Re: Lie Harder
 

Just keep it up....

Tom is probably preparing slander charges at the moment, for defaming his good name. Though criminal charges for the mystical 'geek' phantom-hacker will probably be put on the back-burner... indefinitely.

Re: Lie Harder
 

Here is what an actual Moneybookers email looks like:

You've got cash

Dear James *********,

Greetings from moneybookers.com! We would like to inform you that you have received a payment from moneybookerscad@betfair.com.




Payment details

Amount: CAD 1764.84
ID: 5158XXXX
Subject: WITHDRAWAL
Note: WITHDRAWAL





Your money is waiting for you in your Moneybookers account - www.moneybookers.com.

We hope you enjoy your cash.


All moneybookers transfers are instant, you never have to "accept" them.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

New article on pokerpages.com:

http://www.pokerpages.com/poker-news...oyee-30036.htm

Nothing new, except this quote from Annie Duke:

[ QUOTE ]

Annie Duke, widely recognizable pro and the top female professional poker player in the world, notes to the online community that there is no need to fret in the wake of this news.

"This kind of stuff happens in live games all the time," says Annie. "You just don't hear about it as much. That's why it's important for players to know how to spot cheating. As for this situation, what's important is that the site steps up to the plate, acknowledges what has happened, and does the right thing."


[/ QUOTE ]

Really lame.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Wtf is Annie Duke ever talking about?

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
New article on pokerpages.com:

http://www.pokerpages.com/poker-news...oyee-30036.htm

Nothing new, except this quote from Annie Duke:

[ QUOTE ]

Annie Duke, widely recognizable pro and the top female professional poker player in the world, notes to the online community that there is no need to fret in the wake of this news.

"This kind of stuff happens in live games all the time," says Annie. "You just don't hear about it as much. That's why it's important for players to know how to spot cheating. As for this situation, what's important is that the site steps up to the plate, acknowledges what has happened, and does the right thing."


[/ QUOTE ]

Really lame.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sure Annie doesn't know the details of what's going on to make that statement. Of course this doesn't happen all the time in live games.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
New article on pokerpages.com:

http://www.pokerpages.com/poker-news...oyee-30036.htm

Nothing new, except this quote from Annie Duke:

[ QUOTE ]

Annie Duke, widely recognizable pro and the top female professional poker player in the world, notes to the online community that there is no need to fret in the wake of this news.

"This kind of stuff happens in live games all the time," says Annie. "You just don't hear about it as much. That's why it's important for players to know how to spot cheating. As for this situation, what's important is that there are sites out there like 2+2 and P5s which will actually look out for you and FORCE the poker sites to acknowledge deceit, then step up and do the right thing--while all named pros and official organizations are sitting on their hands."


[/ QUOTE ]

Really lame.

[/ QUOTE ]


She's on the UB payroll right?

Re: Lie Harder
 

sheets also sent me the HH and it looks pretty clear to me

with his permission i forwarded it on to the wizardofodds guy, hopefully he'll do some sort of similar analysis?

Re: Lie Harder
 

While I'm sure the odds of POTRIPPER doing what he did are astronomical. The Wizard's statistical arguments are not sound. Not sure if it will matter ever. But I wouldn't quote the guy or link to him.

Re: Lie Harder *DELETED*
 

Post deleted by Red_Diamond

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
anyone got any contacts w/msn?

[/ QUOTE ]
I have the email of the guy who wrote the article.

[/ QUOTE ]

nm, didn't realize how closely adanthar had worked w/msnbc in the production of the article.

Re: Lie Harder
 

I would not call this a "dramabomb" but it is a piece of factual info in the properties of the spreadsheet.

I edited out the name of the creator of the spreadsheet.

Based on the create and save dates, the spreadsheet itself was probably not modified after the info was pasted in. 2 minutes is not a lot of time to change a spreadsheet like this.

http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/663/hhsc6.th.jpg

Re: Lie Harder
 

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for the good advice. When I hover over link it says www.rednada.com.a. Definitely a scam.
Wow it did not take Tom long to find a new business venture. Oh right.....just in....he was framed. Sorry about that Scott.

[/ QUOTE ]

Highly, highly, highly doubt that Tom or anyone with AP had anything to do with this scam email. Phishing scams are largely ran out of Nigeria. Probably whoever ran the original MB scam saw the $500 being close to their amount, and re-issued the email with AP in it. They often take advantage of news items to make people think that such restitution is legit.

Once you get people's information (passwords, bank info, credit cards), you have to be able to purchase commodity goods like electronics and be able to resell them almost immediately in high volume. Takes a bit of a setup. Probably wouldn't be what Tom would jump to next.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Hi Everyone:

We also had a conversation today with a representative of AP. It appears to me that they are moving in the right direction. We'll know more when their statement comes out.

Best wishes,
Mason

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'm sure Annie doesn't know the details of what's going on to make that statement. Of course this doesn't happen all the time in live games.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, it does. Haven't you heard of marked cards? I said something similar a few times.

Re: Lie Harder
 

[ QUOTE ]
I would not call this a "dramabomb" but it is a piece of factual info in the properties of the spreadsheet.

I edited out the name of the creator of the spreadsheet.

Based on the create and save dates, the spreadsheet itself was probably not modified after the info was pasted in. 2 minutes is not a lot of time to change a spreadsheet like this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bear in mind it relatively easy to change that file metadata.

http://www.google.com/search?q=chang...dified&rls

Although I think it very unlikely in this case.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Mason:

[ QUOTE ]
We'll know more when their statement comes out.

[/ QUOTE ]

This afternoon?

Edit: Maybe this evening?

gg

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Everyone:

We also had a conversation today with a representative of AP. It appears to me that they are moving in the right direction. We'll know more when their statement comes out.

Best wishes,
Mason

[/ QUOTE ]
Who is "we"?

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

I think some people might be getting some hush money...

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
Mason:

[ QUOTE ]
We'll know more when their statement comes out.

[/ QUOTE ]

This afternoon?

Edit: Maybe this evening?

gg

[/ QUOTE ]
The following was part of an email that I receive from the AP person that I talked to earlier.

"We are hoping to get a statement out tonight.
If we dont we will on Saturday - we need to make sure it answers all of the questions with absolute clarity."

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think some people might be getting some hush money...

[/ QUOTE ]

ban for cryptic nonsense that does nothing to further the discussion

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think some people might be getting some hush money...

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not...

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think some people might be getting some hush money...

[/ QUOTE ]

this is the last thing people need to be saying right now.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

The Bad Beat Jackpot has just been hit at $151814.57

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]

we need to make sure it answers all of the questions with absolute clarity."

[/ QUOTE ]

Clear as mud so far guys. That's Absolute clarity in this instance.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Mason:

[ QUOTE ]
We'll know more when their statement comes out.

[/ QUOTE ]

This afternoon?

Edit: Maybe this evening?

gg

[/ QUOTE ]
The following was part of an email that I receive from the AP person that I talked to earlier.

"We are hoping to get a statement out tonight.
If we dont we will on Saturday - we need to make sure it answers all of the questions with absolute clarity."

[/ QUOTE ]

lol at bolded.

All the questions that we have raised or given the answers to?


gg

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

If they just started really investigating this a couple days ago, it's very unlikely they would even know answers to all the questions with absolute clarity. I would feel more assured if they said something like "we'll tell you everything we can, but there are many issues which will require a more thorough investigation before we can definitively say what happened".

It may take a day or two to craft a carefully worded press release. I would think it would take at least a couple weeks to do a really thorough investigation on a scam of this magnitude and scope.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Where can I get some of those "hush moneys"? I promise to keep silent! [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm sure Annie doesn't know the details of what's going on to make that statement. Of course this doesn't happen all the time in live games.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, it does. Haven't you heard of marked cards? I said something similar a few times.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have heard of marked cards actually. A clear view of everyones hole cards as was the case at AP is slightly different I think.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Everybody,

I have it on good authority that Absolute Poker is completely innocent! Hurrah!

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]

"This kind of stuff happens in live games all the time," says Annie. "You just don't hear about it as much. That's why it's important for players to know how to spot cheating..."

[/ QUOTE ]
What is relevant is that it is important for the site to be able to spot cheating. These test should be running whether or not there are player complaints, but they better be used when there are complaints. It is much easier for the site to test for this type of information leak than for the players. Absolute Poker failed in its responsibility to do that, even when the cheating was ridiculously blatant so that it was convincing to almost all serious poker players just from the hands that made it to showdown.

Absolute Poker repeatedly lied and stonewalled about this, tried to cover things up (through changing registration information just after it was posted here, and by asking sites to remove unflattering threads), and threatened some of those who were speaking the truth with legal action (in AP's statement and Seif's comments--Seif has appeared to state the official AP line throughout this scandal). They said things were impossible that were obviously possible. If they didn't know something was wrong, their security department is not functioning, and any executive responsible for that incompetence should be removed.

Of course, you can't expect an unbiased statement from a spokesperson for UB/AP.

It is, nevertheless, a bad idea for them to try to say that it's the players' responsibility to detect cheating. Although that position might seem to help them deflect responsibility in the short run, if everyone were to believe them, it would greatly decrease the amount of play. People would be too suspicious to play for substantial stakes, and they would get swamped with false claims of cheating against players who were just lucky, unlike this case.

I'd be surprised if other sites which take the responsibility of holding other people's money more seriously didn't have automated detection systems that would have identified these cheaters long before the player complaints. I'd bet that PokerStars will mention that they implemented such a system years ago when this scandal starts to cool off, and Steven Levitt mentioned working on such a system for a poker site. Apparently, pretending to take security seriously was much higher on Absolute Poker's priorities than actually ensuring it.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm sure Annie doesn't know the details of what's going on to make that statement. Of course this doesn't happen all the time in live games.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, it does. Haven't you heard of marked cards? I said something similar a few times.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have heard of marked cards actually. A clear view of everyones hole cards as was the case at AP is slightly different I think.

[/ QUOTE ]
unless they where MARK(ed) SEIF(ly)
gn

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Update on the statement:

"There is a possibility it will be finished late late tonight, however it will definitely be distributed on Saturday."

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

we need to make sure it answers all of the questions with absolute clarity."

[/ QUOTE ]

Clear as mud so far guys. That's Absolute clarity in this instance.

[/ QUOTE ]
lol, I was going to say, do they mean "one hundred percent clarity" or "the level of clarity displayed by absolute poker to date"?

Re: Lie Harder
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just keep it up....

Tom is probably preparing slander charges at the moment, for defaming his good name. Though criminal charges for the mystical 'geek' phantom-hacker will probably be put on the back-burner... indefinitely.

[/ QUOTE ]

No kidding! If they are going to throw someone under the bus, we should demand to see the tire tracks!

Although this guy was obviously doing this with the intention of making Absolute Poker a more secure site, so he probably deserves a promotion!

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

I've said for 3 years Ben Mezrich's book on the online poker scandal won't be writen for atleast 10 more years. It might be sooner, but instead of a bunch of MIT guys it's "The Boys from SAE" Phi Alpha!

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Everyone:

We also had a conversation today with a representative of AP. It appears to me that they are moving in the right direction. We'll know more when their statement comes out.

Best wishes,
Mason

[/ QUOTE ]

Lost respect. DUCY?

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Everyone:

We also had a conversation today with a representative of AP. It appears to me that they are moving in the right direction. We'll know more when their statement comes out.

Best wishes,
Mason

[/ QUOTE ]

Mason's refusal to get involved with PPA without transparency makes this an interesting statement.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
The Bad Beat Jackpot has just been hit at $151814.57

[/ QUOTE ]

WTF the bad beat jackpot was hit when excel file dramabomb came out a few days ago. I don't play there but how often does it hit. BBJ boomswitch? LOL

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
Where can I get some of those "hush moneys"? I promise to keep silent! [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]


[ QUOTE ]
Everybody,

I have it on good authority that Absolute Poker is completely innocent! Hurrah!

[/ QUOTE ]

Nice.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hi Everyone:

We also had a conversation today with a representative of AP. It appears to me that they are moving in the right direction. We'll know more when their statement comes out.

Best wishes,
Mason

[/ QUOTE ]

Lost respect. DUCY?

[/ QUOTE ]