Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

[ QUOTE ]
Checking this river is so bad. I routinely get called by amazing hands like 88 in spots like this, and even on some 'scarier' boards

[/ QUOTE ]

There is not a lot of "scarier" boards out there vs a PFR.

You can substitute an A for the K or Q and it's not a whole lot scarier.

I highly doubt you are "routinely" getting called by 88 on boards like this, occasionally it will happen but "routinely" no way.

Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

U make money from that type of fish by value betting hard ur good hands and getting free cards due to his pasivness,not by bluffing...
Therefore i like your line a lot on turn and river but disagree on the flop especially on that type of flop unless u think u r valuebetting your K high.
As played i would fold most of the time vs anyone unless ihave some kind of read that would make me think he is capable of such bluffs.

Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

[ QUOTE ]
but disagree on the flop especially on that type of flop unless u think u r valuebetting your K high.


[/ QUOTE ]

This flop is a standard cont bet 100% of the time for me and should be for anybody, it's very unlikely that the flop hit him here, you have posiiton and the initiative.

The flop bet is super duper standard here, you don't not bet this flop because you wiffed.

This is easily one of the best boards you could have asked for when you wiff to cont bet on.

Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

Checking the river is awful, unless you are such a nit that you never get called by worse. btw, you shouldnt be that much of a nit.

Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
but disagree on the flop especially on that type of flop unless u think u r valuebetting your K high.


[/ QUOTE ]

This flop is a standard cont bet 100% of the time for me and should be for anybody, it's very unlikely that the flop hit him here, you have posiiton and the initiative.

The flop bet is super duper standard here, you don't not bet this flop because you wiffed.

This is easily one of the best boards you could have asked for when you wiff to cont bet on.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good points ,good arguments but it seems like i am getting call so much on that type of flop against that type of fishs that i m not sure what to think anymore.What does a CB achieve if we assume we r getting call 80% of the time on that spot??
To them A high is the nuts or if they have overcards they r drawing to 2 pair...

Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

so you guys don't bet river with AJ?

Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Checking this river is so bad. I routinely get called by amazing hands like 88 in spots like this, and even on some 'scarier' boards

[/ QUOTE ]

There is not a lot of "scarier" boards out there vs a PFR.

You can substitute an A for the K or Q and it's not a whole lot scarier.

I highly doubt you are "routinely" getting called by 88 on boards like this, occasionally it will happen but "routinely" no way.

[/ QUOTE ]

villain is a fish you [censored] idiot.

op, nh, now fold.

Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ok, villain is a 58/10/1 calling station he CRes 1.59 according to PAHUD. This is over 143 hands. Went to SD 30%. Won at SD 63%.

I have to fire 3 times right?

[/ QUOTE ]

Nope. You fire at a CS when you have a strong hand. You do not have one at any point.

[ QUOTE ]

So the basic premise on betting this river would be that he is a calling station, so I can fold to a raise right?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep.

[ QUOTE ]
I should prob. have bet $70 on the river... my bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nope. Your plan should be to block the river, if you bet at all after getting called twice.

[/ QUOTE ]

flop c-bet can go either way. turn you definitely do have a strong hand and you are like miles ahead of his range and you HAVE to bet every street as long as he's just calling. This is like the 2nd time ive seen you advocate a blocking bet from in position, which is of course impossible. Definitely bet closer to $70 on the river and fold to the raise. WTF @ checking here? Since when does someone c/c you twice and checking the river indicate a hand >TP?

Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

so you guys river bet JJ for value? river bet TT for value?

While river bet isn't bad, I don't think its that clear that checking isn't close in EV.

This range merging thing works out well when villain is thinking player and figures out that river bet looks like monster or bluff and calls you down light with 88 but against said villain I think often the reaction is well there is 2 overs that likely hit my opponent and I don't want to call.

Re: oh good, i get min check raised on the river
 

amoeba,
No I don't bet those hands for value. AQ I would, and all Kx hands. We are going to be bluffing enough that we don't need to really merge our range, just valuebet our top hands in this spot.