Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality Lies
 

I regret to inform you that you’ve been lied to, a whole hell of a lot. Actually, I’m not sure if lie is the right word, but misinformed almost certainly. Here’s the truth; many of the common tournament concepts, strategies, and mentalities written about are [censored] awful. This garbage is so permeated in the poker society that those who don’t spend their life online or get a very good mentor will likely remain in ignorance. So allow me here, to dispel some of the biggest lies you’ve been told.

1. “You can find a better spot”: What? What the [censored]? Listen, any spot that’s good, by which I mean ANY SPOT THAT IS +EV/+cEV is a spot you should take. Now, are there occasionally spots that are +cEV but you should fold because their –EV? Yes. An obvious example is folding AA in a satellite where you have a seat guaranteed. Want a better example than something this simple? Okay here’s one:
I recently played a live 3k event in Melbourne with ~440 entrants. The structure was very deep, very slow, and had high antes. 40% of the field was freeroll qualifiers and probably less than dozen players in the whole field were actually good tournament players. If I was BB the very first hand with a 20k bank at 50/100 with 22, and it folds to the SB who shoves his whole 20k then flips up AKs, I would fold. However, it really does take an example that extreme to make me consider passing up a +cEV spot. SO STOP DOING IT!

2. “You risked your tournament life with that?” I hear this all the time around live tournaments. I guess that’s because with live you normally only get to play one tournament a day and in the case of a major main event, people may have waited months or a whole year for it. Still, that’s absolutely no excuse. Your tournament life has no value outside a sentimental one, so unless you intend to bottle that magic tournament life feeling and selling to Hallmark for a [censored] Christmas card, stop wasting your time with this mentality. What really has value in tournaments? Chips. If you’re opponents in a live tournament don’t occasionally tell you something like “dude, you’re insane!” you probably aren’t playing right. A good example of how people get nitty with their tournament lives is shoving ranges and restealing all in. An example: About 15-20 players from the money In a WSOP $1500 event it was folded to me with J5o on the button with 11 BB’s with antes in play. Both blinds were standard weak tight live players. I jammed because I know how insane tight their calling ranges are, especially moderately close to the bubble. The SB thought for about 8 years before calling with AQo, then the BB folded AQs face up. When I turned my hand over the table let out various insults for putting my stack in with J5o. The real mentality you need to have is a willingness to bust if it means creating +EV spots. Just because you waited a long time to play this tournament doesn’t mean you have an excuse to play bad.

3. “I didn’t want to risk it on a coin flip” This has got to be one of the most common. Here’s the simple truth with most probable coin flip situations: At the point you’re considering folding knowing you’re likely in a coin flip, there’s already probably way too much money in the pot to ever fold. If you raise AQo 3X and a guy shoves 15-20X, and you figure his range is AJ+/66+ (You’re about 43.5% against his pretty tight, never stealing range, and still basically flipping) you ARE NOT folding. There’s nothing wrong with getting it in on a flip as long as it’s a +EV one, which most are, especially once antes kick in.

4. “My opponents are very good, I’m going to avoid trouble.” Look, you need to have confidence in your game. If you really feel you are surrounded by players who are much better than you, you’re likely in the wrong tournament (unless you won a satellite or something like that.) Odds are, your opponents aren’t as good as you give them credit for or their results may suggest. I encourage you to have confidence bordering on delusional hubris. It’s okay to tighten up a little if you do find yourself at a table of superior players, but don’t nit it up to the point where they can run over you and you’re to paralyzed to stop them. Tournament poker can be pretty soul crushing, but showing up to the table feeling defeated just about guarantees it.

5. “Tournament poker is about survival.” No it’s really not. It’s about accumulation to enable the creation of +EV spots. I think this has been covered pretty well in the portions, but this is another common one I believe to be totally false.

Alright, that’s what I have for now. If anyone has any other common ones they’d like to suggest I can go over them. Hope this helps and of course, all questions are welcome.

Also, sorry I’ve been kind of absent lately. Most nights I like to scan the forum and post on some hands. I had some live poker to play then got Halo 3 (Bond18 on Xbox live, hit me up) so ya know, been running short on time.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

"Listen, any spot that’s good, by which I mean ANY SPOT THAT IS +EV/+cEV is a spot you should take."

this is so key to advancing one's tournament game. nothing to add but good post.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Sweet post, I like and enjoy these. Keep it up.

So what happened with your J5 vs AQ?

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Very nice post, gonna try and dig up the rest of these.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

[ QUOTE ]
Sweet post, I like and enjoy these. Keep it up.

So what happened with your J5 vs AQ?

[/ QUOTE ]

psh dont be results oriented.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

[ QUOTE ]
I encourage you to have confidence bordering on delusional hubris.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm going to frame this and put it by my computer.
I LOVE IT!!

"delusional hubris" !! sounds like something my boss would
say about me.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Excellent post, I love this series, thanks.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

I must be blind, but I can't find part 5 of this series, anyone got a link?

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

[ QUOTE ]
I must be blind, but I can't find part 5 of this series, anyone got a link?

[/ QUOTE ]

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...ue#Post12644880

Also, all of them are stored in my blog at www.tworags.com as well.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Thanks mate.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

As usual, nice post Sir! Thanks for this.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Bonds have you done a well?

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

You get the comments online just as much, really. Your most elaborate plays will always get berated; despite the fact that they're +EV.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Thank you bond - another excellent post - I hope this series will be posted in the anthology once it is finished, so that every newcommer to this forum can read it.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

[ QUOTE ]
I encourage you to have confidence bordering on delusional hubris.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is a really great sentence, bond. wow. a+

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Timex has a statement in his "well" that says something along the lines of "I don't know which cash game players would be good tourney players because in order to win a tourney, you have to do all sorts of 'crazy [censored].'" Really, that "crazy [censored]" is creating a +EV situation in spots where every other player would think you are "insane." It comes from really thinking about stack sizes, position, blind structures, etc. This is an excellent post, bond. It's interesting how I believe I can lose, say, 3/4 70/30s in a given session and still come up ahead because there is other [censored] in my game that can get me to win. The last MTT I was in, building a stack from 1K to 15K without showdown felt pretty damn good. We all need to really understand what Bond is saying here and keep it to heart. But don't get to overboard - borderline dilusional hubris is not the same as dilusional hubris itself [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

Barry

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

what about bad mentalities concerning big stacks... both "i should call because i have so many chips.." and "i should just fold because he has so many chips.."

those both seem very wrong to me.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality Lies
 

Good stuff Bond.

W/out reading all the replies, I'd also add, "Fold, you've got nothing invested." Completely illogical.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality Lies
 

"Fold, you still have lots of chips left"

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

[ QUOTE ]
Thank you bond - another excellent post - I hope this series will NOT be posted in the anthology once it is finished, so that every newcommer to this forum canNOT read it.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Good stuff Bond..real insightful

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Very nice stuff - as usual. Thank you very much for those insights!

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality Lies
 

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It’s okay to tighten up a little if you do find yourself at a table of superior players, but don’t nit it up to the point where they can run over you and you’re to paralyzed to stop them.

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This is such an important concept. As a novice with nitty DNA, I've just begun to learn this lesson the hard way. Thoughtful, observant players (live and online) will pick up on your rigidity and put you in missile lock. By the time you decide to switch gears and fight back, it's often way too late.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality Lies
 

What about the mantra "the only hand that calls you is a hand that beats you"?

Surely this is true for some bets, but can't it lead to missed value bets, particularly on the end? Do you think this admonishment is over-applied?

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality Lies
 

Bond, your posts lately are gems. This series is incredible. thank you for it.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

[ QUOTE ]
What about the mantra "the only hand that calls you is a hand that beats you"?

Surely this is true for some bets, but can't it lead to missed value bets, particularly on the end? Do you think this admonishment is over-applied?

[/ QUOTE ]

I actually think this one serves some purpose if a player is doing proper hand reading and thinking about what villains hand range is. I don't think i'd put this with the list, thought it might be applied a little to leisurely.

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Here's one:

"I can't play THIS hand on the button here."

Yes, you can.

"I'm OOP, so I will fold."

There are things you can do OOP. Just think about it.

"I don't want to get called by a dominating ace."

stop it. If you have a chance to make a strong push with the proper stack sizes, you have to do it. Your weak ace is almost never worse than 30%. And remember you have FE.

"I have xx, so I can't call here against this short stack push because it's 25% of my stack. I'll find a better spot.

Please consider the size of the pot and your stack size. If it's +EV, it's +EV, end of story.

Barry

Re: Things it took me a while to learn part 6, Strategy and Mentality
 

Bond,

Im a big fan of posts likes this that going against the flow in a way and there's waaaay to few of them on 2+2 overall which actually can make reading 2+2, esp the low limit forums hurt more than it gives for some semi-newbie players because about everyone is more or less in the Sklansky/Malmuth-thinking about all the time and/or unable to think about the box.

however, some of the things you wrote here are good. some of the things you stated are overvalued "rules" for many players but some of them actually makes a lot of sense.

for example: I dont know how familiar you are with ICM etc. but a play that is +cEV can be very -$EV, even with a normal pay-out structure, especially late in a tournament and survival IS important in many ways.

I havent read the other 6 of these posts but I will do it and maybe come back with some more (hopefully constructive) critisim.