JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

I'm new to the table-- I've played maybe two orbits? Table seems strange, an inordinate amount of limping, multiway pots, cold calls of 3-bets, etc. BB is mostly loose-passive with the occasional 3-bet PF. SB is relatively normal, I think?

Anyway, I know I stopped the action on the flop, but I'm mostly concerned as to how to proceed on various turns and action.

Full Tilt Poker
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $30/$60
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
Hero: $1137
UTG+1: $2221
CO: $4571
Button: $5211.50
SB: $2928
BB: $3892

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is UTG with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
<font color="#cc0000">Hero raises</font>, 3 folds, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6SB, 3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#cc0000">SB raises</font>, BB calls, Hero...?

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

I like a call of the flop c/r, with the intention of raising SB's turn bet (unless the turn is Ace or 7), followed by a river check.

If checked into on the turn, I would bet a non A/7 turn. If called, bet river as well.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

[ QUOTE ]
I like a call of the flop c/r, with the intention of raising SB's turn bet (unless the turn is Ace or 7), followed by a river check.

If checked into on the turn, I would bet a non A/7 turn. If called, bet river as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

I really think it depends on what BB does, no way i am raising if the BB calls.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

I was gonna write call flop/raise turn for free SD, but the board is pretty sparse, and BB probably doesn't have a hand that folds to 2 on the turn but not 1 often enough for this to be worth it. I would just call down.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

im folding vs unknowns.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

[ QUOTE ]
I like a call of the flop c/r, with the intention of raising SB's turn bet (unless the turn is Ace or 7), followed by a river check.



[/ QUOTE ]

I was going to suggest this but changed my mind. I have no idea why I changed my mind though. I think over this line I slightly prefer to 3bet flop, bet turn and check river. However my favorite is to just call down and hope they value bet something worse the whole way.

I'd like to know if this is the sort of guy that calls with QJ/QT type hands in his small blind or 67s/78s type hands and showing down lets us find out. My default is to assume the medium sooted connectors, but in practice I think it is actually more of the mediocre broadways.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

no one ever folds flop?

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

With 11:1 and closing the action? In that very dry board you even have the implied odds to try and spike a set.

Call and reevaluate the turn.

Edit: and perhaps you are ahead, and perhaps the turn is checked to you

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

this board is totally drawless. if neither sb or bb has a Q, then they are both retards.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

[ QUOTE ]
no one ever folds flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

I do now that I realized BB called 2 cold on the flop. My reading comprehension needs work.

I was so confused that people wanted to fold when I thought it was HU. Now I'm confused that people want to not fold.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

This is the epitome of a drawless board and you have someone cold-calling 2 bets. Fold.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

BB is described as a 'loose-passive'. His flop call might not be very powerful.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

I'd call the flop just for the combined hit a set/retardation from BB factor/maybe we see two cards when a A/K hits the turn. The SB doesnt need a Q of course, but the BB would have to have made a pretty optimistic call to not at least have a Q.

If SB leads the turn, I think you can be pretty sure he has a Q since he is supposed to be decent and has to be concerned about a Q from BB (and even a slowplay from hero). I think you can fold to any turn bet - there certainly is no value in putting in a turn raise, even if you think you are somehow ahead sometimes.

There is at least a longshot that SB has a 7 and BB has 99, but that ia pretty rare, so if the turn goes check/bet, hopefully that reduces the chances of those holdings enough to just give it up (since i guess BB would check 99 there a lot).

So call flop, fold turn.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

I think you can peel here cuz an A/K/7 could give you a free shot at the river and a J gives you the nuts.

Re: JJ on Qxx flop, 30/60 FTP
 

OK... I don't have the HH handy now, but the turn was a 3 (total rainbow). SB bets, BB calls. Just fold? Seems like that's the majority opinion although people have made cases for each option.