Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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So, the cop is driving along the Utah highway, and is coming up on a temporary speed limit sign and pulls to the side of the road. After one car passes, he pulls the guy over for speeding, and they come to the side of the road a few hundred yards into the new speed limit zone. This is dirty and the sort of [censored] that should not be condoned on the force. Way to work towards the investigation of suspected criminal activity and the referral of the results of investigations and of suspected criminals to the courts.

The cop is super out of line in the way he handles the situation he creates also, but I thought the manner in which he pulled the guy over to be almost as bad.

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I think he's a state highway cop, so traffic enforcement (generating revenue by writing speeding tickets) is his primary duty. Yes, staking out the temporary speed limit sign is kind of sleazy, but pretty much standard. I have a lot more problem with his poor handling of the clueless speeder than with the fact that he ticketed him. Temporary speed limit signs are usually there for a reason (construction most of the time). If you don't watch for them, you're probably going to get a ticket sooner or later. If this sign was placed for no reason other than to issue tickets, I agree with you 100%.

Edit:
What is not apparent from the video is whether there is a "reduced speed ahead" sign or something like that a reasonable distance before the temporary speed limit sign. If there is, I have no problem with the cop issuing a ticket.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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I don't know if you're referring to this incident, but most of the news accounts say this officer is a 14-yr veteran.

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It's pretty sad to be in a job for 14 years and suck at it that badly.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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Yes, staking out the temporary speed limit sign is kind of sleazy, but pretty much standard.

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Early on, the cop states that there is a sign a half mile before the one where he was stopped and the driver disputes it.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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Yes, staking out the temporary speed limit sign is kind of sleazy, but pretty much standard.

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Early on, the cop states that there is a sign a half mile before the one where he was stopped and the driver disputes it.

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I must have missed that. if this was the second sign, I see nothing wrong with the cop ticketing the guy. It was the way he dealt with the situation after stopping him that sucked. If this guy hasn't figured out how to handle idiots after 14 years, he should probably change careers.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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compare with the video here, eh (most ppl have probably seen this before): no tazer here

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Now that guy was good. He kept his cool, and even got the clown to pick up the ticket he threw on the ground. I know I would have been either laughing or totally pissed off (depending on my mood that day). But I know I'd be a lousy cop. Good cops sometimes amaze me at how they keep their cool in insane situations.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

So has anything come of this yet? Cop in trouble? Guy being charged with assault or resisting arrest or something crazy? I really wish the cops threw a bag of crack into the car for good measure. I thought for sure they would pull some drugs out of no where.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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So has anything come of this yet? Cop in trouble? Guy being charged with assault or resisting arrest or something crazy? I really wish the cops threw a bag of crack into the car for good measure. I thought for sure they would pull some drugs out of no where.

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Utah Highway Patrol

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

This is a post of mine from another forum. The first part has been covered here already:\
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A lot of the time things can be handled much better by all involved, this being a prime example. The police officer should understand the law better than the average motorist and therefore should have explained it. All the police officer had to say is, "signing the ticket is not an admission of guilt, it is only proof of receipt. If you refuse to sign the ticket I will have to take you into custody to formally book you to prove that you received the citation."

This should have been the case whether he was tasered or everything went smoothly and he was cuffed and taken in. The whole taser incident is another argument within itself. The whole para militarization of policing has taken away from the original intent of peace officers. So many of them seem to have something to prove.

I think a lot of it has to do with a certain percentage of the population that is attracted to the profession for the wrong reason. But I really feel that it somewhat has to do with the shift in training to a more military model. More and more small towns are forming swat teams when they really are unnecessary and turning everything into a "tactical operation". And to a somewhat lesser extent TV shows like "COPS" set a bad example.

Being nice and explaining things calmly is usually the easiest route for all involved. I think Dog Chapmen sets a pretty good example of what being nice and less threatening to people will accomplish

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

The advent and use of the Taser is the direct result of anti-cop/ignorant/Liberal "cause seekers" aghast at the thought that a cop might have to put his hands (or baton) on someone to effect an arrest. The suspension of belief required to adhere to the presumption that all suspects comply with the legally binding commands of a peace officer is similar in magnitude to the belief that man never landed on the Moon or that the mafia killed JFK.


Edit: The aforementioned parties wanted a tool that rendered a suspect unable to resist and subsequently did away with TV images of cops fighting uncooperative suspects...because it’s ugly. States, cities, and towns faced increasing civil liability because it is impossible to find a jury or public official that had not been unfairly influenced by a media controlled...........by the aforementioned parties

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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The advent and use of the Taser is the direct result of anti-cop/ignorant/Liberal "cause seekers" aghast at the thought that a cop might have to put his hands (or baton) on someone to effect an arrest. The suspension of belief required to adhere to the presumption that all suspects comply with the legally binding commands of a peace officer is similar in magnitude to the belief that man never landed on the Moon or that the mafia killed JFK.


Edit: The aforementioned parties wanted a tool that rendered a suspect unable to resist and subsequently did away with TV images of cops fighting uncooperative suspects...because it’s ugly. States, cities, and towns faced increasing civil liability because it is impossible to find a jury or public official that had not been unfairly influenced by a media controlled...........by the aforementioned parties

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can you point me to where I can read about this? I looked up the history of the Taser and found some stuff about the invention and subsequent sale to police departments but did not find anything as far as reasoning to adapt to police use. It wasn't invented for this reason though.

Like I said in my post I think there are two separate issues in this case. The taser could have been a non issue here very easily but should be discussed anyways as a separate issue.


The million dollar question is what level of force justifies its usage? How far below permissible deadly force should the taser be used?

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

can you point me to where I can read about this?

Obviously this is my opinion. Should I dissect the media/cop dichotomy over the past 20 years? No thanks. I stand fully behind all I've written.

However, by constructing your sentences as such:

“A lot of the time things can be handled much better by all involved.”

You leave yourself an ‘out” when confronted. As in, “that’s not what I said!” Ambiguous nonsense. The obvious inference is that you believe that this coulda (shoulda) been handled better. Maybe I agree. My position on the Taser notwithstanding.

Also, I would recommend that you do some research. In the last 15 years US policing has moved from pseudo-military towards touch-feely. Not the other way around. This again is a direct result of media influence. The obvious correlation is that with crime down and less people experiencing crime (don’t ask for reference, it’s a given) there’s an expectation that people have forgotten what it is to be a victim of crime and subsequently are more apt to believe it doesn’t exist. And because it’s sexier to blame the police for the actions of crooks, the media chooses to provide more coverage to the former.

Also, as far as SWAT teams go, is Columbine and surrounding cities, pop 200k, big enough for a SWAT team? Again, see my thoughts on liability. The uproar over a similar massacre in any town would be led with, “why wasn’t there a SWAT team?!!” Most SWAT teams are part-time meaning they pull patrol officers off the streets to form the team. You’re misinformed.

Finally, Dog Chapmen is a moron and you watch too much TV.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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can you point me to where I can read about this?

Obviously this is my opinion. Should I dissect the media/cop dichotomy over the past 20 years? No thanks. I stand fully behind all I've written.

However, by constructing your sentences as such:

“A lot of the time things can be handled much better by all involved.”

You leave yourself an ‘out” when confronted. As in, “that’s not what I said!” Ambiguous nonsense. The obvious inference is that you believe that this coulda (shoulda) been handled better. Maybe I agree. My position on the Taser notwithstanding.

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Im not trying to leave myself any outs. Yes I think this should have been handled much differently and in this instance the burden lies on the police officer. He had a lot of discretion and chose to take a route that wont be popular in the court of public opinion and perhaps not in real court either.

The initial statement was one that relates to any situation that goes further than necessary. Sometimes its the police officers fault and sometimes it is the other person's fault and sometimes it is a combination of the two.

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Also, I would recommend that you do some research. In the last 15 years US policing has moved from pseudo-military towards touch-feely. Not the other way around.

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I don't believe this to be true. Perhaps it is my "liberal" Masters degree in criminal justice that is biasing my opinion but what I've learned it the total opposite. I haven't done extensive research but I have listened to those that have. Peter Kraska, someone Ive taken classes from, is considered an authority on the subject and while I don't really like the guy too much personally, I do respect his thoughts on the matter.

Just because there has been a push for community policing over the last decade or so doesn't mean that it has been implemented at the level desired by the people pushing it. In fact there is a lot of resistance at the operational level. The merits have no bearing in this discussion so I will leave that out.

I'm also going to stay away from the right vs left wing media debate at this point.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

Spidar,

What do you think the solution is? I kinda agree with you and disagree at the same time. I feel like it's harder for legitimate cops to diffuse situations, but that also police jobs tend to attract violent, slight sociopathic individuals. Maybe that's not a fair impression, but what do you want to see done?

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

Just wanna make sure everyone sees this , which was linked earlier cause it's F'ing hilarious. That trooper was funny too. Now that guy deserved a tasing even more than the "don't taze me bro!" guy

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

I think you need to do a lot more than be annoying or nervous to be subjected to bodily injury or risk of death.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

Replace "tased" with "beat with a baton" in these stories, and
it's a lot easier to see if it makes sense.

Not listening to what a cop says doesn't give him the right to inflict severe pain and possibly threaten your life.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

do you people not realize that the guy didn't comply with the very clear "put your hands behind your back and turn around" direction that was clearly stated multiple times by an officer with a drawn weapon?

in fact he somewhat reaches towards his pocket for the love of god

i just hope the judge/jury dealing with this douchebag's lawsuit he has filed shows better logic and intelligence than has been demonstrated in this thread.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

[ QUOTE ]
Replace "tased" with "beat with a baton" in these stories, and
it's a lot easier to see if it makes sense.

Not listening to what a cop says doesn't give him the right to inflict severe pain and possibly threaten your life.

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Guess what? If you do something that the cop feels threatened, he's taking your ass down before you have a chance to take his ass down. This is why you should always comply with any command a cop gives you, no matter how right you think you are.

You're never going to win with a cop. This guy tried winning by not listening, walking back to his car and it looked like he was going to his pocket.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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This is why you should always comply with any command a cop gives you, no matter how right you think you are.


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No.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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I think you need to do a lot more than be annoying or nervous to be subjected to bodily injury or risk of death.

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I think you need to lighten up

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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This is why you should always comply with any command a cop gives you, no matter how right you think you are.


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No.

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As long as you're not incriminating yourself by doing such actions, only good can come of it.

Sure, you can be an idiot like the guy in the clip or the idiot in Cleveland that wouldn't show the cop his ID. Enjoy spending your time and money fighting something that could have been solved had you just did what you were told. Way to rage against the machine.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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cops suck

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Yea right......untill you need help from one.

There are bad apples in every profession out there. Don't let the 1% of things like this paint the police as 100% bad.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

This cop has small cahunas obviously.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Replace "tased" with "beat with a baton" in these stories, and
it's a lot easier to see if it makes sense.

Not listening to what a cop says doesn't give him the right to inflict severe pain and possibly threaten your life.

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Guess what? If you do something that the cop feels threatened, he's taking your ass down before you have a chance to take his ass down. This is why you should always comply with any command a cop gives you, no matter how right you think you are.

You're never going to win with a cop. This guy tried winning by not listening, walking back to his car and it looked like he was going to his pocket.

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Iggy - I aggre - in this case it's pretty borderline because of the way the guy was walking/grabbing his pocket - pretty suspicious looking. (Although it does look like it was his cell phone that he put in there when he first got out of the car).

There are definitely other cases where the cop wasn't threatened at all but used a taser because the person wasn't cooperating.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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*edit* also, i was REALLLLLY hoping he would taze the dumb woman as well

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Why?

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Replace "tased" with "beat with a baton" in these stories, and
it's a lot easier to see if it makes sense.

Not listening to what a cop says doesn't give him the right to inflict severe pain and possibly threaten your life.

[/ QUOTE ]

Guess what? If you do something that the cop feels threatened, he's taking your ass down before you have a chance to take his ass down. This is why you should always comply with any command a cop gives you, no matter how right you think you are.

You're never going to win with a cop. This guy tried winning by not listening, walking back to his car and it looked like he was going to his pocket.

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Iggy - I aggre - in this case it's pretty borderline because of the way the guy was walking/grabbing his pocket - pretty suspicious looking. (Although it does look like it was his cell phone that he put in there when he first got out of the car).

There are definitely other cases where the cop wasn't threatened at all but used a taser because the person wasn't cooperating.

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Yo, borderline? Cop tells him to put his hands up and turn around, and he reaches into his pockets. The only excuse for this is to not speak any English (and that usually won't be a comforting excuse when you're shot anyways)

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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I love watching uncooperative A-holes get tasered.

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Why?

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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I love watching uncooperative A-holes get tasered.

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Why?

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We should move this thread to Politics.

Jplay nielso, I miss seeing your name <3

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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Yo, borderline? Cop tells him to put his hands up and turn around, and he reaches into his pockets. The only excuse for this is to not speak any English (and that usually won't be a comforting excuse when you're shot anyways)

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I fault the cop much more for the way he handled the stop before he tasered the guy than for using the taser. I think he could have talked him into signing instead of immediately moving to arrest him when he refused to sign. I watch "Cops" fairly regularly, and a lot of the cops you see there verbally defuse situations that are much crazier than this one. I really don't think think the idiot speeder even realized he was being arrested. No question the speeder was a moron, but the cop was pretty bad, too.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

Can someone explain the signing thing for me? What's that about? I don't remember signing the one ticket I've gotten in my life. I may have signed it, but what does signing it state?

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

i guess by signing you are agreeing that you will either pay the ticket or appear in court.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

So why wasn't that guy signing it? And you get arrested if you don't sign it?

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

the guy was clearly an idiot, trying to express some kind of rights he thinks he has.

I'M NOT SIGNING ANYTHING!

ok sir, that is your right. it is also my right to arrest you, which i will now do.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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I love watching uncooperative A-holes get tasered.

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Why?

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same reason why it's funny to watch Beyonce fall down those stairs, or Bob Dole take that tumble from his podium. Annoying people getting mildly injured is awesome.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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the truth is the cop created the panic and confusion hoping it would lead to a situation where he could use his taser, being the pig that he is.

A reasonable police officer, whos main goal was to diffuse the situation, would have warned the guy he would be placed under arrest if he didn't stay still and obey instructions. Or better yet, warned him that if he didn't sign the ticket he would have to arrest him. Instead, with no warning, he orders the guy out of the car, pulls the gun on him and starts yelling. And when the the agitated driver panicks, the pig does exactly what he wanted to do all along.

These are obviously the actions of a pig who likes to create situations where the slightest error by a citizen allows him to flex his ego and have some fun. As opposed to a police officer who likes to serve and protect by diffusing situations, instead of creating them.

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I agree 100%. Classic example of a tough guy cop looking for an excuse to flex his muscle. This cop will be fired if he hasn't already been.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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Can someone explain the signing thing for me? What's that about?

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NO, get out of the car


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And you get arrested if you don't sign it?


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Don't ask questions, ZAPPPPPPPPPP111

Youve been tasered


See your just as confused as that guy was and you had 65 post in front of you, some of which already explained your questions. This guy was going in blind and believed he had done nothing wrong.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

Difference between "Why am I signing this, officer?" and "I will not sign this."

And in my defense, most of this thread was fairly silly, and that lead me to skip parts of it.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

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Difference between "Why am I signing this, officer?" and "I will not sign this."


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There is also a difference between, "Sign the X" before the person has even touched the paper and explaining what the person is signing or telling the person to read and sign.

Re: Ride With The Taser
 

also there's a difference between this exchange on an internet message board, and an officer of the law giving you an order which you ignore.