Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Those who are saying Phil is cheating obv have no clue about golf gambling and if someone accused the guys I play with of cheating based on not being happy with the strokes they got, they would be beat up, have the debt taken from their pocket and never get a game again.

ftr, I'm not an internet tough guy and I couldn't beat up Dr. Ruth even with a 5 iron, I'm saying the guys I play with would not put up with that whining.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

salazaaaaar is right and so is Blair Rodman imo.
what's the point of playing high stakes golf if you dont set out to win the other man's money ('as friends')..

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Ivey may have burned a lot of bridges. It may cost him even more money down the road. If there was ever going to be another poker boom, his image has been tarnished. Some sponsors may pass on him, not like cares anyways.

[/ QUOTE ]
This one really made me LOL. You think anybody who doesn't read 2+2, Hendon Mob or FCP even knows about this??? Let alone sponsors??? You're kidding yourself.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Poker is not that big of an industry. [censored], even on wall streeet I know all big gossip that concerns my 2004 classmates.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Those of you that are saying Ivey cheated obviously know nothing about gambling. Phil simply played 'the game' to perfection, and came out on top. He outplayed Ram & Co. where it counts the most: negotiations.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
with this logic, you guys should support grimstar for not going allin on that coin flip, because as far as he knew, his opponent wasn't only going to go allin unlesss he had the best hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

nh


but there's some room for the counter that its like continuing to do coinflips after being repeatedly grimstarred.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

The reason Phil Ivey is by far the best poker player alive is partly because he is the best gambler out there. He knew Vaswani is probably a degenerate who wouldn't even stop playing once he was getting killed. Why else would they demolish Vaswani so badly? They should obviously have been shaving shots off just to make the game look good. But, no, they didn't need to - they had their mark. The guy got abused and he has nothing to his story - not wanting to pay "one dollar" is [censored] pathetic. They should reset the handicaps to what they were at the time and square the deal. Even in that case they are letting Vaswani off the hook.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Those who are saying Phil is cheating obv have no clue about golf gambling and if someone accused the guys I play with of cheating based on not being happy with the strokes they got, they would be beat up, have the debt taken from their pocket and never get a game again.

ftr, I'm not an internet tough guy and I couldn't beat up Dr. Ruth even with a 5 iron, I'm saying the guys I play with would not put up with that whining.

[/ QUOTE ]

The fact that you play golf with scum has no relevance in this discussion

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
The fact that you play golf with scum has no relevance in this discussion

[/ QUOTE ]

HAHAHA. It's totally relevant. These aren't lawyers who play golf for leisure. PI would be scum under this scenario. But, these are negotiating edge seeking gamblers who use golf as thieir venue to wager. Not everyone plays your kinda golf betting.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Funny how DN called out guys who hustle golf like this a few years ago, but when his buddy does the same thing, it's fine.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

We need Limon's opinion...

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Seems like Ram pulled the biggest hustle of them all, play for high stakes, if you win, get $$$$$$$, if you lose.. dont pay

Gambling is all about getting good betting spots, and there aint no better spot then a freeroll

Ivey should just accept he got hustled and move on

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Funny how DN called out guys who hustle golf like this a few years ago, but when his buddy does the same thing, it's fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

qft

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Seems like Ram pulled the biggest hustle of them all, play for high stakes, if you win, get $$$$$$$, if you lose.. dont pay

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
when will people understand that it is cheating...

[/ QUOTE ]FYP

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Seems like Ram pulled the biggest hustle of them all, play for high stakes, if you win, get $$$$$$$, if you lose.. dont pay

Gambling is all about getting good betting spots, and there aint no better spot then a freeroll

Ivey should just accept he got hustled and move on

[/ QUOTE ]

this is so true.If Ivey "hustle" is ok then so is Rams,in not paying.

LOL @ Ivey trying to collect after his mark found out he got cheated.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I know it’s not for me to make a decision on this matter which is why I came up with the idea of arbitrators but whatever happens as far as I am concerned I shouldn’t have to pay a single dollar.

[/ QUOTE ]He doesnt say he has no intention of paying, he says he doesn't think he should have to pay a penny, anything more would obviously be bad arbitration. Not difficult to understand now was it?
i liked this part. he comes up with the idea to use arbitrators, but has no intention of paying.. so what's the point of arbitration?

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Look, I started this thread and now I demand some MSPAINT and Photoshop magic from you guys!!!

None on this thread or the original 26 page thread.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Funny how DN called out guys who hustle golf like this a few years ago, but when his buddy does the same thing, it's fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

qft

[/ QUOTE ]Exactly, as are all the Ivey supporters here and on the other forums where this is posted. If it wasn't Phil Ivey, let's say it was Jamie Gold, how many would have the same stance? Very very few, because Ivey's actions are indefensible.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
cliff notes:

phil = liar
daniel = idiot
ram = not paying
Jackal69 = ignorant

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

I think the logic to not have to pay on this match means, if over the course of like 1000 holes, someone is up 200k, they should get a refund, b/c obviously the handicaps were off throughout.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

^^^^^^

never a truer sentence constructed, kudos sir

(thats good job for the americans who cant do english)

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
A sucker is born every minute. Pay the man his money.

I used to play pool and hustle a lot. If you see a mark, you take it down. If you don’t, another shark will. Happens every day in pool halls, Wall Street, casinos etc…

This was set up nicely and Ivey was going through the motions. Ram had no chance, he continued because of stupidity, mad tilt and stubbornness.

Ivey just showed that he’s a classless poker celebrity and really doesn’t care how he’s being portrayed. Hey, who gives a s.h.it “all about getting paid biatch!”

Ivey “the hustler” pwned Ram but may have burned a lot of bridges. It may cost him even more money down the road. If there was ever going to be another poker boom, his image has been tarnished. Some sponsors may pass on him, not like cares anyways.

Great hustlers get paid by suckers, without even letting them know they just got hustled.
Ivey is not great yet.

[/ QUOTE ]

sponsors pass on him?? doubt it buddy, there is no such thing as bad publicity anymore

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
cliff notes:

phil = liar
daniel = idiot
ram = not paying
Jackal69 = ignorant

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

haha, you should have your location forcibly changed for such a weak insult. Do you frequent FCP as well by any chance?

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Ivey “the hustler” pwned Ram but may have burned a lot of bridges. It may cost him even more money down the road. If there was ever going to be another poker boom, his image has been tarnished. Some sponsors may pass on him, not like cares anyways.


[/ QUOTE ]

lololololololololololoololllllool

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

1. Ram has to be one of the biggest suckers alive. To go from up $30k golfing against PI to down well over a million in a few days is impressive stupidity.


2. DN's blog is more about how he took his lumps on the golf course than about the current dispute. DN got hustled on the course last year in the exact same manner (fudged handicaps and players shooting well above their averages with "rounds of their lives"), but DN paid up. His post on a story of someone not paying reinforces to himself, his friends, and the very gamblers who hustled him that DN is not a welcher.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
We need Limon's opinion...

[/ QUOTE ]

ram is an idiot a loser and a mark. you think phil (and his partners) chose him by accident? phils big mistake was not getting the cash at the end of the round, im sure his partners aren't happy about that. god you all are so stupid when defending ram. you think when ram was saying that BS about "not my clubs...havent been playing" he was telling the truth? he was negotiating (he thought). he got out negotiated and then cried like a little bitch....wahhhhhhhhhhhhhh. he was the classic degenerate mark. he fell for the hustle the 1st day and came back for more w/o renegotiating. "team ivey" picked him well. ram and mark run in circles where all these negotiations are well known, nothing they are saying is true. they are attempting to appeal to an uninformed public and force some sort of rematch or settlement.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Not sure if it's been mentioned yet, but your handicap does not adjust upwards as fast as your improvement.

Phil may have been playting to a 20 handicap, didn't play for 3 months but instead took lessons everyday.

When he plays again his handicap is still 20. Even though he may now have the skill of a 10 handicapper, his handicap does not adjust because he took lessons. It only adjusts based on the scores you shoot.

Handicaps are calculated using your best 10 out of your last 20 scores. Shooting one good score or one bad score does not usually change your handicap very much.

Phil's handicap, by the numbers, was probably correct at the time of the match.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
We need Limon's opinion...

[/ QUOTE ]
they are attempting to appeal to an uninformed public

[/ QUOTE ]

And based on the posts across the different forums it seems to be working too...

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Some people, when they lose big, adjust the handicaps and get a rematch. Other people whine like bitches and don't pay. Which person are you?

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
We need Limon's opinion...

[/ QUOTE ]
they are attempting to appeal to an uninformed public

[/ QUOTE ]

And based on the posts across the different forums it seems to be working too...

[/ QUOTE ]

of course becuase people think you can lie about a handicap in a histakes golf game. as if a handicap is some sort of scientific reference point. handicaps are complete bullshyt and everyone knows it...especially guys who bet 10k a hole. if the handicap meant anything ram wouldnt even mention how hed been playing or his clubs hed just hand over his handicap card phil would hand over his theyd look at the rating and slope of the course and the bet would be set w/o a word being uttered. BUT THAT WOULD NEVER HAPPEN BECAUSE THEY ARE BOTH TRYING TO LIE, LIE LIE LIE LIE. Ram is just a complete moron, he was chosen for that fact. phil and his backers had one chance to spring his new golf game on the public, they needed maximum bang for the buck. they needed to choose the stupidest mark they could find...enter ram vaswani. i guarantee they didnt even float an idea of the match to hamilton or tomko because after 9 holes they would have quit and renegotiated.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

general consensus among golf gambler's is that this was a solid hustle, marc and ram's integrity has been tarnished, not ivey's.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Maybe they should get Russ and Dewey to arbitrate.
That ought to be good.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Clearly, the facts are in dispute here and there's no way we can claim to know the details of this situation.

However, I have a general question (well, two) for the golf gamblers out there:

Is it considered permissible to deliberately lie about your handicap/ability/experience in order set favorable terms for yourself?

If, for example, you set a handicap based on your opponents assurance that "I haven't touched my clubs in months," you lose big, and then you subsequently find out that he's been training 4 hrs/day with a top coach, should you refuse to pay?

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe they should get Russ and Dewey to arbitrate.
That ought to be good.

[/ QUOTE ]

ram would end up paying (with juice) and getting his ass kicked. the only way any true hustler would ever stick up for ram was if they were getting a piece of the settlement.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Clearly, the facts are in dispute here and there's no way we can claim to know the details of this situation.

However, I have a general question (well, two) for the golf gamblers out there:

Is it considered permissible to deliberately lie about your handicap/ability/experience in order set favorable terms for yourself?

If, for example, you set a handicap based on your opponents assurance that "I haven't touched my clubs in months," you lose big, and then you subsequently find out that he's been training 4 hrs/day with a top coach, should you refuse to pay?

[/ QUOTE ]

1. not permissible...mandatory
2. sure you can refuse to pay...but you better pay. while your at it you should also refuse to pay your markers at harrahs becuase you lost 10k on "the worlds loosest slots". and definately dont play in poker games that allow the "check and raise" its so unsportsmanlike.

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

From the Rules of Golf

6-2. Handicap
a. Match Play
Before starting a match in a handicap competition, the players
should determine from one another their respective handicaps.
If a player begins a match having declared a handicap higher
than that to which he is entitled and this affects the number of
strokes given or received, he is disqualified;

Ivey is a cheat - End Of

Hussle = Cheat

Cheat = Lying scum

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

out of curiosity, is it acceptable to walk off the course mid round when you realized you've been hustled big time (while paying off what you lost so far)? Or to refuse to play until renegotiation takes place mid-round or whatever?

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

Limon,

given that Ram seems admant about not repaying anything, what do you forsee as happening next? Will they be persona non grata in Vegas, should they be hiring bodyguards? This is rumoured to be $2 million after all...

J
6
9

Re: Ram Vaswani speaks about that \'Golf Game\'.
 

[ QUOTE ]
From the Rules of Golf

6-2. Handicap
a. Match Play
Before starting a match in a handicap competition, the players
should determine from one another their respective handicaps.
If a player begins a match having declared a handicap higher
than that to which he is entitled and this affects the number of
strokes given or received, he is disqualified;

Ivey is a cheat - End Of

Hussle = Cheat

Cheat = Lying scum

[/ QUOTE ]

You are dumb.