Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

Esfandiari scared money in this game? Just maybe?

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Esfandiari scared money in this game? Just maybe?

[/ QUOTE ]

"hey look hes not playing 90% of hands, he must be scared money!"

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

Any possibility that Doyle and Antonio don't have 100% of themselves in this game?

- JA

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Esfandiari scared money in this game? Just maybe?

[/ QUOTE ]

"hey look hes not playing 90% of hands, he must be scared money!"

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the comment on Antonio had a lot more to do with his play with AA and check-calling all the way with top set than his apparent lack of seeing the flop.

He definitely appeared to be playing some scared money with his AA. I mean, it was like he wanted the 4th spade to come so that he could fold and not have to worry about making a real decision.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

I think I read somewhere that Gold wins 400k or 600k in this session.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think I read somewhere that Gold wins 400k or 600k in this session.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow. If true that's what makes poker great. A absolute super -EV player can win.

That guy flat sucks.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

It's funny how this thread is going to be about "omg how can Doyle fold, wtf?" and if Jaime had J9ss instead of 97ss it would be "omg, Doyle is the best player ever". Either way I think you got to at least call against Jaime. I could definitely understand folding against some of the other players at the table, but not Jaime.

Esfandiari calling Sammy's A9 and Doyle's flush fold was pretty sick. He's not like Negreanu, who just says random stuff every hand and everyone just remembers when he's right.

Couple of nice folds by Sammy. He might appear as a psycho, but he does know when to fold at least.

Great episode I thought. Can't wait for the next one!

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

can NOT believe Doyle did not call in that spot. first, he can' simply call the bet on the turn, not expecting another big bet on the river. so the only reason he didin't call, in my opinion, is that he KNEW that he would be playing for all of his 500K and simply didin't want to put all his money in. He had the third nuts against GOLD, a bad player who bluffs way too many times... but it comes down to this: almost everyone is playing 'scared' except for Guy who is a billionaire and 500K is not like $5 to you and me. Doyle was right when he said in the preview that everyone at the table is playing above their limits, except for Guy....

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

Dissorono on the rocks.

Such a dumb commercial.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think I read somewhere that Gold wins 400k or 600k in this session.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow. If true that's what makes poker great. A absolute super -EV player can win.



That guy flat sucks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can u really make that quote?

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

This is my list of EVs:

EV+:
Patrick
Daniel N.
Antonio E.
Doyle

EV-:
Jamie Gold
Sammy
Guy L.

Borderline:
David B.
Barry G.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think I read somewhere that Gold wins 400k or 600k in this session.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow. If true that's what makes poker great. A absolute super -EV player can win.



That guy flat sucks.

[/ QUOTE ]


Can u really make that quote?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well from what I know about poker, watching him raise with no hand no draw post flop with 3-4 players in the hand is just terrible. Calling a post flop bet with K10 high and planning to float/bet the turn is just awful. If benyamine had a big hand he's checkraising the turn knowing what this idiot is doing.

To me it just seems like it's nothing but a question of time when he loses all his money. I just keep waiting for that moment.

The only thing I will give him credit for is not playing with scared money. Then again I think that's just an attribute of his low intelligence.

He's just some luckbox donkament winner that has no idea how the real world works for real poker pros. It's a daily grind. Very few grinders win lotteries.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is my list of EVs:

EV+:
Patrick
Daniel N.
Antonio E.
Doyle

EV-:
Jamie Gold
Sammy
Guy L.

Borderline:
David B.
Barry G.

[/ QUOTE ]

Die

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is my list of EVs:

EV+:
Patrick
Daniel N.
Antonio E.
Doyle

EV-:
Jamie Gold
Sammy
Guy L.

Borderline:
David B.
Barry G.

[/ QUOTE ]

wow, Daniel's +EV and he's not even there! He must be ridiculously good.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Dissorono on the rocks.

Such a dumb commercial.

[/ QUOTE ]

Especially the 50th time you see it.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
can NOT believe Doyle did not call in that spot. first, he can' simply call the bet on the turn, not expecting another big bet on the river. so the only reason he didin't call, in my opinion, is that he KNEW that he would be playing for all of his 500K and simply didin't want to put all his money in. He had the third nuts against GOLD, a bad player who bluffs way too many times... but it comes down to this: almost everyone is playing 'scared' except for Guy who is a billionaire and 500K is not like $5 to you and me. Doyle was right when he said in the preview that everyone at the table is playing above their limits, except for Guy....

[/ QUOTE ]

You obviously have never played 400+ BB deep before.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

Dudes. U tube yet?

* want to see *

cant find it on tube yet or pokertube.com

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
"omg how can Doyle fold, wtf?"

[/ QUOTE ]

To me, this is the most disappointing hand I have ever seen on any season of High Stakes Poker. Jamie is supposed to go broke there. It can be on the turn or it can be on the river, but it definitely needs to happen.

I do not loathe Jamie Gold like a lot of people in this forum. However, I do like it when the "pros" stick it to the "amateurs." To me, there is nothing better than old school players teaching newbies a lesson. I think it's because it seems like a lot of people win a tournament and suddenly think they belong in the same group as world class players. Nobody is more old school than Doyle, someone who's been doing it for fifty years and has proven himself to be one of the best ever. Gold epitomizes the upstart luckboxes that suddenly find amazing fame without fully deserving it for the merits of their ability to play poker.

Anyway, long story short, my best case scenario in that group of players would be Doyle breaking Jamie. A close second would be Barry doing it, because he is also a proven player and very classy.

Anyway, as far as the actual hand goes, I absolutely cannot believe Doyle folded that hand. He's got the 3rd best possible hand. He's being check-raised on the turn by someone who has already proclaimed he wants to be the world's greatest bluffer. Seriously, who bluffs more in that game than Jamie Gold? There are far more made hands that Doyle crushes than vice versa. Worst possible play in my opinion.

1) Reraise all in. Don't give Gold a chance to suck out if he just has a pair with a higher spade, two pair, or a set. Get all the money in with the near nuts.

2) Call. This leaves you well over 300k on the river and you have position. See what comes and what Jamie does then.

3) Fold. Seriously, bad bad bad idea. Don't do it.

I will honestly be very surprised if many people disagree with me on this.

I was SHOCKED.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

The more I see of David Benyamine, the more I like him. It seems like he's always smiling and having a good time. If he's in a heads up pot, he'll talk about the hand just as casually as if he was discussing the weather or something. It's pretty funny when you consider the amount of money that's in the pot. It would seem like you'd want to clam up (unless you're Jamie Gold) and try not to give anything away. I love his attitude and the way he plays though. I also like the way he says "flush draw."

That's ballsy to fire a third bullet of 80k on the turn with no pair, no draw, and 7 high. I like it. Could never do it, but I like it a lot.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
The more I see of David Benyamine, the more I like him. It seems like he's always smiling and having a good time.

[/ QUOTE ]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...enberg2007.jpg

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
wowwwwww PA vs Gold All-in in a future episode?? potential 1 million + pot

[/ QUOTE ]

the question is, did they edit that to seem that way, or will it actually happen? iirc, they have edited those end of episode teasers to tease events that don't really happen.

[/ QUOTE ]But how often does somebody verbally call a non-all-in bet? I don't think think this is an edit.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
The more I see of David Benyamine, the more I like him. It seems like he's always smiling and having a good time. If he's in a heads up pot, he'll talk about the hand just as casually as if he was discussing the weather or something. It's pretty funny when you consider the amount of money that's in the pot. It would seem like you'd want to clam up (unless you're Jamie Gold) and try not to give anything away. I love his attitude and the way he plays though. I also like the way he says "flush draw."

That's ballsy to fire a third bullet of 80k on the turn with no pair, no draw, and 7 high. I like it. Could never do it, but I like it a lot.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree, Benyamine seems to make remarkable reads and always say the right things to his opponents during the hand. Jamie put Benyamine on an overpair and he (Jamie)was going to bluff if a dangerous card came off on the turn. I would have loved to see how the hand would have played out had that happened.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

Has anyone ever not liked Benyamine?

I really hope this thread doesn't devolve into 10 pages of moronic discussion about the Doyle hand. It's just a really tough spot for Doyle with what I assume were 500k+ stacks and only 30k'ish or so in on the turn. Doyle's read was right, just a tough spot so deep and I don't think he should be faulted.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

Doyle had the right read. Unfortunately, he read the wrong player. As all the books about tells say, don't trust your read on a very bad player, because they may be honestly deluded about the strength of their hand. Doyle had the worst hand that still beat Jamie's hand, Jamie could just as well have had a higher flush.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

Doyle read him correct, Jamie felt superstrong deepstacked with his flush. It's either play for stack or fold, he knows Jamie will put in another bet on the turn no matter what. Whoever thinks Doyle played that hand wrong is a donkey at best. His hand was like ace high in that situation and he got fooled by the man who fooled himself into believing he had the nuts.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
1) Reraise all in. Don't give Gold a chance to suck out if he just has a pair with a higher spade, two pair, or a set. Get all the money in with the near nuts.

2) Call. This leaves you well over 300k on the river and you have position. See what comes and what Jamie does then.

3) Fold. Seriously, bad bad bad idea. Don't do it.

I will honestly be very surprised if many people disagree with me on this.

I was SHOCKED.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you realize how deep they are? I don't see any other good play there from Doyle. The money in the pot wasn't nearly worth Doyle risking his stack there, and thats exactly what he'd be doing in that spot since Gold bluffs, but he can still easily have a hand that beats him.

On top of that, I think its pretty obvious that most of the pros read Jamie Gold like a book. Doyle picked up that Gold had a strong hand, which narrows his range a lot, mostly to hands that are beating him.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Doyle's read was right

[/ QUOTE ]

No, apparently it wasn't. Generally, when your read is correct, you are going to call or raise when you have the best hand, not fold. It's hard to say his read was correct when he gave away the chance to win hundreds of thousands of dollars in a situation where his opponent was drawing dead.

I'm not going to say it was a terrible unforgivable mistake to fold there, but it wasn't the "right read."

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

still not on tube.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Doyle's read was right

[/ QUOTE ]

No, apparently it wasn't. Generally, when your read is correct, you are going to call or raise when you have the best hand, not fold. It's hard to say his read was correct when he gave away the chance to win hundreds of thousands of dollars in a situation where his opponent was drawing dead.

I'm not going to say it was a terrible unforgivable mistake to fold there, but it wasn't the "right read."

[/ QUOTE ]

Bit of semantics here I think. You're right his read of what exact hand Jamie Gold had was off, but thats not really what hand reading is about. Doyle read Gold as being strong, and he was.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

Fantastic ep, I usually like Antonio, but the end was a total WTF moment.

Hopefully the rest of the season is this good.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

Antonio obviously playing scared money, he wasnt slowrolling.. there simply wasnt many hands that he could beat that would value bet

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The more I see of David Benyamine, the more I like him. It seems like he's always smiling and having a good time.

[/ QUOTE ]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...enberg2007.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, I get it, it's his cavalier attitude.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Whoever thinks Doyle played that hand wrong is a donkey at best.

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems like a common belief in this thread. Isn't folding when the other guy is drawing stone dead technically "wrong?"

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Whoever thinks Doyle played that hand wrong is a donkey at best.

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems like a common belief in this thread. Isn't folding when the other guy is drawing stone dead technically "wrong?"

[/ QUOTE ]

No.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
No.


[/ QUOTE ]

By "no," I assume you mean "yes," especially since the hole card cameras showed us Doyle folding the 3rd nuts.

When I have the 3rd nuts against a crazy man, and I feel he has a good hand, this makes me happy. I know he will stack off when I shove.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

its results oriented man to save the day!

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
its results oriented man to save the day!


[/ QUOTE ]

If by "result," you mean folding the 3rd nuts, then yes.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
No.


[/ QUOTE ]

By "no," I assume you mean "yes," especially since the hole card cameras showed us Doyle folding the 3rd nuts.

When I have the 3rd nuts against a crazy man, and I feel he has a good hand, this makes me happy. I know he will stack off when I shove.

[/ QUOTE ]

I meant no.

First, you need to figure out that making the right choice at the time is different from making the choice that would make you the most money if you knew the other guys hand.

Second, they're DEEP STACKED. Stop thinking in terms of "I have the third best hand. What are the chances someone has a hand better then mine?". Start thinking in terms of "If I get all my money in here how often will I be good? Is this a good play". For various reasons Doyle decided that getting his money in there wasn't a good idea. I agree with him, I actually commented to a friend while watching that Gabe was wrong when he said Gold was going to lose a lot of money on that hand. I thought it was pretty obvious that Doyle would be forced to fold to the check-raise.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is my list of EVs:

EV+:
Patrick
Daniel N.
Antonio E.
Doyle

EV-:
Jamie Gold
Sammy
Guy L.

Borderline:
David B.
Barry G.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol @ Barry G being borderline EV.

moran.

and also lol @ people berating Doyle's fold. When Gabe was sitting there going on about how Doyle was going to stack Jamie, I was sitting there seriously believing Doyle could muck his hand. Why? Because Doyle can read Jamie like a book, and detected high strength tells. Doyle probably believed that it simply wasn't worth risking his stack (who knows how many 500k bullets he had available?) in a borderline situation. Yes, in hindsight, it was an incorrect fold, but Doyle's ability to pick his spots and stay away from marginal situations (like the AK hand against Barry) testify to his past success.

Re: High Stakes Poker thread (11/5 - 500k buyin - Spoilers expected)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Doyle read him correct, Jamie felt superstrong deepstacked with his flush. It's either play for stack or fold, he knows Jamie will put in another bet on the turn no matter what.

[/ QUOTE ]

didn't the big check-raise take place on the turn, when both players made their flush? He only has to call two more bets, and, like, he has the third nuts. Those approving the fold seem to be arguing that his fold has more merit because of how deep they are playing...but against jamie gold, who's spew-happy and probably not going to radically adjust his game because of its depth, it's seems kind of mandatory to call two more bets.

And yes, he did read jamie correct for having a big hand, but to rule out the possibility that Jamie would play a set or two-pair, or whatever-strength hand he happens to have in this way, is wrong. I might be missing something, but why should their stack-sizes totally change the value of the situation.