Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

All villains are TAG regulars.

******* Hand 1 ********

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $3/$6
4 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $909.40
TWP: $661
SB: $785.15
BB: $644

Pre-flop: (4 players) TWP is Button with 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
UTG folds, <font color="#cc0000">TWP raises to $24</font>, <font color="#cc0000">SB raises to $84</font>, BB folds, TWP calls.

Flop: 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($174, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">SB bets $130</font>, TWP calls.

Turn: Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($434, 2 players)
SB checks, <font color="#cc0000">TWP bets $285</font>


******* Hand 2 ********

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $3/$6
5 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $591
TWP: $852
Button: $441.05
SB: $813.45
BB: $715.50

Pre-flop: (5 players) TWP is CO with 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
UTG folds, <font color="#cc0000">TWP raises to $24</font>, Button folds, SB calls, BB folds.

Flop: 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($54, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">SB bets $18</font>, <font color="#cc0000">TWP raises to $105</font>, SB calls.

Turn: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($264, 2 players)
SB checks, <font color="#cc0000">TWP bets $198</font>


******* Hand 3 ********

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $3/$6
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
TWP: $600
UTG+1: $173.25
CO: $316.15
Button: $604
SB: $167.05
BB: $581.35

Pre-flop: (6 players) TWP is UTG with 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
<font color="#cc0000">TWP raises to $24</font>, 4 folds, BB calls.

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($51, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">BB bets $24</font>, <font color="#cc0000">TWP raises to $96</font>, BB calls.

Turn: J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($243, 2 players)
BB checks, <font color="#cc0000">TWP bets $168</font>, BB calls.

River: 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($579, 2 players)
BB checks, <font color="#cc0000">TWP is all-in $312</font>

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

1.)
On which handrange to you put villian on? (PP's taht hate to see the A here???)
The prob is, that many draws are out there an the Q shouldn't me a big scarecard here. But I'm not sure. :P
Another question... do you think every spade that turns or rivers is a good bluffout for us?


2.)
Again the question... on which range do yo put villian?
The turn is again not a really scarecard that will most of the time not helped you.
Do you try to get a fold from a QJs-type hand?


3.)
hm i am not sure about the river bluff... villian is getting such good odds to call and showed on a board w/o many draws that he is willing to play
also the river is again to scarecard.
I like Flop and Turn but at the river i would give up.


Nice post i hope to get some feedback.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

[ QUOTE ]
1.)
On which handrange to you put villian on? (PP's taht hate to see the A here???)
The prob is, that many draws are out there an the Q shouldn't me a big scarecard here. But I'm not sure. :P
Another question... do you think every spade that turns or rivers is a good bluffout for us?


[/ QUOTE ]
I think he would probably just fire again with a big hand, but he's a good reg so he can definitely mix it up. And the Q is a scare card for AK/KK so I actually thought it was a pretty good card for me, although I was probably firing on any turn card anyways.


[ QUOTE ]
2.)
Again the question... on which range do yo put villian?
The turn is again not a really scarecard that will most of the time not helped you.
Do you try to get a fold from a QJs-type hand?


[/ QUOTE ]
I put him on a weak K or QJ, maybe a T. Once the T hit on the turn, I thought he might be more likely to fold a weak K, but again I was probably firing any turn card here.

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3.)
hm i am not sure about the river bluff... villian is getting such good odds to call and showed on a board w/o many draws that he is willing to play
also the river is again to scarecard.
I like Flop and Turn but at the river i would give up.


[/ QUOTE ]
Again, just trying to get him to fold a weak Q, pretty much.

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Nice post i hope to get some feedback.

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Thanks. Me too.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

From best to worst: 2 &gt; 1 &gt;&gt; 3.

I think 2 is likely to work 60%, 1 about 50% (so many hand crai'ing you i think), 3 like 15-20% perhaps.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

1. About 70%. Against decent hand readers, tight guys, or wont make heroic calls guys there's a lot of value in delaying this bluff until the river though.

2. villain is a TAG reg? not sure what to make of this without more of a read. I still think it's more likely dumb-price-in or dumb-feeler-bet than abuse-TWP-aggression-by-donking-a-good-hand-into-him so the turn will work a lot.

3. Not sure, i'm never certain in these situations if i'm either going to look like an idiot when he snaps single pair or a genius when he folds thinking i can't be bluffing due to it only being half pot river bet.

2 &gt; 1 &gt; 3 for me too.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

First one looks the worst to me unless you have history with him where you've flatcalled reraises with Ax hands. If he folded here then he either had air or he played it bad.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

Well, I'm assuming he knows that I never fold anything ever so Ax hands are well well well within my range. You and I haven't played together much (at all?) but pretty much everyone else in these games knows that I never fold to reraises.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

2 looks good 1 isn't bad and i don't like 3

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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Well, I'm assuming he knows that I never fold anything ever so Ax hands are well well well within my range. You and I haven't played together much (at all?) but pretty much everyone else in these games knows that I never fold to reraises.

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I think we played about 3 hands together at which point I left because the fish at that table had all left...

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

I like the 3rd one the best

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

2 probably worked, 3 might have worked, doubtful 1 worked

but these hands are so [censored] alien that i could be way off

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

1) Pretty standard bluff given your preflop play (which I dont like in a vacuum). We should consider waiting till the river as well.

2) I hate the play overall as villain rarely folds to the flop raise and a lot of cards complete possible draws. As played the turn bet is good. I like a call flop/raise-bluff turn plan better. Still I would usually just fold the flop.

3) Looks like a dark tunnel bluff to me. What were you putting him on?

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

[ QUOTE ]
2 probably worked, 3 might have worked, doubtful 1 worked

but these hands are so [censored] alien that i could be way off

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You really think these are so alien? You just fold flop in all hands or what? You're a lot better than I am, but two of them worked (and similar hands have worked in the past) so I'm not sure what to make of that.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

i think just hand 1, but maybe 3 if villain has any sense, which is not likely given the 24 dollar flop bet.

why is the river in hand 3 a scare card????


[ QUOTE ]
1.)
On which handrange to you put villian on? (PP's taht hate to see the A here???)
The prob is, that many draws are out there an the Q shouldn't me a big scarecard here. But I'm not sure. :P
Another question... do you think every spade that turns or rivers is a good bluffout for us?


2.)
Again the question... on which range do yo put villian?
The turn is again not a really scarecard that will most of the time not helped you.
Do you try to get a fold from a QJs-type hand?


3.)
hm i am not sure about the river bluff... villian is getting such good odds to call and showed on a board w/o many draws that he is willing to play
also the river is again to scarecard.
I like Flop and Turn but at the river i would give up.


Nice post i hope to get some feedback.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

think he meant 'again no scarecard'

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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but two of them worked

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You were definitely ahead in hand2 and sometimes even in the other 2 in case villain folded.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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2 probably worked, 3 might have worked, doubtful 1 worked

but these hands are so [censored] alien that i could be way off

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You really think these are so alien? You just fold flop in all hands or what? You're a lot better than I am, but two of them worked (and similar hands have worked in the past) so I'm not sure what to make of that.

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the 1st one is... overexaggerated a bit on the other two

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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but two of them worked

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You were definitely ahead in hand2 and sometimes even in the other 2 in case villain folded.

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LOL. Good one.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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2 probably worked, 3 might have worked, doubtful 1 worked

but these hands are so [censored] alien that i could be way off

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You really think these are so alien? You just fold flop in all hands or what? You're a lot better than I am, but two of them worked (and similar hands have worked in the past) so I'm not sure what to make of that.

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the 1st one is... overexaggerated a bit on the other two

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You fold hand 1 preflop?

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

i don't get it, his hand looks like KK or JJ and our hand looks like AQ AK.. hand 1 seems the best

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First one looks the worst to me unless you have history with him where you've flatcalled reraises with Ax hands. If he folded here then he either had air or he played it bad.

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Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
2 probably worked, 3 might have worked, doubtful 1 worked

but these hands are so [censored] alien that i could be way off

[/ QUOTE ]
You really think these are so alien? You just fold flop in all hands or what? You're a lot better than I am, but two of them worked (and similar hands have worked in the past) so I'm not sure what to make of that.

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I feel these types of plays are usually very profitable.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

hand 1 is a fold unless yo uactually believe him or if you're willing to make some raises on teh flop

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2 probably worked, 3 might have worked, doubtful 1 worked

but these hands are so [censored] alien that i could be way off

[/ QUOTE ]
You really think these are so alien? You just fold flop in all hands or what? You're a lot better than I am, but two of them worked (and similar hands have worked in the past) so I'm not sure what to make of that.

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the 1st one is... overexaggerated a bit on the other two

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You fold hand 1 preflop?

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Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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but two of them worked

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You were definitely ahead in hand2 and sometimes even in the other 2 in case villain folded.

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LOL. Good one.

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It`s true though.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

Hand 1 is against the tightest opponent and one of the tightest regs. So I dont think I can fold it preflop against him. (At least he used to be tight. Now he'll probably be a lagtard against me. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] )

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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but two of them worked

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You were definitely ahead in hand2 and sometimes even in the other 2 in case villain folded.

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LOL. Good one.

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It`s true though.

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It was funny the first time, but now the joke is over.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

leveled?????

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but two of them worked

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You were definitely ahead in hand2 and sometimes even in the other 2 in case villain folded.

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LOL. Good one.

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It`s true though.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

hate hand 2

hand 3 is ballsy and might've worked - you certainly sold it well

hand 1 is only any good if you call there with a wide range (AA/AK/sets/draws) - you probably don't, so raising the flop &gt; floating and betting

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

of course i call there with a wide range. why wouldn't I? i dont see any reason to raise any hands on the flop there at all, really. if i have a strong hand, give him rope - he's drawing slim. if i have a weak hand, call and hope to bust up a monster from him. his range is so polarized, i dont think there's much value in raising against it.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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I like the 3rd one the best

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lol it sucks.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

What's everyone's big problem with 3? Villain looks primed for a c/c c/f line.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

I personally think hand 2 is the worst. Weak lead + call from pfr always leads to dixville. The ten on the turn also makes it easier for him to call any bet.

I hated hand 3, but I think a weak TAG folds a decent Q a fair amount of the time, so I have grown to like it the most.

Hand 1 you were probably snap called, but it has merit. I like the way you played it, but a lot of good players will either c/c or crai here.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

wtf, can we please stop with the leveling here?

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What's everyone's big problem with 3? Villain looks primed for a c/c c/f line.

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Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

what do you think villain's hand range is here??

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I personally think hand 2 is the worst. Weak lead + call from pfr always leads to dixville. The ten on the turn also makes it easier for him to call any bet.

I hated hand 3, but I think a weak TAG folds a decent Q a fair amount of the time, so I have grown to like it the most.

Hand 1 you were probably snap called, but it has merit. I like the way you played it, but a lot of good players will either c/c or crai here.

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Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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Hand 1 is against the tightest opponent and one of the tightest regs. So I dont think I can fold it preflop against him.

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Nonsense alert !

I only kinda like hand no 1 (he folds KK/JJ/TT = 9combos, calls AK/QQ = 15 combos so probably its worth it given that you will see river anyway).
Rest are random bluffs with random hands and I dont believe playing taht way may be profitable vs anybody (well maybe vs some it is but those ppl are rare).

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

maybe not... it's def not total nonsense here.....

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Hand 1 is against the tightest opponent and one of the tightest regs. So I dont think I can fold it preflop against him.

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Nonsense alert !

I only kinda like hand no 1 (he folds KK/JJ/TT = 9combos, calls AK/QQ = 15 combos so probably its worth it given that you will see river anyway).
Rest are random bluffs with random hands and I dont believe playing may be profitable vs anybody (well maybe vs some it is).

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Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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maybe not... it's def not total nonsense here.....

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I understand why ppl think it make sense.
I think its total bs though. The tigher the range the tighter you should play. "But he will go broke more often" is not enough, just do some math and see.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

i guess you're right, given the shallowness of the stacks and the fact he cant possiby be just playing AA or KK here is enough, the times that he has AK here, which for argument sake is equal to the times he has KK or AA, should make it more of fold situation... and this is discounting queens and Aq which have even a less tendency to go broke when you hit sets.

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maybe not... it's def not total nonsense here.....

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I understand why ppl think it make sense.
I think its total bs though. The tigher the range the tighter you should play. "But he will go broke more often" is not enough, just do some math and see.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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think he meant 'again no scarecard'

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yes that's right

my english sucks and i was writing fast :P

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

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maybe not... it's def not total nonsense here.....

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I understand why ppl think it make sense.
I think its total bs though. The tigher the range the tighter you should play. "But he will go broke more often" is not enough, just do some math and see.

[/ QUOTE ]
How about "He will fold on every board he doesn't like and I know pretty much exactly which boards he doesn't like?" Would that be enough of a justification? FWIW, he tanked forever and folded.

Re: Bluffs: Which ones worked?
 

but think about the amount of money you burn when you're incorrect... if he plays trap a donk, this becomes even harder... especially if he mixes in PF reraises with maybe between 1/2 and 3/4 of his AK

you're gonig to be wrong floating with 44 on the flop sometimes... you'll be committing a pretty fishy mistake when that happens...

unless you float and hit your miracle 2 outer and stack AK... that's always fun.

but then you'll never float in this town again.



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maybe not... it's def not total nonsense here.....

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I understand why ppl think it make sense.
I think its total bs though. The tigher the range the tighter you should play. "But he will go broke more often" is not enough, just do some math and see.

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How about "He will fold on every board he doesn't like and I know pretty much exactly which boards he doesn't like?" Would that be enough of a justification? FWIW, he tanked forever and folded.

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