Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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you will make up for in maturity, experience and stability.

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Ha ha. My GF would laugh at this idea.
I'm more like a 12 year old...just with a rapidly receding hair-line.
More 'little kid' in many ways than I am 'mature adult'.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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you will make up for in maturity, experience and stability.

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Ha ha. My GF would laugh at this idea.


I'm more like a 12 year old...just with a rapidly receding hair-line.
More 'little kid' in many ways than I am 'mature adult'.

[/ QUOTE ]

Even better for when they are < 13. Afer that it won't matter what you do. The pod people steal them and replace them with their teenagers.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

pure love and adoration for 10-12 years sounds pretty awesome to me.

like a dog, but you get to do more molding.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

I have been married for alomost 10 years now, and never really wanted kids, but my wife did badly. I wanted to make her happy, so we tried and tried for years. After not getting anywhere we went through IVF. We ended up having triplets. They will be 2 in January. I am 40, and tired all the time. I didnt really want one, but would have been ok with it. Now we have 3. After almost 2 years with them, I cannot imagine my life without them. You say the way you feel now, I did the same. They came along, and everything changed. Not because it HAD to change, but because my feelings changed. If you let it happen, and it does, you may find your self loving it. You can still be a man, and do "man" things, but you will suddenly find that you cannot wait to get home to see the smiling faces, and the little ones running to you with thier arms wide open.....GL with whatever you decide. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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We ended up having triplets. They will be 2 in January.

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Are you planning to eat one of them on new year´s day?

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

The wife and I have a 5 month old, we're 29. I never really wanted kids, she wanted them from day 1, I finally came around to the idea and we had one.

I was never a baby person. I was more of a toddler person. Once the kid started walking/talking/playing catch, etc. I thought they were cool.

However, having a baby is the most exciting and stimulating thing ever. They're sponges, and given the right guidance they'll grow up to be exceptional people. Having that responsibility is so scary/rewarding nothing compares.

There's nothing like hearing your child laugh for the first time, and there's nothing worse than going three straight months without more than 3 straight hours of sleep.

Anyway, it's way different when it's your own child. I never thought I'd talk funny to him, or whatever, but when you do and they smile, it's absolutely incredible.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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We ended up having triplets. They will be 2 in January.

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Are you planning to eat one of them on new year´s day?

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No, I will wait till the day they try and reverse your lobotomy [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

I figure there are too many people on this planet already... why should I add more? I've never heard a convincing argument to have children but I'm always willing to listen.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

Need more parents to post in this so they convince all you idiots that kids are likely the most rewarding part of your life.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

I want girls. Not enough parents encourage their girls to grow up to be good, wholesome sloots and I'd like to do my part to fix that problem.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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Need more parents to post in this so they convince all you idiots that kids are likely the most rewarding part of your life.

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Well, there's a well-reasoned argument. I better go procreate immediataely!

Edit to add: I also see no reason to have children of my own when there are children in orphanages that need a loving home. I think it would be easier to convince me to adopt than to convince me to sire my own children.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

I have twin boys coming in February and I am terrified. I am not really into kids per se. Just hoping that 'bonding' kicks in hard.

The one thing I have seen is that there does seem to be something 'missing' in people who never have had kids. Not sure if societal pressure just catches up, but I haven't seen many childless couples who have had a blast in life because they could whatever they want.

I am also looking at getting away from 'I' am everything and being able to view the world through someone else's eyes.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

and a SLF is???

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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Need more parents to post in this so they convince all you idiots that kids are likely the most rewarding part of your life.

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If they are going to do that then they need to actually name specifics of how having children has improved their lives. Most of the time it is just abstract and meaningless statements like having children is "amazing" or having children was the best thing I ever did.

They never explain how or why children improved their life only that they did. The negatives of having children are pretty easy to list so why are the benefits such abstract concepts?

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Need more parents to post in this so they convince all you idiots that kids are likely the most rewarding part of your life.

[/ QUOTE ]

If they are going to do that then they need to actually name specifics of how having children has improved their lives. Most of the time it is just abstract and meaningless statements like having children is "amazing" or having children was the best thing I ever did.

They never explain how or why children improved their life only that they did. The negatives of having children are pretty easy to list so why are the benefits such abstract concepts?

[/ QUOTE ]
You can list reasons from several different angles of why I should not eat bacon, and I may even agree with some of them in principle. But I still do it, because it causes me pleasure.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

But the reason bacon causes you pleasure is easy to figure out. It tastes good.

Around x-mas I always seem to catch this horrible Nicholas Cage movie where some x-mas angel gives him a look at what his life could have been. I get the point of the movie but I still think the Cage character is wrong. His current life is a million times better than his missed life.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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I figure there are too many people on this planet already... why should I add more?

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This is incorrect. don't feel like explaining why

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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I was giving it some serious thought recently after a pregnancy scare with my SLF. I have only been around a baby for a total of 10-15 hours my entire life. I think that they are cute, but I am not capable of playing or talking to them. Making baby noises seems to come naturally to most people, but I could never do it. I don't find little kids very interesting and I can't see myself being one of those parents who decides to stop living their own life to dedicate it to Disney cartoons and diaper cleaning because "Isn't the baby so perfect and special!" I think human beings have a responsibility to pursue intellectual outlets and raising a child is pretty much the opposite. "Dad you only care about running your billion dollar corporation, not my third grade science project!" However, I know that having children is important to my SLF, so I feel obligated to comply in the future. The times I was around kids, I pretty much had to fake liking them and being interested in them to make their parents feel good. It would kind of suck if I had to fake liking my own child, so hopefully its different. Now that I think about, my father never seemed very interested in me. So maybe that is why I feel a lack of paternal instincts.

I am curious if anyone felt similarly and how it turned out after you had children?

Many of you are going to say that I shouldn't have children, but that doesn't seem realistic. You make commitments to people and sometimes you have to suck it up and do stuff you don't want to do.

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I don't think there is anything wrong with not having kids. If that is how you feel, so be it. The only thing I would advise is to keep an open mind so that you can allow change to happen more easily. Having rigid, inflexible, perma-fixed beliefs about anything inhibits growth and reduces your ability to evovlve.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

[ QUOTE ]

If they are going to do that then they need to actually name specifics of how having children has improved their lives. Most of the time it is just abstract and meaningless statements like having children is "amazing" or having children was the best thing I ever did.

They never explain how or why children improved their life only that they did. The negatives of having children are pretty easy to list so why are the benefits such abstract concepts?

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Just don't have children, and don't worry about it. You're mature enough to realize you don't want them and that is great. I would never wish children on someone who wasn't committed to them. However, asking for tangible benefits of having children shows a fundamental lack of understanding when it comes to having kids. What do you want people to say? That we get small tax breaks?

I'm sure you are not looking for the times your 1 year old brings you a book and plops down on your lap waiting for you to read. Or when you go to daycare and your child races across the room with a big smile on his face to give you a giant hug. The main benefit from having kids is in the abstract: feelings of overpowering love, fulfillment, and joy.

Again I'm not here to harp on people who don't want to have kids. I applaud it, actually. I have many friends who don't want to have kids, or who never have, and are quite happy. There is no right or wrong answer here.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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There is no right or wrong answer here.

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While I agree with this I don't believe most people see it that way. There seems to be a strong societal consensus that choosing to not have children is the wrong answer.

I'm a competent adult with an extensive education and a track record of making good decisions in life. Yet the general response on the no children position is that I'm either going to change my mind (when I see the light) or that I'm going to regret my decision (supposedly because it was the incorrect decision as people rarely regret correct choices).

It is an interesting phenomenon as I can't really think of any other reasonable life choice where disagreement with the social norm is considered a sign of defective agency. That makes me suspicious of the motivations.

I dated a girl with a child once. I'd never do that again. That is as close as you can get to test driving parenthood without being committed for life and I hated it.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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yes, i want to have kids, if only so that i know that i'll have someone to play golf with for the rest of my life.

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lol... they will be into lacrosse

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

anyone, what does SLF mean? OP i also have trouble relating to kids since i have no experience with them, but figure that is just a matter of time something that change. what i like is that kids are so naive and good natured and happy, so it makes me that too.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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since i have no experience with them

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If you may recall, I'm pretty sure you were a kid once too.
They aren't that tough imo but overall I like kids and get along pretty well with them and have a fun time with them, etc.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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since i have no experience with them

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If you may recall, I'm pretty sure you were a kid once too.
They aren't that tough imo but overall I like kids and get along pretty well with them and have a fun time with them, etc.

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wow thanks microbob, how could that have slipped my mind? damn! guess i was indeed a kid once, good point.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

retitle this thread to add "do you want to have kids with fluffpop" and see how the responses change.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

special lady friend

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

I come from a big family, therefore I am accustomed to being around a lot of people so I think having no - 2 children would drive me nuts. I'd like to have 3-5 kids if possible (I'm only 20, so call me crazy).

I see nothing wrong with people choosing to not have children. No one "owes" society anything in regard to being a parent - I think that argument is complete BS.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

I had my first child with my wife at 19 and my second just less than two years later. I have never regretted it and they have been among the most cherished parts of my life and to this day I find them if not intellectually stimulating, in the very least a ton of fun.

Also, I must add that they have seldom stifled my intellectual pursuits. In particular I only started college "after" I started having children and I am currently a graduate student while my kids are now elementary students. It doesn't suck the life out of you. Well, it might do that for some people, but it has never done so for me.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

IMO Swift summed up the best way to have children

http://art-bin.com/art/omodest.html

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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It doesn't suck the life out of you. Well, it might do that for some people, but it has never done so for me.

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It depends on what you mean by life. Having children is much more compatible with certain lifestyles than others. If you go to work and come home then yes it will have very little impact on your life. Some people like that and so it works out but for them.

For other lifestyles having children does suck the life out of you. Fine dining is pretty much a thing of the past or now reserved for special occasions. Travelling is much harder and the destinations now have to be family friendly. Clubbing requires a babysitter so realistically is never doing to happen. Sex has to be restricted to the bedroom or while children are away. Living downtown should really be replaced with living in the suburbs but that is fine since all the benefits of living downtown are off the table now anyway.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

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I'd be interested if someone could name specific benefits of having children.

So far I've seen an argument about my genes but that doesn't really matter to me.

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It seems like when countries industrialize and generally become wealthy, their citizens tend to have fewer children per household. It must have something to do with wanting more time to enjoy wealth, and having some sort of entertainment other than screwing without a condom/birthcontrol. We're devolving.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

ok for me here's the thing:

i am going to die, and this renders my existence all but meaningless, because no matter what great things i manage to do i won't be around to experience the fruits of my labors afterwards.

so one of the big reasons i want to have kids is to leave a footprint on the earth, and have some small direct influence on the future of life on this planet through bringing someone up the way i feel is right, and nurturing them so that they can take what i've learnt/earnt, and turn it into something even greater. and then hopefully pass that on to their kids also.

i guess that is my response to mortality, as an atheist.

it's also probably the closest thing to true love there can ever be, too.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

I understand how it is difficult to specifically spell out the benefits of having children vs the drawbacks in a manner which truly represents the balance.

I think a better question for the skeptics to ask is "Does anyone regret having children?" The fact that everyone here is overwhelmingly glad they did indicates to me that the benefits, while abstract, are profound.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I understand how it is difficult to specifically spell out the benefits of having children vs the drawbacks in a manner which truly represents the balance.

I think a better question for the skeptics to ask is "Does anyone regret having children?" The fact that everyone here is overwhelmingly glad they did indicates to me that the benefits, while abstract, are profound.

[/ QUOTE ]

You've convinced me... let's make babies

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think a better question for the skeptics to ask is "Does anyone regret having children?" The fact that everyone here is overwhelmingly glad they did indicates to me that the benefits, while abstract, are profound.

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This is an excellent point FFK. You just can't understand the effect that having your own kids has on your life. I was / am in the "I'd like to kick other people's kids across the room" crowd. But my kids, of course, are the greatest kids on Earth.

I just sent my son off to college, and I get to see him for a couple of hours a week, at most. I miss him so much. It's impossible for someone who doesn't have children to understand.

Another huge benefit of kids is it keeps my wife and my love for each other strong. We have very differing interests, and I'm not at all certain our marriage would have lasted without kids. But when you have children together with someone, at least in our case, it bonds you together like nothing else. Everything else seems trivial in comparison.

It's not all fun and joy, however. My daughter is 16, beautiful, popular, and with a mind completely her own. No, it's not always fun.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is an excellent point FFK. You just can't understand the effect that having your own kids has on your life. I was / am in the "I'd like to kick other people's kids across the room" crowd. But my kids, of course, are the greatest kids on Earth.

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But clearly you are aware of the fact that your kids really are not the greatest kids on Earth and that you are just being wilfully blind because of the special relationship you have with them.

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I think a better question for the skeptics to ask is "Does anyone regret having children?" The fact that everyone here is overwhelmingly glad they did indicates to me that the benefits, while abstract, are profound.

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To borrow a play from the pro-children camp these parents have no idea what they missed out on so how would they have regrets?

The only way to know for sure would be to get two runs at life and have children in one and be childless in the other. Even then the answer would only be correct for that specific individual. Some people are perfectly happy being at home and not really having a social life. Others would be miserable.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

the benefits of being a parent:

if you're a bad person you get a defenseless thing to abuse
if you're a good person you get to share your virtue and joy with another and they share their virtue with you.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

[ QUOTE ]
But clearly you are aware of the fact that your kids really are not the greatest kids on Earth and that you are just being wilfully blind because of the special relationship you have with them.

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Duh. And if you ever have kids, you will think they are the greatest as well -- and I'll want to kick them across the room. That's the way it works.

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To borrow a play from the pro-children camp these parents have no idea what they missed out on so how would they have regrets?

[/ QUOTE ]
While true, it's a little misleading. Now that I've had kids, I can tell you that I would never make the decision not to have them. I was married for 4 years without kids, so I have lived life both ways. If you choose never to have kids, you will not have that luxury. And it's quite possible you will have regrets, agree? Whereas I will never have them.

In addition, in two years my wife and I will again be alone with no children in the house. We'll be 46, and still have 30 or so years ahead of us to do whatever we want -- no strings attached.

Those 20 years of "burden" (if that's how you look at it) will be a very small price to pay, in my opinion.

Your mileage may vary.

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

kids i know i want 100%
a wife, i'm not so sure.

i still don't how this works as i'm not one of those guys that could settle for seeing my kids every other weekend or switching off holidays or whatever. i have been with a couple of women in the past that i knew would be fantastic mothers, but neither would go for it w/out the marriage.

i have always thought that having children would be the most fulfilling part of my life, so if i don't find a woman that changes my mind about marriage in the next ten years (i'm 30) i'll most likely go the single dad route. does anyone on here have any experience with that?

Re: Do you want to have children?
 

[ QUOTE ]
kids i know i want 100%
a wife, i'm not so sure.

[/ QUOTE ]
I had to laugh at this. While neither my wife nor I have ever regretted having kids, I can assure you we've both had moments of regretting we ever got married. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] I think that's pretty par for the course in marriage.