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-   -   Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=557902)

OvrTheTop111 11-30-2007 11:13 AM

Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
Hey guys, its been a while.

Live 3/6 game

Villian (BB) is a pretty good TA player who i've played with before. My image is also very TA, but I'm not sure if BB has been playing attention (he has been on his phone alot)

Hero is dealt A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] in the CO

2 limpers to Hero who raises
Button calls
Sb fold
BB 3 Bets
2 limpers fold
Hero ???

Since villian has been pretty tight, I put his 3-bet range around 10-10+ or AJs+ AKo.

How many people are smooth calling here? I figure if I 4-bet he is going to put me on AA or KK and all further deception is lost in the hand.

Hero calls, as does Button

Flop : J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (11 sb)

BB bets
Hero raises
button folds
BB 3-bets
Hero ???

You've got to put him on JJ+ now right? How many are smooth calling again here? Once again for deception, hoping to raise him on the turn. How many are 4-betting? I thought that 4-betting would allow me to determine where i'm at, if I'm raised again he has JJ and im in trouble.

guvnorg 11-30-2007 11:21 AM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
I like a smooth call and then a raise on the turn. If he re-raises you're probably just calling him down. I think given he's been on the phone and you slow played PF (to an extent) he's not 100% putting you on even an overpair here at this point.

fuzz66 11-30-2007 11:45 AM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
preflop is OK IMO

flop: you got the desired result, so 4-bet. if he makes it 5, i slow down. does any one waite for the turn to raise here? your either WA or WB, and im going with WA, so i might waite till 4th street to turn on the jets.

leo doc 11-30-2007 12:29 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
I'd like the pf smooth call a lot more if it was hu. With button in, I 4-bet it.

fuzz66 11-30-2007 12:45 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
wow, i didnt notice that. 4 bet preflop

SNOWBALL 11-30-2007 12:57 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
4bet PF.
Given how you played it, I think your plan for the turn is fine.

Grease 11-30-2007 01:57 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
[ QUOTE ]
I'd like the pf smooth call a lot more if it was hu. With button in, I 4-bet it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree wholeheartedly. HU IP, you can get sexy, but with another player in (not to mention you're OOP against the button) push your equity now.

Given that you underrepresented your hand PF, you can call here and pop the turn if you like, or just charge him now. That's the great thing about being in position; you can take people apart at your leisure.

Question for the forums: If we raise the turn and he treys, are we folding the river UI?

leo doc 11-30-2007 02:15 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'd like the pf smooth call a lot more if it was hu. With button in, I 4-bet it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree wholeheartedly. HU IP, you can get sexy, but with another player in (not to mention you're OOP against the button) push your equity now.

Given that you underrepresented your hand PF, you can call here and pop the turn if you like, or just charge him now. That's the great thing about being in position; you can take people apart at your leisure.

Question for the forums: If we raise the turn and he treys, are we folding the river UI?

[/ QUOTE ]
Not if he's still on the phone.

Scarmiglio 11-30-2007 02:23 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
[ QUOTE ]
Question for the forums: If we raise the turn and he treys, are we folding the river UI?

[/ QUOTE ]
Heck no! We've underrepresented our hand. He's putting us on AJ or something like that and figures his QQ or KK is good. If he 3-bet the turn I'm likely to just call down, but I'm never folding the river.

Hyperrrprank 11-30-2007 02:50 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
By slowplaying our hand PF we encourage him to play weaker hands more aggressively. That means we're not getting away from showing this down unless the board is way worse than this.

The advantage we get from deception is limited since we now have a harder time putting him on a hand. Assuming he has JJ here when we didn't cap PF is a big mistake.

jesse8888 11-30-2007 03:03 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
I have never called when raising was an option PF in limit holdem, and it's working out pretty well for me. I prefer a raise pf...sure it's deceptive, but against two opponents right now your equity is ginormous.

On the flop, I smooth call the raise, then pop him on the turn. If he pops back, it's call-down time. By under-repping your hand you have lost the ability to fold.

jesse8888 11-30-2007 03:09 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
I lied...I have limp/re-raised with AA with maniacs behind me. But I've never declined to 3,4 or 5 bet.

One more thing: If you put him on JJ+, which is very reasonable, you should note that you're KILLING his range.

AA = 1
KK = 6
QQ = 6
JJ = 3

You're a 4:1 favorite, which is why I advocate waiting for the turn to hit him with a big bet. If he 3 bets there, then his range tightens up a bit and you should probably call down. However, if a jack hits on the turn....you might be able to put in a 4th bet?

OvrTheTop111 12-01-2007 01:01 PM

Re: Smooth Calling a 3-bet PF with AA
 
Thanks for all of the replys guys! I really appreciate your input.


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