Re: Tough spot with QQ. 4-8 Live
 

Since you have a position on a draw-heavy board, I don't think it is completely horrible to check behind on the flop and consider raising the turn on a blank, depending on your reads and the action in front of you.

A check is better if you have aces or kings because you are in less danger of giving a free card to someone with an overcard, but even with queens, I don't think that it is an option that you should automatically dismiss. I'm not saying that you should check behind or that I would (I do it some of the time, but not all of the time, based on my opponents), but it should be on the table.

Re: Tough spot with QQ. 4-8 Live
 

I think Niediam's hand range is fine, plus throw in JJ.

I think folding the turn was not good. There are too many hands that you beat versus hands that beat you, given the pot size and the probable overcaller. I'm seeing this one to the end.

This is 4/8, after all.

Re: Tough spot with QQ. 4-8 Live
 

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I think Niediam's hand range is fine,


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In any 3/6 or 4/8 game I've played in (AC/Foxwoods) 50% of players won't cap ever, even with the nuts on the flop, and I'd say at least 75-80% wouldn't cap without at the very least two pair (and many wouldn't cap there either). I don't think his hand range represents the typical player.

I don't know why we ask for reads from OPs when we generally ignore them. If his read is that he's very likely beat, he doesn't have the odds to call. Especially not with a third person who very likely has a strong draw (at least 8 outs) in the hand. We're in horrible position, are possibly drawing dead, likely have only 2 outs, if we're lucky have 4 outs, and if we're insanely lucky we're ahead but have to dodge a crapload of cards on the river.

Re: Tough spot with QQ. 4-8 Live
 

call turn and spike a Q on the river

Re: Tough spot with QQ. 4-8 Live
 

I think you played the hand pretty well. Not much else to say

Re: Tough spot with QQ. 4-8 Live
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think Niediam's hand range is fine,


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I don't know why we ask for reads from OPs when we generally ignore them.

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He was there for two orbits. How good are your reads after 20 hands? This is a recipe for weak/tight, imho.

Re: Tough spot with QQ. 4-8 Live
 

The villian's check on the flop means he's not scared of giving a free card, either because he already likes his hand or because he himself is drawing to something. When he hits you with a c/r, and follows up with the 4-bet, you are behind a large portion of the time on this board.

The turn doesn't help you much, and even if it pulls you ahead of the button it may have put you behind the caller. You've got to dodge a huge number of cards to stay in your already precarious position. Even a red Ace or King wrecks your showdown value. You've got only 2 outs.

Without reads this is a fold on the turn for me.