Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

villain is tag multitable winning player pretty solid imo.

Full Tilt Poker, $2/$4 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker Hand History Converter

Hero (UTG): $767.40
CO: $154
BTN: $223.40
SB: $411.90
BB: $1,057.90

Pre-Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BB)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $14</font>, CO folds, BTN calls $14, SB folds, Hero calls $10

Flop: ($44) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $32</font>, BTN folds, <font color="red">BB raises to $140</font>, Hero...

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

Call flop bet turn looks OK I think.

Not sure on three-betsing the flop.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

$350

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

I guess you're the Original raiser? Looks like a good spot to 3bet and let him do something stupid hopefully. I don't like calling to rep some draw and get it in on a brick b/c there's not many of them and it sucks to have to lay this down later b/c you wanted to get tricky this deep.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

If you'd play fd + sd same way, $350 or thereabouts.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

I am starting to dislike a 3-bet more now. I think he gets away from AQ/KK/AA type hands too easily.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

hell rarely show up with aa/kk here aq is possible qq like never fd maybe

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

Will the player you describe, multitabling TAG, have 67s/78s/89s in his range here? What about your game?
Will he felt AQ/KQs vs your range?

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

lol how could this be anything other than a 3-bet. bb isnt gonna bluff with air on that board...he either has one of the combo draws or 888. just make it $350 or whatever and get it all in.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

[ QUOTE ]


Will the player you describe, multitabling TAG, have 67s/78s/89s in his range here? What about your game?
Will he felt AQ/KQs vs your range?

[/ QUOTE ]

no hes not felting tp this deep and would probably just call with a lot of flush draws. i actually think his range is pretty narrow here.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

Make it $400, get it all in as fast as possible. $350 seems a little too small.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

300 to create illusion of FE sounds nice, but maybe not gonna work IRL. Since I'm making it 400 with a flushdraw that's what Im making it now also

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
$350

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

Villain is much more likely to make a mistake if we just call the flop than he will if we 3bet, call plz.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
Villain is much more likely to make a mistake if we just call the flop than he will if we 3bet, call plz.

[/ QUOTE ]

only w/ his air hands, board is drawy enough to 3b

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Villain is much more likely to make a mistake if we just call the flop than he will if we 3bet, call plz.

[/ QUOTE ]

only w/ his air hands, board is drawy enough to 3b

[/ QUOTE ]

If he has a flush draw, we're just letting him off the hook by 3betting. 200bbs deep he isn't shoving over our flop 3bet with many draws unless he is insane. $350-400 isn't giving anybody the illusion of fold equity, and if you make it less he's priced in to call with all of his draws but will easily get rid of his bluffs and the off chance he has an AQ type hand.

The more I think about this hand the more I like calling.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Villain is much more likely to make a mistake if we just call the flop than he will if we 3bet, call plz.

[/ QUOTE ]

only w/ his air hands, board is drawy enough to 3b

[/ QUOTE ]

If he has a flush draw, we're just letting him off the hook by 3betting. 200bbs deep he isn't shoving over our flop 3bet with many draws unless he is insane. $350-400 isn't giving anybody the illusion of fold equity, and if you make it less he's priced in to call with all of his draws but will easily get rid of his bluffs and the off chance he has an AQ type hand.

The more I think about this hand the more I like calling.

[/ QUOTE ]


I was thinking the same.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

there are a decent amount of big draws + villain would be less likely to raise a worse draw this deep

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
there are a decent amount of big draws + villain would be less likely to raise a worse draw this deep

[/ QUOTE ]


This is true also.

What do we make of his big c/r?

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

calllll

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
there are a decent amount of big draws + villain would be less likely to raise a worse draw this deep

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think many draws but the NFD can really be considered big. OESD + FD isn't really worth 200bbs here for villain. He is probably priced in to calling though, which isn't a good thing.

How likely villain is to raise various weakish draws like an OESD or bare medium/weak FD is pretty player dependent.

Also, our hand looks exactly like either top pair or a draw if we call, and villain probably expects us to fold a lot of our range to a turn bet. Of those big draws, a lot of them will commit on a blank turn where our equity is much greater. FWIW, I would likely fold to a big turn bet if the flush completes.

This is all assuming villain is a good solid tag who can read hands and situations well, of course.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

i see what you're saying. i guess the answer is that it depends. There will be some boards where i'll be more inclined to call with a set, and some boards where i'll be more inclined to 3b. This board is the latter, but i can def see calling. I don't think there is a default play here and one might not necessarily be better then the other.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

1. who is villain?

2. if hes aggro just call, if he is super aggro or only has one bullet and isnt that aggro 3bet small

...fwiw just calling is prolly my standard move here

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

3betting is obviously the "standard" play, but I do think calling in this spot will pay off more in the long run than 3betting. By calling our hand is very disguised. If I'm villain I am double barrelling like my entire range if he calls the flop and the turn doesn't change much, it's a great play too because people play like vags deep and will muck their overpairs/tptk because one pair isn't worth 200bbs!

Also, on the slim chance we're behind seeing a turn can only help us.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

I think you gotta call, but his preflop ranges and tendencies really matter on how you are going to precede. There are a ton of different postflop styles and handranges that fall under tag. If he's really tight I would consider a muck. If he goes crazy with draws, I think you call and get it in on blank turn or go allin now.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think you gotta call, but his preflop ranges and tendencies really matter on how you are going to precede. There are a ton of different postflop styles and handranges that fall under tag. If he's really tight I would consider a muck. If he goes crazy with draws, I think you call and get it in on blank turn or go allin now.

[/ QUOTE ]

nooooooooooo to the fold and i have folded em before

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

don't fold too many draws and [censored] (obv)


also, converter is deuced... you are UTG, BB and somewhere else

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

I like calling and betting or raising any turn card if opp is very aggressive (and in particular fires a lot of 2nd barrels). If OP is more passive, but still liberal, then I just 3-bet here.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

call the flop unless he is sort of spewy, in which case 3 bet. Felt most turns. What are people doing when a heart peels off, and he bets $250?

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

edit: don't know

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
calllll

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

im a total donk, but id think he's doing that with A8 hh, and id probably call and fold to another heart, if not, GET IT IN whenever you can on t or rv

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

get it in you nits. If i see another folding a set or what to do with a set on a board full of draws I will puke.

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

call and c/r bank turn

Re: Next action
 

Villain is JS2

Full Tilt Poker, $2/$4 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker Hand History Converter

Hero (UTG): $767.40
CO: $154
BTN: $223.40
SB: $411.90
BB: $1,057.90

Pre-Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (UTG)
<font color="red">Hero raises to $14</font>, CO folds, BTN calls $14, SB folds, BB calls $10

Flop: ($44) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $32</font>, BTN folds, <font color="red">BB raises to $140</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $348</font>, <font color="red">BB raises to $1,043.90 and is All-In</font>

Re: Bottom set flop action deep 400nl
 

flop call is superior.

Re: Next action
 

[ QUOTE ]
Villain is JS2

Full Tilt Poker, $2/$4 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker Hand History Converter

Hero (UTG): $767.40
CO: $154
BTN: $223.40
SB: $411.90
BB: $1,057.90

Pre-Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (UTG)
<font color="red">Hero raises to $14</font>, CO folds, BTN calls $14, SB folds, BB calls $10

Flop: ($44) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $32</font>, BTN folds, <font color="red">BB raises to $140</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $348</font>, <font color="red">BB raises to $1,043.90 and is All-In</font>

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm guessing you play a lot of live poker?

Re: Next action
 

naw i was villain, probably another do you muck a set thread = no thread but we're deep and i'm playing pretty straight forward.

Full Tilt Poker, $2/$4 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker Hand History Converter

UTG: $767.40
CO: $154
BTN: $223.40
SB: $411.90
Hero (BB): $1,057.90

Pre-Flop: 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BB)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $14</font>, CO folds, BTN calls $14, SB folds, Hero calls $10

Flop: ($44) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">UTG bets $32</font>, BTN folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $140</font>, <font color="red">UTG raises to $248</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $1,043.90 and is All-In</font>, UTG calls $505.40 and is All-In

Turn: ($1,550.80) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 is All-In)

River: ($1,550.80) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 is All-In)

Results: $1,550.80 Pot ($3 Rake)
UTG showed 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (three of a kind, Fives) and LOST (-$767.40 NET)
Hero showed 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (three of a kind, Eights) and WON $1,547.80 (+$780.40 NET)


after the hand 'bangoo' asks if i would muck to the shove i say prob not but think my range is weighted towards 88 exactly since i never have qq here though i would play 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] like this, other flush draws i prob just call the flop bet. she prob doesn't know this but it seems pretty spewy to me to be getting in two bi's with a naked fd so there's a point to her question imo.