Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

Infamous Commerce player Iris was sent home today for marking the cards. She likes to get a lot of new set-ups when she's losing and since Commerce only allows one new set-up per hour unless there is a damaged card, she takes it upon herself to damage the cards. My neighbor and I caught her and she was sent home by the floorman. Of course, she'll be back tomorrow.

She doesn't mark the cards to cheat, but rather to get new set-ups. But it's not impossible she cheats when she marks them, or that other players are aware of her habit and use the marked card(s) to their advantage. Be alert if you find yourself in a game with her.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

She doesnt mark the cards to cheat, she just bends them to get a new setup, and she doesnt try and conceal this. Now youre telling me to be alert of this? Go away.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

This honestly sounds really nitty.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

Pretty standard from my experience at LA games. I've seen someone intentionally do this a couple times. And the new setup is requested on average about every 20 minutes.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

Scrambooooooool!

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

Simple solution to this is to allow set ups WHENEVER a player requests them. Then just charge the player for a new deck of cards +1 dollar for Administrative fee's.

This would save the casino a ton of dough and would basically pay the casinos cost for new decks.

After dropping 50 dollars in new decks every day Iris would eventually stop asking for setups

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

I [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Iris. More stories please Andy, Iris has been underrepresented in the B&M forum recently!

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

[ QUOTE ]
Simple solution to this is to allow set ups WHENEVER a player requests them. Then just charge the player for a new deck of cards +1 dollar for Administrative fee's.

This would save the casino a ton of dough and would basically pay the casinos cost for new decks.

After dropping 50 dollars in new decks every day Iris would eventually stop asking for setups

[/ QUOTE ]

No, her and all the other tilty fish would just take their business to 1 of the other 300 cardrooms in the Los Angeles metroplex that dont charge for set ups.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

No legit reason any player should be intentionally defacing cards, whether the intent is to cheat or not. It might be nitty to some people, but I think sending her home for the day is good policy. Having to change setups is annoying enough, but the real problem is that you might get players uncomfortable with the game they're in.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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No legit reason any player should be intentionally defacing cards, whether the intent is to cheat or not. It might be nitty to some people, but I think sending her home for the day is good policy. Having to change setups is annoying enough, but the real problem is that you might get players uncomfortable with the game they're in.

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Peronsaly, a perma ban for destroying casino property wouldn't be out of the question in most rooms here. Also, I see lots have gone to "no setups unless something is wrong with the cards" which basically says "nits go home/elsewhere".

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

Good.

I f*cking HATE nits that constantly ask for setups with the hot, fiery passion of a thousand suns. Especially when in the box. These nits deserve a swift kick in the skull instead of the ass when getting tossed out.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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Good.

I f*cking HATE nits that constantly ask for setups with the hot, fiery passion of a thousand suns. Especially when in the box. These nits deserve a swift kick in the skull instead of the ass when getting tossed out.

[/ QUOTE ]

As a player I absolutely LOVE being at a table with as many people who ask for set-ups as often as possible as I can get. I wish EVERYBODY wants to get set-ups. And I play in a time game. If I was in a rake game I'd be asking for them too.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

Oh, I don't mind playing with people who ask for setup changes... having those types at the table isn't a problem in and of itself. From the box I don't care because we don't do it on request if the cards are fine, although we might make the occasional exception for whatever reason. If you're playing 1/2 and you just aren't getting any cards, forget it though.

But no, the superstitious types are good company. Let them ask, just don't go marking cards.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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This honestly sounds really nitty.

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No, anything that gets Iris out of the game is a good thing for the world. She is painful to play with and she doesn't play as poorly as she used to so now there is really no reason for her to exist, other than for random B&M stories I guess.

I think the Commerce staff is going to have quite a party the day she gets perma-banned, moves, quits poker, BUSTOs, or dies.

-DeathDonkey

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

[ QUOTE ]
No legit reason any player should be intentionally defacing cards, whether the intent is to cheat or not. It might be nitty to some people, but I think sending her home for the day is good policy. Having to change setups is annoying enough, but the real problem is that you might get players uncomfortable with the game they're in.

[/ QUOTE ]

Commerce would have to send home half the players in the casino.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

I'd decided not to tell stories about others without their knowledge, but marking the cards deserves the bad publicity.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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I'd decided not to tell stories about others without their knowledge, but marking the cards deserves the bad publicity.

[/ QUOTE ]

Change her name to Siri and nobody will know the difference, or start delivering Gabe stories - your choice.

Question to all: Should Iris be forced to pay for the replacement deck as a penalty since she was found intentionally damaging the deck? Why should the house be forced to eat the cost of the replacement?

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Good.

I f*cking HATE nits that constantly ask for setups with the hot, fiery passion of a thousand suns. Especially when in the box. These nits deserve a swift kick in the skull instead of the ass when getting tossed out.

[/ QUOTE ]

As a player I absolutely LOVE being at a table with as many people who ask for set-ups as often as possible as I can get. I wish EVERYBODY wants to get set-ups. And I play in a time game. If I was in a rake game I'd be asking for them too.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree as long as they don't actually GET the new set-up. It would be very painful to have 2-3 set-ups an hour.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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[ QUOTE ]
I'd decided not to tell stories about others without their knowledge, but marking the cards deserves the bad publicity.

[/ QUOTE ]

Change her name to Siri and nobody will know the difference, or start delivering Gabe stories - your choice.

Question to all: Should Iris be forced to pay for the replacement deck as a penalty since she was found intentionally damaging the deck? Why should the house be forced to eat the cost of the replacement?

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Since the casino doesn't pitch and entire deck, but rather just the bad card, the actual cost to the place was 1/52nd of a deck. Sure...bill her 20cents.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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[ QUOTE ]
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I'd decided not to tell stories about others without their knowledge, but marking the cards deserves the bad publicity.

[/ QUOTE ]

Change her name to Siri and nobody will know the difference, or start delivering Gabe stories - your choice.

Question to all: Should Iris be forced to pay for the replacement deck as a penalty since she was found intentionally damaging the deck? Why should the house be forced to eat the cost of the replacement?

[/ QUOTE ]
Since the casino doesn't pitch and entire deck, but rather just the bad card, the actual cost to the place was 1/52nd of a deck. Sure...bill her 20cents.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think this is true. They always brought a new deck at commerce when I was there two years ago. I think that allowing a setup anytime someone asked but charging a $1 is crazy. People used to use the setups just to get a smoke break and grind the game to a halt. If they did it everytime someone asked there would only be 3 hands delt an hour at commerce tables.

Greg

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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[ QUOTE ]
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I'd decided not to tell stories about others without their knowledge, but marking the cards deserves the bad publicity.

[/ QUOTE ]

Change her name to Siri and nobody will know the difference, or start delivering Gabe stories - your choice.

Question to all: Should Iris be forced to pay for the replacement deck as a penalty since she was found intentionally damaging the deck? Why should the house be forced to eat the cost of the replacement?

[/ QUOTE ]
Since the casino doesn't pitch and entire deck, but rather just the bad card, the actual cost to the place was 1/52nd of a deck. Sure...bill her 20cents.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think this is true. They always brought a new deck at commerce when I was there two years ago. I think that allowing a setup anytime someone asked but charging a $1 is crazy. People used to use the setups just to get a smoke break and grind the game to a halt. If they did it everytime someone asked there would only be 3 hands delt an hour at commerce tables.

Greg

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They don't bring a shrinkwrapped deck. They mix the cards back into new decks and bring those out.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

Ha! I agree - just like those who sit stubbornly with their arms crossed until a certain dealer has left ("terrible dealer"); along with those who throw their cards swiftly at the dealer, meanwhile whining, "New set-up!", "Extra shuffle!"

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Since the casino doesn't pitch and entire deck, but rather just the bad card, the actual cost to the place was 1/52nd of a deck. Sure...bill her 20cents.

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I don't think this is true. They always brought a new deck at commerce when I was there two years ago.

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Many places bring a single replacement card if one is gimped. And when they bring new decks, it isn't a new deck, it's just 52 unique redback and 52 unique greenbacks.

Guess you've never seen the stacks of cards some places keep? 10 green ace of spades in a row, 10 green deuce of spades, 10 three's... All nicely sorted and ready for someone to grab a single card.

No, they don't toss out an entire deck when a single card is bad.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

She drives me crazy in the 60 game. All she wants to do is slow the game down when she is loosing. She is one of the biggest dealer abusers Ive ever seen at the commerce.

The funniest old white lady at the commerce is that Russian lady. She will play for 3 days straight and loose $15,000. Her dealer abuse is so out line and over the top you cant take it seriously.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Simple solution to this is to allow set ups WHENEVER a player requests them. Then just charge the player for a new deck of cards +1 dollar for Administrative fee's.

This would save the casino a ton of dough and would basically pay the casinos cost for new decks.

After dropping 50 dollars in new decks every day Iris would eventually stop asking for setups

[/ QUOTE ]

No, her and all the other tilty fish would just take their business to 1 of the other 300 cardrooms in the Los Angeles metroplex that dont charge for set ups.

[/ QUOTE ]

Um, if they're throwing her out, they are, in essence, telling her to go play somewhere else.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

Commerce is the Capital of Dealer Abuse. Because they tolerate it.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

I understand the sentiment but, of course, with players asking for set-ups you get to play fewer hands against them. The 60-120 game at Commerce is a time collection and it's $216/table/hour.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

The correct punishment, in my judgment, is to ban her from the casino. She was marking a card.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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The correct punishment, in my judgment, is to ban her from the casino. She was marking a card.

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I agree, but if she has been doing it out in the open forever, they have basically been condoning it. It's one thing to ban someone for marking cards, and another to allow them to do it for months, then ban them out of the blue. I think sending her home for the day and telling her if she does it again she will be banned is the best solution.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

I think she plays as poorly as ever, but she's universally regarded, and justly so, as the most horrible person who plays mid-limits at Commerce. And that's saying something.

I agree with Chris. Maybe I'd feel differently if I were playing for a living; I doubt it. I don't care if she were worth two big bets an hour to me all by herself. I hope to never see her again.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

I don't know if anyone has ever caught her or if this was the first time. I agree that if it's not, a warning would be proper; if it is the first time, I'm in favor of one strike and you're out.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

Her dealer abuse is probably the worst there is, because not only is she nasty, but she's racist as well.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

I once had someone slice a card in two with a rubberband at 30/60. I was a little shocked that somebody would be so completely obnoxious over losing a hand. The floor did nothing.

On the topic of rooms tolerating dealer abuse and other crappy behavior... why is this? I talk with a friend who has dealt in Vegas, and when I tell him of the crap people get away with and the little backup dealers get from the floor, he's amazed. Where I work, I'm not allowed to deal anybody out of a hand without the floor's permission. This is absurd. And since the problem players know how to juuuust push the edges of the boundaries, the floor never does anything if they're called over because someone's being a jerk. We have no power and the a-hole players know it. Occasionally I've dealt someone who was skirting the line out of a hand, and the person shaped right the hell up for a while. These people are addicts, and taking away their fix is the only thing that works. On a basic lizard brain level, they respect the firm hand.

But no. We pander instead. Blargh.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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I think she plays as poorly as ever, but she's universally regarded, and justly so, as the most horrible person who plays mid-limits at Commerce. And that's saying something.

I agree with Chris. Maybe I'd feel differently if I were playing for a living; I doubt it. I don't care if she were worth two big bets an hour to me all by herself. I hope to never see her again.

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Andy,

I've long believed that LA cardrooms under-perform* despite the fact they have more B&M games than anywhere else in the world. IMO a big part of this is the amount of awful behavior that is allowed just because a particular customer or group of customers puts in a lot of hours. Iris of course is a classic example. Her despicableness is more than simply bending/marking cards; it's about the other things (e.g racist abusive behavior) you mention in this tread and you and others have mentioned in past threads. It makes a great story on 2+2 but it's really ugly to watch in person.

If the Commerce seriously barred Iris (and perhaps a dozen more of her ilk) and kept at it when new cretins emerge does anyone agree that in the long run far more new customers (the types who realize a card room isn't church but expect at least a small degree of civility) would emerge to replace her?

It stands to reason that in a generally wealthy metro area where about twelve million people live within an hours drive of a card club there just have to be many that like (or would like) poker but stay away because they can't stand being around such unpleasantness. And Iris and her ilk are certainly unpleasant (at least at the tables; I've heard she can be nice on the phone to her family or friends).

~ Rick


* By under-perform I mean that the LA card clubs are immune to new competition, they are half empty during the day and that other clubs (e.g, the typical Indian Casino card room) are run even worse doesn't disprove my point.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

rick - you need this.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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she's universally regarded, and justly so, as the most horrible person who plays mid-limits at Commerce.

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Why? More info please...

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

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the most horrible person who plays mid-limits at Commerce.

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Whoa! I'm probably going to visit Commerce in a month or 2. Can I sweat you when you're in a game with her for a half-hour?

As an aside:

Something like 12-14 years ago there was a guy playing at The Taj who was told that if anybody else ever hit him again HE would be permanently barred.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

You've written on this--eloquently--in the past. I would think that, indeed, a certain percentage of new cardroom customers don't come back after one trip because they are wtiness to the club allowing a jerk (or jerks) beahve like a jerk.

You would know, better than I, what the mentality is that allows the abuse to continue. As a guess, I would venture that the clubs don't really know what it is that makes them successful. Why does Commerce have the large number of high limit games? Do they themselves really know? If they're not sure why they do, they would worry about their business in irrational ways.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

"Can I sweat you when you're in a game with her for a half-hour?"

Sure. PM me any time.

Re: Iris Caught Marking the Cards at Commerce
 

She's abusive, mean-tempered, racist, goes south with chips, and marks the cards.