Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

5 handed game, in a previous hand David 3bet on the buttom with 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. 20 minutes later UTG raised and David 3 bets. I'm in BB with K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and made a very loose call, UTG calls. Flop Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]10 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. David bet, call, call. Turn 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. David bet, I call and UTG fold. River 7 : [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Do you bet or check raise?

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

im checkraising that flop every time if i see the flop which im rarely doing.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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im checkraising that flop every time if i see the flop which im rarely doing.

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Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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im checkraising that flop every time if i see the flop which im rarely doing.

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Oh and I'm leading the river.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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Oh and I'm leading the river.

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yup.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

I think the preflop call is pretty bad.

The river should not have helped your hand, so a checkraise probably works. Whether or not he pays off with a worse hand i don't know.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

I'm leading the river. The flush card may have scared him and he may check behind with AQ or an overpair. Also, if David made a full house, then you save a bet.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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im checkraising that flop every time if i see the flop which im rarely doing.

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Am I missing something here? A bad PF call puts him in a weak postflop situation... he flops BP + BDFD and is supposed to ChR? At least one of those opponents likely has a pair or a 10 outer against you and won't/shouldn't fold, so what exactly does one accomplish?

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

id say bet the river assuming david is a really good player and will fold pairs decent pairs to your cr. its a spot where you just arent bluffing. he will check behind a lot of weak pairs (proly up to a10) and obv ace highs. he may call with those if you bet given the big pot. of course i have no idea how david plays (tho i did play with him once)

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

Sorry the 8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] no flush possible.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

bottom pair of sevens overcard kicker bdfd is a nice flop 5 handed. both raisers can easily have an A or be reverse dominated with a big K. also preflop raisers will likely put bb on a bigger hand for him to be c/ring them on that flop after calling two cold preflop. so this c/r might get it heads up, plus it will have serious deception value if hero has been playing sensibly so far. that's a lot of power from one small bet investment extra. the only good play on this flop is to c/r. calling is so weak you will get eaten alive playing that way, and folding is out of the question. donk betting is obviously silly. so the only play is c/r.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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Sorry the 8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] no flush possible.

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In this case I definitely like a checkraise on the end.

-DeathDonkey

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

Online I´d bet-3bet against most tags as you aren´t really representing the 7 here, but more likely a think valuebet, so they usually raise good one pair hands and pay off top pair or better.

If David is likely to for the third bet anyway or wont valuebet as much as he should, then I guess check-raise migth be better, but it also lose value from AK/AJ. If you think he actually folds those, then you know how to play your KJ I guess..

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

Looks like David owned you with his earlier 3bet.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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Looks like David owned you with his earlier 3bet.

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indeed. this is why 3-betting suited connectors occasionally rules.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

I'm not sure what I should do on the river, but if I get the decision right it will be something new and interesting.

-Michael

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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Looks like David owned you with his earlier 3bet.

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indeed. this is why 3-betting suited connectors occasionally rules.

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yeah, he wrote the book on that one.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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Looks like David owned you with his earlier 3bet.

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indeed. this is why 3-betting suited connectors occasionally rules.

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yeah, he wrote the book on that one.

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sklansky writes books?

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

does anyone have a link for a site where i can buy these books?

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

I'd send you one, but I don't have internet.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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Looks like David owned you with his earlier 3bet.

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Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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I'd send you one, but I don't have internet.

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www.OPgotpwned.net/doublepwned/HIV

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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Online I´d bet-3bet against most tags as you aren´t really representing the 7 here, but more likely a think valuebet, so they usually raise good one pair hands and pay off top pair or better.

If David is likely to for the third bet anyway or wont valuebet as much as he should, then I guess check-raise migth be better, but it also lose value from AK/AJ. If you think he actually folds those, then you know how to play your KJ I guess..

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no way do I 3-bet here.. if you want to bet and call a raise thats ok.. but bet/3-bet is spewage

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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bottom pair of sevens overcard kicker bdfd is a nice flop 5 handed. both raisers can easily have an A or be reverse dominated with a big K. also preflop raisers will likely put bb on a bigger hand for him to be c/ring them on that flop after calling two cold preflop. so this c/r might get it heads up, plus it will have serious deception value if hero has been playing sensibly so far. that's a lot of power from one small bet investment extra. the only good play on this flop is to c/r. calling is so weak you will get eaten alive playing that way, and folding is out of the question. donk betting is obviously silly. so the only play is c/r.

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mike if you c/r and he 3-bets its an obvious fold, correct?

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

assumed, that the preflop call is correct. wouldn't anybody fold the turn, wenn davod bets again inteo 2 players?

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

The play on the river doesn't matter, randomize it. This is the only way to prevent David from using his logic to make a perfect play on you.

Re: Analysis and result
 

If I check raise the river 3 things can occur. He 3bets with full house and it will be very tough for me to lay dowm my trips so I would lose 3 bets. He would fold all the rest of the hands and I would make only one bet or he will not bet at all. By leading I wil lose only 2 bets to a full house and made one to the rest of good hands and of course zero to A high.
So I decided to bet, after thinking a while David called and showed me A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and told me that he was very close to raise me on the river.

Re: Bellagio: Hand against David Sklansky LH 100-200
 

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Looks like David owned you with his earlier 3bet.

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indeed. this is why 3-betting suited connectors occasionally rules.

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In my opinion calling before the flop with anything less than AK is suicide against someone like David (even short). Would you call 3 bets on the button with this hand? Why out of position? David shows hands like the 75s so you will play and you did.


I don’t know whether you won this hand but, the turn call was exceptionally horrible. You didn’t pick up a flush draw. You should fold. It doesn’t matter even if you had the best hand on the flop (I can’t imagine you did) because he usually wouldn’t bet since you called three bets from the big blind. What happens if you hit the K on the turn? Will that make someone’s hand better? Are you drawing dead already? David does bluff sometimes but, wow!



If you played till the river I guess you should bet. I can’t imagine if you check raise he wouldn’t call unless he has you beat.


Why not wait for position on a bad player if you want to play crap? I love playing crap vs. bad players! Why mess with a player of his status? I see people give him money in the no limit in the same way. He shows some stupid hand and they are hooked and lose their stack. I always just laugh and smile at David.


God bless you,
Terri

Re: Analysis and result
 

While I was posting on this thread, I noticed you came up with the results. He wouldn't have called the check raise on the river. If you bet and he raises you can fold the trips. Do you think David can't beat K7 if he raises you?
He may have been lying about raising but, your hand didn't make sense. He might not think you are capable of having a 7 there because it wouldn't make sense you would play that bad. There is no reasonable hand you can have here with a 7 in it.