the pot. If you raise to $120 and the initial raiser calls, the first cold caller is getting better than 3:1 to call. If he calls (incorrectly or not), the rest should call, and you're now taking AA against a big field in a big pot. And while you will have position, position decreases in importance as the number of players increases.

Sure, I'd like a caller or two with my aces, but I'd rather not have 4.

$175 to go.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

200 to go

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'd like to hear opinions on this topic...

Situation:

5/10 NL ring game
Average strenght opponents, no rocks, no kamikazes
Everyone is evenly stacked
You are just before the cutoff

Seat 1 (UTG)...FOLD
Seat 2...RAISE to $30
Seat 3...FOLD
Seat 4...CALL $30
Seat 5...CALL $30
Seat 6 (YOU)...???
Seat 7 (cutoff)...???
Seat 8 (D)...???
Seat 9 (SB)...???
Seat 10 (BB)...???

Pot: $105

You have A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and you want to reraise. You have 4 players still left to act after you.

WHAT DO YOU DO???

Do you just call hoping that one of the players left to act will rereaise so you can reraise again?
Do you raise the pot making it ~$200 to go?
Do you over raise the pot, ~$300+, hoping the players left to act fold and only the initial raiser calls?
Or do you do something totally different?

I am faced with this situation quite often and I always find it as a difficult decision on how much to raise. I am VERY interested in finding out the opinions of others.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is really a wrong forum for this but from a theoretical standpoint, you do have to reraise most of the time to cut down your reverse implied odds. If effective stack is 500-1000, calling is really bad, unless a reraise is very likely. If effective stack > 2000 or < 300, calling becomes actually more reasonable.

Re: Reraising Preflop with Previous Callers in NL
 

raise about a quarter of your stack.