Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

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hi recallme

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lol

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Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

If you're not gonna get the money in when you make the 2nd nut flush, then just fold the flop.

Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

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you need to retool your game if you aren't shoving here, simple as that.

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if your game is so transparent that he can fold low-medium flushes here then you really do. also, calling here just destroys your metagame and youll have a really hard time bluffing in the future.

Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

I was just discussing this with ur friend and i agree now it seems like raise/fold to a shove.

Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

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you need to retool your game if you aren't shoving here, simple as that.

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if your game is so transparent that he can fold a pair of dueces here then you really do. also, calling here just destroys your metagame and youll have a really hard time bluffing in the future.

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Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

my head hurts

Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

I'm a friend of Jamie217 and this thread annoys me, because it gives me the impression 2+2ers are for the most part robots, who are not willing to stop and give some things a bit more thought, but instead give standard, 'no-brainer' lines.

Normally I shouldn't be mad about this, but when you give thrash advice in a cocky, authoritative, patronising manner it looks ridiculous.

The points made in Jamies last post were actually mine. Leatherass is capable of good laydowns. His calling range when we push the river are only flushes. The highest flush that we beat here is 8s7s, since it's impossible for him to have Q high flush given the cards here (we exclude A,K,J,T,9), so what can he have, Q8s? I don't think so. He's very capable of folding a small flush here. Also he doesn't always bet the flop with small flushes since the Ace there is very likely to hit someone. Axs is definitely a part of his range, because it's congruent with how he played.

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If you're not gonna get the money in when you make the 2nd nut flush, then just fold the flop.

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Ridiculous. Yeah, lets abstract from reads, timing, turn and river action, pot size, ranges etc etc. Lets base our decision on a flop call. In fact we should actually go back a bit more and fold pre-flop just because we played this hand conservatively when we hit. Yeah, lets leave the game, because we're making reads instead of acting like robots.

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if your game is so transparent that he can fold low-medium flushes

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If your river raise isn't transparent to a very good, thinking player that means you're playing crazy. Seriously. What kind of range can you put a guy on when he pushes river, besides a flush? A bluff? Come on.

I'm not saying a call is best. In fact I didn't give half of my thoughts on this hand. My point is this hand isn't obvious stuff and that's why Jamie217 posted it. At least give these ideas some thought, before you berate my friend. At least try.

Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

you are scared money

Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

lol at this thread

Re: KJs river flush vs Leatherass
 

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If your river raise isn't transparent to a very good, thinking player that means you're playing crazy. Seriously. What kind of range can you put a guy on when he pushes river, besides a flush? A bluff? Come on.

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'LOL'