Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

I think Ichiro's the better player (esp if he sticks in center) , but that Dunn's more valuable as a hitter.

Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

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yes.

So who has voted for Ichiro?

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I voted for Ichiro because he's under rated on this board and I thought I'd be the only one. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] Then I was going to defend myself by defining hitting as the ability to get hits, which Ichiro is obviously better. As it is, the votes are about half and half, so I can say that Dunn is a better batter. When you factor in the speed Ichiro brings to the table, they are close overall offensively, although I still go with Dunn (Dunn is not a slow man). When you factor in the defense, even with Ichiro in right, Ichiro is a much better overall player.

Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

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There as different as hitters can be, but they're roughly the same value.

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Same value at the plate?
Or are you factoring in speed and defense?

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I'm factoring in stolen bases. 44/46 on SBs really makes up a lot of ground. Throw in park factors and you've got similar-value hitters.

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Not to be a nit, but if were measuring who is a better hitter isn't speed irrelevant?

Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

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44/46 on SBs really makes up a lot of ground.

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95.6% has to be the record for players with over 40 steals?

The only guys I can remember with a 10:1 ratio of steals to caught with over 30 SB were Eric Davis, 35/3 in 1988, and Barry Larkin 51/5 in 1995. Larkin was 91/8 over the three years from 1993-1995. Carlos Beltran was 31/1 in 2001, 41/4 in 2003, and 42/3 in 2004. He's got to be considered the most effiecent basestealer of all time, with a career 209 SB at an 87% clip. From 2000-2004, he stole 162 at a 91.5% rate!

Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

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There as different as hitters can be, but they're roughly the same value.

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Same value at the plate?
Or are you factoring in speed and defense?

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I'm factoring in stolen bases. 44/46 on SBs really makes up a lot of ground. Throw in park factors and you've got similar-value hitters.

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Not to be a nit, but if were measuring who is a better hitter isn't speed irrelevant?

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Not to be a nit, but if were measuring who is a better hitter isn't walking irrelevant?

Baserunning is definitely a part of offensive value.

Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

I define better hitter as the one I wouldn't want to face in a key situation in the 9th inning with my best pitcher on the mound. That's just me though.

Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

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I define better hitter as the one I wouldn't want to face in a key situation in the 9th inning with my best pitcher on the mound. That's just me though.

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So Freddy Sanchez > Ryan Howard?

Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

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I define better hitter as the one I wouldn't want to face in a key situation in the 9th inning with my best pitcher on the mound. That's just me though.

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That is so vague because you aren't adjusting for the situation. Bases loaded nobody out tie game, and nobody on in a tie game with two outs are very different.

Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

DUDE ZOMG THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS IS 2 OUTS RUNNER ON 3RD TIE GAME BOTTOM OF 9TH WHO DO YOU WANT UP!?!?!

Re: Who is a better hitter? (Poll)
 

Yes, there are numerous key situations in the 9th inning, so you'd have to look at all of them and how often they come up to determine the right answer using my method.

Hitting a bunch of homeruns off AAA pitching doesn't make you a good hitter in my opinion. There are a lot of guys who hit bad pitching well and hit poorly against the real good pitchers. There are other hitters that seem to hit close to the same against everyone. I'm sure you have some stat that proves me wrong though.