Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

Humans can be homosexuals
Humans can have mental or congnitive disorders

As such, why are we even debating whether or not a retarded person can be gay?

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

I haven't read the responses, but I have had a gay retarded coworker in the past. That answers your question about whether or not identity traits such as these are articulated in the mentally handicapped. He was odd; even for what he was. He would vehemently deny his spectacular homosexuality, only to once again revert the next day into flaming gayness.

Cam

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

i didn't even realize retarded people had sex, guess that shows how out of touch i am

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

Sure there are homosexual retards. Here is one:

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h3...eman/tard4.gif

-J

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

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Identicial twin studies suggest that homosexuality is not entierly genetic. Basically this means that if you have an identical twin (shares 100% of genes) who is homosexual, then while you are more likely to also be homosexual, you won't necessarily be. I can't remember details though, ie how much more likely, and can't really be bothered going and finding finding them. This suggests though that environmental factors play a role. This doesn't mean environmental as in you 'chose' to be gay, ie could be diet, birth complications or plenty of other things that may effect ones biology and stuff.

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You're right, it is nurture. In the womb.

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While biologists look at hormones for answers about human sexuality, other scientists are looking for patterns in statistics. And hard as this is to believe, they have found something they call "the older brother effect."

"The more older brothers a man has, the greater that man's chance of being gay," says Bailey.

If this comes as a shock to you, you’re not alone. But it turns out, it’s one of the most solid findings in this field, demonstrated in study after study.

And the numbers are significant: for every older brother a man has, his chances of being gay increase by one third. Older sisters make no difference, and there's no corresponding effect for lesbians. A first-born son has about a 2 percent chance of being gay, and the numbers rise from there. The theory is it happens in the womb.

"Somehow, the mother's body is remembering how many boys she's carried before," says Breedlove. "The favorite hypothesis is that the mother may be making antibodies when she sees a boy the first time, and then affect subsequent boys when she carries them in utero."

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Source

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Identicial twin studies suggest that homosexuality is not entierly genetic. Basically this means that if you have an identical twin (shares 100% of genes) who is homosexual, then while you are more likely to also be homosexual, you won't necessarily be. I can't remember details though, ie how much more likely, and can't really be bothered going and finding finding them. This suggests though that environmental factors play a role. This doesn't mean environmental as in you 'chose' to be gay, ie could be diet, birth complications or plenty of other things that may effect ones biology and stuff.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're right, it is nurture. In the womb.

[ QUOTE ]
While biologists look at hormones for answers about human sexuality, other scientists are looking for patterns in statistics. And hard as this is to believe, they have found something they call "the older brother effect."

"The more older brothers a man has, the greater that man's chance of being gay," says Bailey.

If this comes as a shock to you, you’re not alone. But it turns out, it’s one of the most solid findings in this field, demonstrated in study after study.

And the numbers are significant: for every older brother a man has, his chances of being gay increase by one third. Older sisters make no difference, and there's no corresponding effect for lesbians. A first-born son has about a 2 percent chance of being gay, and the numbers rise from there. The theory is it happens in the womb.

"Somehow, the mother's body is remembering how many boys she's carried before," says Breedlove. "The favorite hypothesis is that the mother may be making antibodies when she sees a boy the first time, and then affect subsequent boys when she carries them in utero."

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Source

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Incidentally, this is why I said "biological" and not "genetic." I don't know that it's genetic, but the overwhelming evidence is that it is in some way biological. I don't think they've even definitely pinned down just how, but one study after another points to the same conclusion (nits can see my previous post for some examples, obviously).

To draw a parallel, it's like we're at the point in the discussion where every reasonable study is pointing to the earth revolving around the sun, but people aren't yet totally comfortable with saying that because they haven't got the physics totally knocked out and if they're wrong the church is gonna come and burn down their house and they're gonna make a bunch of people angry because those people have been physically and emotionally kicking the [censored] out of the people who say otherwise for so long. This is the same thing, except with teh gheys. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

-bb.

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

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which got me thinking about whether or not people who actually mentally retarded express things like homosexuality

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Wow your brain works in strange and mysterious ways.

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..says the guy with an avatar of a dancing gay toolman :]

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

BB-

Great analogy! I love it!

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

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Study after study after study indicates that it is.

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I love it when people use this line as defence for their position. Care to reference any of these *numerous* studies?

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Sometimes people say that because it's an issue whose factual basis should be taken as given.

Study after study after study after study.

There are others, but my biological drive is telling me that it's friday night and I should go out and try to find some delicious vagina instead of staying in having a slap fight over this stupid issue. Take your snottily expressed lack-of-an-opinion elsewhere.

-bb.

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this is freaking awesome. one of the more thorough oot ownings in recent memory.

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Identicial twin studies suggest that homosexuality is not entierly genetic. Basically this means that if you have an identical twin (shares 100% of genes) who is homosexual, then while you are more likely to also be homosexual, you won't necessarily be. I can't remember details though, ie how much more likely, and can't really be bothered going and finding finding them. This suggests though that environmental factors play a role. This doesn't mean environmental as in you 'chose' to be gay, ie could be diet, birth complications or plenty of other things that may effect ones biology and stuff.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're right, it is nurture. In the womb.

[ QUOTE ]
While biologists look at hormones for answers about human sexuality, other scientists are looking for patterns in statistics. And hard as this is to believe, they have found something they call "the older brother effect."

"The more older brothers a man has, the greater that man's chance of being gay," says Bailey.

If this comes as a shock to you, you’re not alone. But it turns out, it’s one of the most solid findings in this field, demonstrated in study after study.

And the numbers are significant: for every older brother a man has, his chances of being gay increase by one third. Older sisters make no difference, and there's no corresponding effect for lesbians. A first-born son has about a 2 percent chance of being gay, and the numbers rise from there. The theory is it happens in the womb.

"Somehow, the mother's body is remembering how many boys she's carried before," says Breedlove. "The favorite hypothesis is that the mother may be making antibodies when she sees a boy the first time, and then affect subsequent boys when she carries them in utero."

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Source

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This is interesting but isn't definitive IMO. The more older brothers you have, the more you get the **** kicked out of you. This has to have an effect on your social development. Hanging out playing dolls with the neighberhood girls>getting pummeled by your brothers.

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

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This is interesting but isn't definitive IMO. The more older brothers you have, the more you get the **** kicked out of you. This has to have an effect on your social development. Hanging out playing dolls with the neighberhood girls>getting pummeled by your brothers.

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Yeah, playing with dolls will turn you gay. WTF, it is evident that these people are different from their behavior at like age 2.

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

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i didn't even realize retarded people had sex, guess that shows how out of touch i am

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They are one of the biggest victim groups of sexual assault.

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

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[ QUOTE ]
This is interesting but isn't definitive IMO. The more older brothers you have, the more you get the **** kicked out of you. This has to have an effect on your social development. Hanging out playing dolls with the neighberhood girls>getting pummeled by your brothers.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, playing with dolls will turn you gay. WTF, it is evident that these people are different from their behavior at like age 2.

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No. Many people don't "come out" even to themselves until puberty or well past.

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

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I read this to mean that [censored] was implying that a predisposition to homosexuality might be genetic,

Its entirely possible that I am missing the point. But I was trying to say that I do not believe that homosexuality is solely genetic, or something one is "born with", but instead may also be a result of behavioral factors.

Which is the right answer? Could be both, could be neither...I don't think anybody knows for sure.

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But you seem to have a fairly firm opinion on this topic... based on what, exactly?

Are you citing some studies or ancedotal evidence for your assumtion about the environmental effects?

What behavioral factors do you believe influence sexuality preferences?

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

My father is a very qualified geneticist of over 30 years. He has a PHD, tenor, oversees several lab heads in the genetics department at a major pharmaseutical company, etc.

His opinion of the subject of the genetic basis of homosexuality is that there are genetic factors, but certainly no one or even few genes that determines whether someone is homosexual.

Even fruit flys can display homosexual behavior, and this is triggered from genetic alterations that vary GREATLY. In other words, there are many many sets of genes that can be altered in many ways to achieve this effect, and with an environment trigger (such as a specific change in the food given to the flys) the flies will nearly always show homosexual behavior. To clarify, they basically lose interest in the female flies and mating, even though they are capable of reproduction.

Despite being vastly more complex organisms, we are very similar to fruit flys on a genetic level. Like for most traits, a huge number of genes and alleles influence whether a person will have homosexual tendencies. No one is born gay in the sense that they are always going to be attracted to men and not women. It is more of a genetic predisposition towards it based upon a number of genes, and is still largely determined and "decided", if you will, by environmental factors.

This is a pretty general interpretation without many facts, and you can't draw many conclusions from it. If people are interested I can ask my dad for more information on the subject. I haven't gotten any further in genetics than AP Biology and the occasional slide show he has shown me, heh.

and f the mod who gave me a star for my comment. Slightly more deserved than my first star, for posting "should poker be included on a college application" in OOT instead of "The Dorm", but still pretty dumb.

-Jeff

Re: Question from mod forum: homosexuality + retardation
 

aren't most gays retarded?