Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

ban the OP please.

my head is asploding more due to his posts than it would if I was JC Tran in that pot.

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

Clearly the correct decision.

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

it's a tournament, you CAN NOT muck a hand in an allin situation! cant' believe this name pro (never really heard about this tourney guy) is crying over the fact that he got beat.. yes it suck that the guy threw his hand away (we dont know for sure, he might have tried to flip them with chips and it looks like he added chips to the pot afterwards) but it's a bad beat, everyone xp it

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

Clearly the correct ruling.

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

Have not read the thread, and I do think that based on Foxwoods procedure, the correct outcome probably occurred. But, at most tournament venues, even in allin situations, dealers allow people to open muck their hands.

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

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Have not read the thread, and I do think that based on Foxwoods procedure, the correct outcome probably occurred. But, at most tournament venues, even in allin situations, dealers allow people to open muck their hands.

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Can anyone confirm Shane Schleger has enough live mtt experience to know what he is talking about more than most who responded in this thread? For anyone regurgitating what they've read about the correct ruling being made, pls re read the OP. Let me put it to you this way, if it's possible to get your minds around....Consider neither rules were in place and there was a void needing be filled in the tournament rules. Would you carry over the thought process behind the cash game rule for these situations? or implement the current rule, cards up no matter what as long as they are 100% certain they have the correct 2 cards (which is just another ludicrous variable in this rule)?

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

ban the OP please.

he is either retarded or this is a level, and either way, he should be banned.

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

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Have not read the thread, and I do think that based on Foxwoods procedure, the correct outcome probably occurred. But, at most tournament venues, even in allin situations, dealers allow people to open muck their hands.

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Can anyone confirm Shane Schleger has enough live mtt experience to know what he is talking about more than most who responded in this thread?

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Shane has plenty of experience, and he is right that dealers have allowed people to open muck. but that doesnt mean the dealers were doing what they were supposed to.
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For anyone regurgitating what they've read about the correct ruling being made, pls re read the OP. Let me put it to you this way, if it's possible to get your minds around....Consider neither rules were in place and there was a void needing be filled in the tournament rules. Would you carry over the thought process behind the cash game rule for these situations? or implement the current rule, cards up no matter what as long as they are 100% certain they have the correct 2 cards (which is just another ludicrous variable in this rule)?

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There are only two options. 1) Leave the rule how it is and force every hand to be turned over when an all-in happens. 2) Remove the rule and let players muck when they want.
The second option is not going to happen as it has been one of the reasons for the success of televised poker. This rule has not been around forever though. It was instituted in 2001, and I hated the rule at the time. And although I still hate it I would agree that it has done way more good than bad. I wrote about it briefly in a column in 2002.
“8. All cards will be turned faceup once a player is all in and all action is complete.”
“I hate this rule. No, actually I despise it. I have had discussions with many players about this rule, and to my surprise, it seems I am in the minority in not liking it. The No. 1 reason that I have been given in favor of the rule is that it speeds up play in cases where no one will turn his hand up. In all the years I have been playing poker, I have seen this situation happen perhaps a dozen times. The reason I really don't like the rule is that I honestly believe it will make people play their hands differently. Not only will it make the bad players play better, it will make the good players play differently. A rule that changes the play of the game is, in my opinion, very bad.”

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

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the guy shoulda shipped JC the pot in exchange for a 1% stake in JC. More equity

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lol. vn

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

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Buddy, if the guy intentionally jammed his cards under the pile of muck laying in the middle of the table, there is NO way to tell which 2 are his....

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He didn't.

I personally much prefer the rule as-is since there is no angle-shoot available by the play that was made, but if cards were declared dead by touching the muck, you would see people trying to get winning hands declared dead by claiming it touched the muck.

For the other comment about getting up and walking away from the table while all-in, didn't Kevin McBride walk away from the table after going all-in vs. Scotty Nguyen while heads-up at the 1998 main event without his hand getting mucked?

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

I don't understand why everybody always get so bent out of shape over this kind of situation (assuming for the moment it was a bad ruling, even though it wasn't). If 'villain' wasn't a moron, the hand would have played out the same and Tran would have lost too. So because villain is a moron that tries to muck his hand, he suddenly feels bad about losing the hand. I don't get this. He wants to win a pot he is only entitled to by some technicality and is upset when he doesn't get it.

'He' in the previous statement isn't Tran per se, but could be anybody in a similar situation.

Re: Absolutely heated about JC Tran situation at Foxwoods
 

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Clearly the correct ruling.

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Tourney rules.

Cash game this would be different, no doubt, but tourney rules, pretty clear cut decision.