Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

4bet/call seems totally standard to me. Also, I think folding to the 3bet is better than calling, unless you fancy yourself good enough to outplay him OOP. Calling to c/f if you whiff is really bad, though.

Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

just to clarify, Villian is fairly abc, but she definatly knows my range for a cutoff raise is really wide(I'm 31/25 from the CO). I haven't seen her get out of line and 1010+/AJ is her standard range but it's not like she never will 3 bet with JTs. I'd say you can probably give 10% of her range to random hands like SC's, smaller pairs, etc.

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In addition, if an A does flop, then we can usually stack the AJ or AQ.

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I wouldn't necessarily say this is true against this particular player.

Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

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just to clarify, Villian is fairly abc, but she definatly knows my range for a cutoff raise is really wide(I'm 31/25 from the CO). I haven't seen her get out of line and 1010+/AJ is her standard range but it's not like she never will 3 bet with JTs. I'd say you can probably give 10% of her range to random hands like SC's, smaller pairs, etc.

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i was just going to ask about this. against a positionally aware villain, a 4bet here is in order.

Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

at nl50 this sucks as most villains are way too tight with their 3betting, and even if they are aggressive have TT+, AQ+ as their range. QQ+ AK is more likely at microstakes, and you are way behind this range.

on a table where people are playing well this is standard though.

Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

It sucks but I take your line. Shove it in and suckout on KK ftw!

Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

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We are even or ahead of the vast majority of that range...but yet you want to call and c/f? Do you not see how that's terrible?

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You're still not addressing the point that a 4-bet by hero will fold out any hands we beat. Maybe c/f'ing is wrong on the flop, but I still think a 4-bet is wrong in this instance. Also, villain's 3-bet range was set by OP, not me.

Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

is a normal 4bet better than a push here? I mean if we're not folding to a 5 bet anyways why not push? when I do 4bet its usually a shove.

And I 4bet AKo all day here. I usually just cram it though

Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

I flat it preflop. You play fit or fold, position or no position - whats the difference? Not to mention I see tools 3betting UTG openings with AQ and AJ all the time.

Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

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I flat it preflop. You play fit or fold, position or no position - whats the difference?

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Well first off just all the time playing fit or fold with AK sucks. Sometimes when you call his 3bet you let him c-bet and shove as a bluff with 2 overs. Note: That's only when villian has a fairly wide 3bet range and like always c-bets.


And now the difference: you call his 3bet. Flop comes K or A high. If you're in position:

Flop: He c-bets and you call.
Turn: He may check or bet. You check or call.
River: If he checked flop and you checked behind he may check here again in which case you bet and maybe get a call from QQ or JJ. He also may bet again in which case you shove.


OOP:
You call his 3bet and go to the flop where you hit an A or a K.

Flop: You check, he c-bets, you c/r and he folds so instead you just call.
Turn: You check. He checks.
River: I guess you have to bet here right, but now it's taking away a chance for him to fire again.



Basically if you're in position you give your opponent more chances to make a mistake by betting and you get to act last so you can put that last bet in just in case he doesn't.



And that's just looking at when you hit. Most TAG's will like always c-bet especially when you check to them so if you miss you always have to give it up. In position sometimes you'll get checked to. Also sometimes it will be worthwhile to float and sometimes as I said to shove as a bluff.


Lately I've actually wondered a little if it might be better to 4bet AK in position most of the time too. I have not been thinking about just calling with AK OOP.

Re: This is my standard, but is it spew? AK pre flop, NL $50 6m
 

No. I check. He bets. I push. He calls AT. Profit. Sometimes I peel when I miss, read dependent. You miss that AQ,AJ,KQ is the biggest part of his range. The times I fold to a worse hand are well worth the times I stack a dominated hand. Thats assuming a reasonable 3bet range. If he starts doing it deliberately to my EP opening indicating he does this with 96s, I will start 4betting with most of my range. But not until I am convinced.