Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

According to Mark Seif this could also happen at Full Tilt or PokerStars.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

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OP forgot to mention that the founder of www.intellipoker.com (supported by Pokerstars) are close friends to Mr. X Hassan.
They try to train fishes to play intelligent poker. LOL

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Hah! That is interesting. What is your source on that?

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

its called holding out. and has been done for centuries and still happens alot in games where the cards are not counted down regularly and people dont pay attention to subtle things.
a good hold out will not be seen and wont get caught unless something unusual happens to him. even if you are staring at his hands.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[ QUOTE ]
According to Mark Seif this could also happen at Full Tilt or PokerStars.

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lol

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

I don't get how the dealer/ players wouldnt notice that the guy was only mucking 1 card at a time? That doesnt make any sense.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[ QUOTE ]
its called holding out. and has been done for centuries and still happens alot in games where the cards are not counted down regularly and people dont pay attention to subtle things.
a good hold out will not be seen and wont get caught unless something unusual happens to him. even if you are staring at his hands.

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exactly my point. What kind of retarded casino would have deck counts on a regular schedule when you know damn well this scam has been going on since the dawn of poker? You have to be involved right?

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
OP forgot to mention that the founder of www.intellipoker.com (supported by Pokerstars) are close friends to Mr. X Hassan.
They try to train fishes to play intelligent poker. LOL

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Hah! That is interesting. What is your source on that?

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Intellipoker was founded this summer. It is a "pokerschool" quite similar to Pokerstrategy. Many german poker "youngguns" and well known pros like Katja Thater puplish their blogs on that site. She and her husband who actually is the founder of IP and many other Intellipoker blogger played alot with Hassan and he always seemed to be a nice dude, as you can read in their Blogs.
Before any rumors start floating around, Jan von Halle (IP founder) and the other guys from that site had no idea of Hassan beeing a cheat. You can read that on the site( http://docpoker.intellipoker.com/ind...em-ungeziefer/ ) This is the Blog of 7 card Stud bracelet winner Michael Keiner foe those of you who speak german the comments are quite interessting.

edit: lol linkaments

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

http://50outs.intellipoker.com/index...ly-one-hassan/
"One of the other victims was Sebastian (who btw has a new invitation-only forum on his website) from luckbox.de. He lost the biggest pot of the day, like 7k, with K-K versus Hassans A-A after Hassan showed 5 consequtive pure -and big- bluffs in a row. Seb never really recovered from this and lost even more than I did."
sebastian ruthenberg is a member on 2+2 and i think i read somewhere that seriace play also with him

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

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I don't get how the dealer/ players wouldnt notice that the guy was only mucking 1 card at a time? That doesnt make any sense.

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The only time they are mucking one or three cards, is when they are either performing the holdout or putting the extra card back into play. So if a guy is holding, he will always be mucking two cards. When they do muck an odd number, they wait until a time when several people muck, and they can toss their extra card while the dealer is grabbing a bunch of mucked cards. In this case, the guy sat in seat one so he would always be right next to the muck. Basically, you need to look for a guy that places his fingers tightly together (so no space is between his fingers) and moves his tight flat hand an inch above the felt. This is not a natural way anyone moves their hand.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't get how the dealer/ players wouldnt notice that the guy was only mucking 1 card at a time? That doesnt make any sense.

[/ QUOTE ]

The only time they are mucking one or three cards, is when they are either performing the holdout or putting the extra card back into play. So if a guy is holding, he will always be mucking two cards. When they do muck an odd number, they wait until a time when several people muck, and they can toss their extra card while the dealer is grabbing a bunch of mucked cards. In this case, the guy sat in seat one so he would always be right next to the muck. Basically, you need to look for a guy that places his fingers tightly together (so no space is between his fingers) and moves his tight flat hand an inch above the felt. This is not a natural way anyone moves their hand.

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2 years this happened, and people never caught on. Unreal, and I still can't believe it.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

Not sure if this has been mentioned yet but a hold-out artist got busted at Bellagio about 5 years ago.

He was an old man playing 80-160 LHE I think. Would play super-loose preflop obv and showdown weird winning hands.

I think a retired police officer was in a game with him and got suspicious and grabbed his arm and the cards fell out or something.

It should be in the RGP archives.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[ QUOTE ]

Not sure if this has been mentioned yet but a hold-out artist got busted at Bellagio about 5 years ago.

He was an old man playing 80-160 LHE I think. Would play super-loose preflop obv and showdown weird winning hands.

I think a retired police officer was in a game with him and got suspicious and grabbed his arm and the cards fell out or something.

It should be in the RGP archives.

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how long ago did bellagio add the autoshufflers(that count the deck)

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

lmao

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

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He is known as "Hassan", the article refers to him as Mr.X because they want to avoid legal issues. I don't know his last name (or that his first name is even Hassan), but everyone knows him as Hassan.


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this is funny. i really heard a lot about him. still amazed how he could pull this off ... incredible!

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

any legal actions, confiscated money? anything stopping him from moving to another country and going back to his awesome ninjaing ways?

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

is this the same hassan from pokerstars?

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

Using a Kepplinger Holdout to accomplish this, obviously

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[ QUOTE ]
Using a Kepplinger Holdout to accomplish this, obviously

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looks modern

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

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is this the same hassan from pokerstars?

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no, he`s not.

i played with this guy a lot (prob like ~50 sessions) and he must have been very good at cheating. I was not suspicious at all. i really liked to have him at my table.
for me he was a hyper-agressive player who ran over nits. also he had a strategy that i thought worked very well for him:
early in the session with 50-100BB he stacked off super light and showed big bluffs. Later when stacks got deeper (500+ BB) he got way too much action and always had the goods when money went in.


also cheating was super easy:
i played only him in hamburg and back then only one deck was used a whole night unless a card was marked or something.

then one day a dealer forgot to take out one of the joker cards after a deck change and play went on for half an hour until a player was dealt the joker.
from then on each dealer had their own deck and presented it whenever he got to a new table. this must have made cheating a lot harder cause he played more and more in bad zwischenahn.

intellipoker has nothing to do with this guy except for the fact that we were cheated by him.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

yeah I'm about 20-30k € down against hassan...

like 6 months ago a friend told me that he knows what hassan is doing but he couldn't prove it or actually saw it.

Hassan didn't put the cards up his sleeve, he just held them under his hands or arm.

cheating scumbag :/

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

I don't get how he got the cards (the dealer cards...not his cheats) back into the deck. To take their dealer's cards...and to switch them with your own and then switch the dealer's cards back...

Jedi.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

He always put his cards direct into the muck, but nobody got really suspicous because he always did it and it looked "normal" to people who have no clue about cheating.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't get how he got the cards (the dealer cards...not his cheats) back into the deck. To take their dealer's cards...and to switch them with your own and then switch the dealer's cards back...

Jedi.

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The dealer doesn't have cards in play. He just holds the stub in his hand. It's easy for a player sitting in seat 1 to slide a card directly onto the muck or get them mixed with another players' cards who is mucking right after him. Since they were using the same deck there would never be two of the same cards in play. Just a light deck.

It's hard to believe how a casino management could be so clueless about changing and counting decks. It's not like live poker is a recent thing. This guy must have been salivating the first time he played there and realized what was happening.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

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lol "Bad Zwischenahn."

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This is why I only play in "Good Zwischenahn."

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

please post name.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't get how he got the cards (the dealer cards...not his cheats) back into the deck. To take their dealer's cards...and to switch them with your own and then switch the dealer's cards back...

Jedi.

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What's even more amazing- he was wearing short sleeves.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

Europe has weird laws. A scam in England was "legal" until the casinos had the laws changed..

A group of gamblers who won more than £1m at the Ritz Casino in London by using laser technology have been told by police they can keep their winnings.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4069629.stm

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

And if you paste the original link here to translate it:
http://www.pornolize.com/
It's even funnier.
http://www.pokerolymp.de/articles/sh...tschem+Casino!

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[quotee]Before any rumors start floating around, Jan von Halle (IP founder) and the other guys from that site had no idea of Hassan beeing a cheat.

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prove

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

if you wonder why noone noticed for such a long time, thats how it looks like. not easy to see, I guess

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtmzXm15HIg

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

[ QUOTE ]
if you wonder why noone noticed for such a long time, thats how it looks like. not easy to see, I guess

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtmzXm15HIg

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sick

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino
 

There's some pretty good card mechanics in the beginning of a movie Shade.

Re: Poker player caught cheating in German casino