fold 22 preflop?
 

Prima Network No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (5 handed) Hand History converter Courtesy of PokerZion.com

Hero ($60.16)
Button ($49.90)
SB ($57.39)
BB ($13.13)
UTG ($41.63)

Preflop: Hero is MP with 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls $0.50, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises to $2.5</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises to $4.5</font>, Hero ??

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

lol easy fold son

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

donk open limp with pps - i open raise any pp in any position. this is the most standard fold we're likely to see in the micro forum today.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

the more I play, the more I'm not so sure blindly raising every pocket pair from every position is the best way for how many tables play. If the table is full of people who are going to call I don't really see a point in raising the very small pocket pairs up front, when 90% of the time you're going to end up with 2+ calls behind you and having to play out of position. Ya you increase the pot size for when you hit, blah blah. Personally I've had most of my luck with getting paid with sets when someone else has the lead.

I'm just saying I don't think anything should be set in stone like some people see things.

And easy fold.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

I agree that this is an easy fold, but I want to tell you my thought process in deciding whether it is. Maybe it's bad math on my part. First, you're about 7 1/2 to 1 to hit your set on the flop. When it gets back to you, you have to put in four more bucks. (Your first fifty cents is already in the pot.) So in order to make it positive expected value, you need to win at least 30 bucks (7.5 times four) from the other players if you hit. And that's assuming that you don't have a set over set situation, so it's surely more than the 30. Do you think you're going to get that much? One dude only has a $14 stack.

More important, you don't even know if you will end up putting in only four bucks preflop. The original raiser could come over the top and then you're screwed.

Really though, on this particular hand I wouldn't really give it that much thought. It's too clearly a fold.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

Easiest call. BB hand here is irrelevant. If SB hits, all money goes in.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

You are discounting SB could raise again...
I fold

Edit to add I raise PF

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

oh please lets not get into how much you have to put in to make set mining profitable - its been covered comprehensively and if you feel like searching 2+2 for it its prolly in the stickies.

whats the alternative then? im never gonna be folding 44-55 UTG and the way i figure it at a tight table your FE plus set value make it well worth it - at a loose table the prospect of a set in multiway pots gives you enormous IO and you can get away from low pps cheaply as can be seen above.
whilst i agree its unwise to follow a line blindly i dont think i will ever be revising my pp play barring some incredible relevation.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

So then, Bishop, if you are just calling the four bucks here, what are you going to do when the first raiser reraises it to 20 or pushes all in to isolate Mister 13 bucks? Whether its 22, 33, 44, 55 or whatever here, folding here is a no brainer.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

i folded.
2 came in flop.
SB had a big hand, so i would have got all the money, thats what make me think about it again.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

Well, I'' take my chances against SB's raising. But then again, I would sure raise 22 preflop first.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

I'd have raised it first in, but this is an easy fold. We clearly don't have the implied odds, or the dead $ from BB to make this a call

Crovax

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
the more I play, the more I'm not so sure blindly raising every pocket pair from every position is the best way for how many tables play. If the table is full of people who are going to call I don't really see a point in raising the very small pocket pairs up front, when 90% of the time you're going to end up with 2+ calls behind you and having to play out of position. Ya you increase the pot size for when you hit, blah blah. Personally I've had most of my luck with getting paid with sets when someone else has the lead.


[/ QUOTE ]

I really agree with this. I think some people just raise pf with any pocket pair regardless of their position and how the table is playing. I think it is good at tight tables, but not nesseccarily that good at tables full of calling stations.

Like the other week a posted a hand i was playing at a loose table. There were 2 limpers so i just completed the SB with my pocket 7s. Really dont see much point in raising here where I know I'm going to get a call and end up oop in a raised pot with a hand that isn't great unless I flop a set.

Real value comes when you flop a set vs overpairs. Say you open raise with a small pocket pair, and someone with aces sticks in a big reraise, you should probably fold (or not depending on how deep you both are). Now we just lost our chance to bust his aces if we flop a set.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Real value comes when you flop a set vs overpairs. Say you open raise with a small pocket pair, and someone with aces sticks in a big reraise, you should probably fold (or not depending on how deep you both are). Now we just lost our chance to bust his aces if we flop a set.

[/ QUOTE ]
Then are you open limping with it or folding?

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

PP's probably contribute about 2/3 of my winrate. If opponents could possibly put me on a small pocket every time I raise a bunch of limpers in SB it would probably be half that.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

Probably just limp, I sometimes raise. It depends on my position at the table, how loose the other players at the table are ect...
I'm just saying you shouldn't always open raise or always open limp. You should do what is best at the time at the table your at.

It's nice to show down a small - medium pocket pair after you have raised pf. It makes it a bit more likely ppl will call you with hands like AT when you have them dominated raising with AK / AQ.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
the more I play, the more I'm not so sure blindly raising every pocket pair from every position is the best way for how many tables play. If the table is full of people who are going to call I don't really see a point in raising the very small pocket pairs up front, when 90% of the time you're going to end up with 2+ calls behind you and having to play out of position. Ya you increase the pot size for when you hit, blah blah. Personally I've had most of my luck with getting paid with sets when someone else has the lead.

[/ QUOTE ]

wtf.. the whole point in raising any low pocket pairs in any position is for set value, if you flop it your going to get paid off really big specially if you say theres 4+ calling stations calling behind or whatever... this would encourage me to raise it up even more as the implied odds will be great.

big pots for big hands.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
So then, Bishop, if you are just calling the four bucks here, what are you going to do when the first raiser reraises it to 20 or pushes all in to isolate Mister 13 bucks? Whether its 22, 33, 44, 55 or whatever here, folding here is a no brainer.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol at you - read the whole post before you respond before you start flaming you cretin.

2nd response in the thread i say this is the most standard fold we're likely to see today. moran.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

Learn how to spell moron before you use it in conversation. Misspelling it is tellingly ironic.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

OP the title of your thread is awesome DUCY

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

this thread is retarded

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
PP's probably contribute about 2/3 of my winrate. If opponents could possibly put me on a small pocket every time I raise a bunch of limpers in SB it would probably be half that.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not quite sure what this means. Could you elaborate?

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Easiest call. BB hand here is irrelevant. If SB hits, all money goes in.

[/ QUOTE ]

Pretty sure this would be a terrible call. If SB has a real hand, he reraises in the SB to put BB all-in. If SB doesn't have a real hand, then we definitely don't have the implied odds that we need.

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

OT:

Is it wrong to fold 22 UTG/MP in 6-max? What if half the table is short stacking?

Re: fold 22 preflop?
 

Can someone lock this thread? This is retarded.