Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

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If i'm getting it in with the best of it

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Preflop is 2/7 of the cards and, more importantly, 1/6 of the betting. A slight oversimplification, but you get the idea.

On a related side note: It always bugs me when players complain about losing when they had "the best hand." No. Wrong. Whoever has the best hand at the end wins. The fact that one hand was stronger preflop is beside the point. IMHO, this (widespread) type of thinking [whining] is a major impediment to becoming a really good poker player.

Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

Put it this way - if you sit down in a 100-200 game for the first time, the best players in the game are not thinking "sweet, I'm going to totally outplay this guy preflop". I think StinkyPete answered your question - I agree with what he said 100%.

Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

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How and why pete? If i'm getting it in with the best of it how wil i lose? they are the ones spewing in with the worst of it.

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"best of it" is quite rare situation in short game. More often you both will have vulnerable hands. So the winner will be the one who takes the most with worst of it.
And there is always optimal frequency spewing/taking pot uncontested, depending on your opponent. Against a fish you should never spew, against thinking TAG/LAG you MUST spew to be unpredictable or to force opponent to be tooo tight/passive/predictable.

Predictability lets your opponent to make easy folds and easy bluffs (like if you cap PF only with JJ+,AK - it's quite easy to release a hand postflop for your opponent). You should always try to keep you opponent uncertain and predictable so he will start to make mistakes you're waiting for (like calling down too much with thin value or never bluffing, raising only with best of it - it's quite common mistakes against smart LAGs ).

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Interesting post. Couldnt miss not to post there.I want to disagree with Pete:) Sometimes abc is good just to change gears or vs certain opponents (not neccesary fish). You think if you play abc youre predictable, but what if you know you opponents knows youre predictable? You can turn it into your profit by changing gears or by making non-abc plays but in general contnue to play abc. However fishyboy i think your abc-poker is way different fom what me and Pete think abc-poker is:). Because its much harder not to make mistakes playing abc-poker actually.

Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

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I've been haivng a discussion with different people lately about whether a abc predictable preflop player can beat higher games. Can someone playing very tight solid poker beat higher games? Or do they have to mix it up? And if have to mix it up in what way do you need to mix it up to vere from solid pro play?

If a player plays solid and doeswn't make mistakes how can he not beat any game? I understand that hourly rate might be better if he made some plays sometimes but wouldnt he still win? And when making plays isn't it to create an illusion of gambling and to actually play solid poker? It almost sounds like people think you can't play solid poker and beat higher games. That you need to be getting out htere doing unorthodox things all the time?

So what do you guys think does solid abc take the money or will he lose?

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I think your definition of your theoretical player is very vague. When you say he "doesn't make mistakes," what are you defining as a mistake?

In my opinion, if you have 5 high and your opponent has 8 high but would've folded to that river raise, failing to raise the river is a mistake. So to me, someone who doesn't make mistakes could beat any game anywhere.

But I don't think that's what you mean by "never makes mistakes." For example, if your man has 55 and is facing three or four overcards and bets on the flop and turn, what is your "never makes mistakes" player going to do? Is he a mediocre hand reader that plays by formula in this situation? Or is he a world class hand reader that acts accordingly (though of course often times he will be wrong either in his read or in his expectation of how his opponent will react)?

I have this stereotype that 'ABC players' will tend to be more of the formulaic type and will make many mistakes that you may not even think of as mistakes. This 'ABC player' can beat online 1/2 when the game is really soft, but will in the long run, unless he is extremely game-selective, get eaten alive.

Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

This thread is pretty worthless because everyone defines ABC differently. I think I am very ABC, but that doesnt mean I can't 3 bet the turn with ace high when I think I am getting messed with. It is certainly not necessary to go ape [censored] with some random 2 cards in order to be unpredictable.

Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

yes u can beat it with abc play

Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

Why dont you try and play in these games. You will find that you are getting played back against a lot, folding a lot, and not winning many big pots. You just asking this question indicates that you are not ready for this game not to mention when you talk about general strategy about spewing. I am not sure what levels you normally play, but you may want to think about staying there for a little while.

Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

One thought:

1. The very best players in the game tend not to be ABC players.

2. The next-best players in the game tend to be ABC players.

3. The worst players in the game (above and beyond outright fish) tend to be non-ABC players who are running good and mistake holes in their game for "mixing it up".

Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

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This thread is pretty worthless because everyone defines ABC differently. I think I am very ABC, but that doesnt mean I can't 3 bet the turn with ace high when I think I am getting messed with. It is certainly not necessary to go ape [censored] with some random 2 cards in order to be unpredictable.

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I think you're 100% correct. To me, being called an ABC player would be somewhat of a put-down. But the reality is, in a 6-handed game or more, 95%+ of my decisions are probably ABC, and I believe appropriately so. Whereas you may play very similar to me and will proudly characterize yourself as an ABC player.

Lock this silly thread.

Re: Can an abc predictable preflop player beat 100-200?
 

Lol. I didn't say i was predictable. I just asked if they can beat the game. Well i'm predictable in certain situations like defending the blinds. But i do make moves. In fact i think i spew too mjuch making moves and wondering if i would do better if i went back to my old super-solid play of clean poker that i used to play before i became a nut job lol.