Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

I think you're right on. Razz is probably the least skill-dependent game in the HORSE event, which is why everyone was being cautious.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think you're right on. Razz is probably the least skill-dependent game in the HORSE event, which is why everyone was being cautious.

[/ QUOTE ]

2 reasons for the passive razz play:

1) The tourney´s pay structure: the difference between 13 or 14th and 5th or 6th was huge so trying to make the final table was a priority. It didn't make sense to gamble so early.

2) Being this a HORSE event, players usually play their worse games in a more conservative way. Why force the action in a game in which you are not that good when you can save your chips and use them in your best games?

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

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[ QUOTE ]
lol world series of chip stacking

how did Carlos Mortensen not win this??

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Does Adam Schoenfeld have a real job or what? He seems to pop up on ESPN when they need a smarta^s opinion on something related to poker but he never seems to be anywhere close to a final table.

From CP's db he hasn't cashed in anything since 2004 and the only tourney (that made it in the db) that he won was the Linda Johnson Celebrity Challenge.

[/ QUOTE ]

He's the Paul Lynde of poker celebrities.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

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That was a sick beat K Tran took.

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3 baby spades, the OESFD on 4th street, and blanks the rest of the way for no high or low

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Wow did Kaplan play that Razz hand terribly against Raymer. How do you fold a 10 high with Raymer showing a King and a pair?


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Because he doesn't think Raymer can bet into him with a hand he beats given what's on board. This seems pretty obvious.


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And you've never heard of Raymer bluffing before, Dids? If someone bets that river, they must have it? I think that is an easy call the way that hand was played.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

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I wish Gabe won this tourney.

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Almost every single hand Gabe was in (on TV) he played like a total donkey. The KKX stud hi lo hand versus Deeb was a complete joke.

I was shocked to see he was among the chips leaders for a while. But perhaps ESPN only showed his donk hands.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

Yeah that's the one where Deeb asked him if he had two pair and Gabe said no, and then Freddie said nothing else b/c he didn't want to embarrass Gabe.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Wow did Kaplan play that Razz hand terribly against Raymer. How do you fold a 10 high with Raymer showing a King and a pair?


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Because he doesn't think Raymer can bet into him with a hand he beats given what's on board. This seems pretty obvious.


[/ QUOTE ]

And you've never heard of Raymer bluffing before, Dids? If someone bets that river, they must have it? I think that is an easy call the way that hand was played.

[/ QUOTE ]

Right. GR had to have three cards in the hole that were 10 or lower (and not a 4 or 5). Gabe's getting at least 8-1 on that call?

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
That was a sick beat K Tran took.

[/ QUOTE ]

3 baby spades, the OESFD on 4th street, and blanks the rest of the way for no high or low

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't think he was open-ended (I thought he had 83x spades, but I may be mistaken), but a sick beat nonetheless.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

that matusow exit hand was so funny. he had just about every part of his opponents hand covered - except for that very single one. look on his face was priceless. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

also lol at negreanus exit pretending he got bad beat on the last hand when he was drawing against 20 outs.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
that matusow exit hand was so funny. he had just about every part of his opponents hand covered - except for that very single one. look on his face was priceless. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

also lol at negreanus exit pretending he got bad beat on the last hand when he was drawing against 20 outs.

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Matusows hand looked worse than it was. 08 pf equities are much closer than they look. Much closer.



-Tex

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

I honestly don't know why people found Amnon annoying. Someone enlighten me.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]

also lol at negreanus exit pretending he got bad beat on the last hand when he was drawing against 20 outs.

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't read that into his behaviour. I think it was just that the HORSE tournament was one he really wanted to win, and he was more diappointed he was out.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

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I honestly don't know why people found Amnon annoying. Someone enlighten me.

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Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I wish Gabe won this tourney.

[/ QUOTE ]

Almost every single hand Gabe was in (on TV) he played like a total donkey. The KKX stud hi lo hand versus Deeb was a complete joke.

I was shocked to see he was among the chips leaders for a while. But perhaps ESPN only showed his donk hands.

[/ QUOTE ]


Gabe has become my hero but he played those hands terribly. On PAD he said that he only plays in 2-3 tournaments a year and hasn't played in the main event for a few years. He marveled at how Doyle still plays so many tournaments and said he personally doesn't have the stamina anymore. He look exhausted to me, he didn't even realize that Raymer paired his door card on six in that razz hand. My guess is he probably played some real good poker early, then got lucky and stayed in longer then he should have. Gabe my man, if you read this don't play in anything beyond two days

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

norman chads results oriented commentary was especially tilt-inducing this episode

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I wish Gabe won this tourney.

[/ QUOTE ]

Almost every single hand Gabe was in (on TV) he played like a total donkey. The KKX stud hi lo hand versus Deeb was a complete joke.

I was shocked to see he was among the chips leaders for a while. But perhaps ESPN only showed his donk hands.

[/ QUOTE ]


Gabe has become my hero but he played those hands terribly. On PAD he said that he only plays in 2-3 tournaments a year and hasn't played in the main event for a few years. He marveled at how Doyle still plays so many tournaments and said he personally doesn't have the stamina anymore. He look exhausted to me, he didn't even realize that Raymer paired his door card on six in that razz hand. My guess is he probably played some real good poker early, then got lucky and stayed in longer then he should have. Gabe my man, if you read this don't play in anything beyond two days

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Yeah obviously missing that paired door card rattled him, then he didn't want to look bad again by paying off on the river. It was sad to watch.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

I really like Gabe and wish he's had the courage to call that 7th street card. He did really well to get as far as he did but it was strange not seeing the funny guy we see on HSP! [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
lol world series of chip stacking

how did Carlos Mortensen not win this??

[/ QUOTE ]

Does Adam Schoenfeld have a real job or what? He seems to pop up on ESPN when they need a smarta^s opinion on something related to poker but he never seems to be anywhere close to a final table.

From CP's db he hasn't cashed in anything since 2004 and the only tourney (that made it in the db) that he won was the Linda Johnson Celebrity Challenge.

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I mentioned in a long ago thread that he is my pet peeve about ESPN's coverage. I can get past everything else. They are ALWAYS trying to get his opinion on things when he has no relevance whatsoever. My head hurts just thinking about him. And didn't it seem like he and Lederer were just mailing in that segment. Schoenfeld looked like he had ZERO desire to be there. Get him OFF my TV [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think you're right on. Razz is probably the least skill-dependent game in the HORSE event, which is why everyone was being cautious.

[/ QUOTE ]

3 reasons for the passive razz play:

1) The tourney´s pay structure: the difference between 13 or 14th and 5th or 6th was huge so trying to make the final table was a priority. It didn't make sense to gamble so early.

2) Being this a HORSE event, players usually play their worse games in a more conservative way. Why force the action in a game in which you are not that good when you can save your chips and use them in your best games?

3) Very few of the players were any good at razz, but most of them were good enough to realize this.

[/ QUOTE ]
FYP

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

i think amnon is hilarious...love his comebacks to matusow.

quads over quads is sickening.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

So is the final table all NLHE, or do they keep playing horse?

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
FWIW -- did you notice, honestly, how tight the play was?

when i play limit tourneys on stars, or just the individual
cash games, there seems to be a lot more capping, 3rd street
reraising etc... There was one razz hand when 3 guys all had
3 to an 8 low or better, and THEY ALL LIMPED IN!!

You'd never see that on pokerstars...

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well, hell, if that's how they play on stars these donks on tv must be doing it wrong!!!

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

Ahhh.. the real world rears its ugly head again.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

HORSE all the way this year.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
HORSE all the way this year.

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Cool that should be a lot of fun. I'm loving the variety of this tourney. It's like the polar opposite of WPT all-in almost every hand shown.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

I didn't get the Greenstein - Reslock hand.
Barry had 7476K5A
Reslock had 425TTTQ

So, 4567K vs 245TQ, isn't the last hand wins?
I only played Razz once in my life, so i maybe off here, but Q low should beat K low, no?

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't get the Greenstein - Reslock hand.
Barry had 7476K5A
Reslock had 425TTTQ

So, 4567K vs 245TQ, isn't the last hand wins?
I only played Razz once in my life, so i maybe off here, but Q low should beat K low, no?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ace is low in Razz. Barry's hand is A4567.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

Ah, forgot about that.
Thanks!

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
So is the final table all NLHE, or do they keep playing horse?

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it's all NLHE.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

hmmmm

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

The final table of this year's HORSE event kept with the HORSE format, unlike in 2006 when they went to a NL holdem final table.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

I'm Sorry, my fault.

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

Quads over quads was ridiculous. At first I thought that Singer was being kind of silly saying "maybe I should have folded", but on that flop, if your opponent is playing like he has something, KK is really the only option isn't it?

I was rooting for Gabe too, but he was getting himself in a lot of bad situations...that Stud8 hand vs. Barry where he was drawing to a 7 low vs two players was pretty bad considering how strong Barry was playing. Most people who play a lot of Stud8 know that it's a really bad situation - drawing to win half when you could be drawing completely dead. Hard to figure you've got good odds on that...

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

what was the ratio of online pros to B&M pros in this tourney?

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

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what was the ratio of online pros to B&M pros in this tourney?

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this looks like a complete list of entrants: http://www.pokernews.com/live-report...p-counts/day1/

Seems as if there were very few online pros although I don't recognize all the names. I think CTS staked foxwoodsfiend IIRC. Darrell Dicken and ZeeJustin I guess are online pros (or at least players known for playing online).

Re: WSOP on ESPN thread (10/23 - $50K Horse - Parts 3 and 4)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So is the final table all NLHE, or do they keep playing horse?

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it's all NLHE.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wrong