Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

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Assume the BB and all of the limpers will always call. If I raise, I'm investing $5 more to get $12 more into the pot. So, in a way, I'm giving myself 12-5 or 2.4-1 "odds" on the raise.

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This would be correct if you was going to either raise or fold, but it's between call or raise, so you only count the odds you're getting on the $3 raise.

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Now let's instead pretend that we're playing some bizarre structure where I post a live $5 blind but it still remains $3 to call preflop. If I "raise," I'm only putting in another $1 to get the same $12 into the pot, giving myself 12-1 "odds." In theory, it would be then profitable to raise with anything I'd be willing to take 12-1 odds on to strictly call.

Am I making the slightest bit of sense at all?

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This is true, but doesn't really relate to the actual hand.

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Okay. I've been known to talk out of my ass before, but less since I've been on my diet and quit eating at Taco Bell.

I was working from a similar concept as to why I don't steal from the SB as often at 3/6, because I have to invest $5 to win $4. Obviously it's not totally analagous, since in a steal I'm banking on folding equity more than pot equity in this example, but I thought maybe the $5-to-raise concept would make it similar enough.

Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

You have enough opponents so that any overcards would be very problematic. So you're usually banking on the set potential. Your set comes in what, 9:1? So it seems like putting extra money in for your 5:1 talk is unprofitable. Do you think the 9s hold up often enough aside from the set to make up for the difference? Pocket pairs are good versus lots or a little, with a few opponents it seems better to just be happy to see the flop.

Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

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Now let's instead pretend that we're playing some bizarre structure where I post a live $5 blind but it still remains $3 to call preflop. If I "raise," I'm only putting in another $1 to get the same $12 into the pot, giving myself 12-1 "odds." In theory, it would be then profitable to raise with anything I'd be willing to take 12-1 odds on to strictly call.

Am I making the slightest bit of sense at all?

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This is true, but doesn't really relate to the actual hand.

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Okay. I've been known to talk out of my ass before, but less since I've been on my diet and quit eating at Taco Bell.

I was working from a similar concept as to why I don't steal from the SB as often at 3/6, because I have to invest $5 to win $4. Obviously it's not totally analagous, since in a steal I'm banking on folding equity more than pot equity in this example, but I thought maybe the $5-to-raise concept would make it similar enough.

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Not really. The reason is that with 99 you're *ALWAYS* seeing the flop from this position, so your $2 to complete is a de facto pot contribution (proper use of latin phrase?). Therefore, the raising question is only a matter of the $3 above the de facto $2.

In a blind steal, you're not presuming the $2 is already pot-ward bound, so you need to consider the whole chunk of $5 all at once.

Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

preflop is fine, regardless of structure

obv bet the flop

Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

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looks like you flopped a set. I think I'd start putting money in the pot right away.

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That's what it looks like to me, too.

Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

OK we all know about jamming this flop--is there some other action you want to show, e.g. the turn is 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]? Let's see it!

Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

Nah, not really. It gets less interesting and more painful from there. Your pattern mapper isn't far off, though:

Ultimate Bet 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: marchron is SB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, marchron completes, BB checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, MP3 calls.

River: (5.50 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, MP3 calls.

Final Pot: 7.50 BB

Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF">
marchron has 9c 9s (three of a kind, nines).
MP3 has Td Jc (straight, king high).
Outcome: MP3 wins 7.50 BB. </font>

Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

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march ron do you ever lose a hand? lol

bet obv

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Sure, not only this one, but this one at a different 3/6 table not five minutes later:

Ultimate Bet 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: marchron is MP2 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">marchron raises</font>, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, BB calls.

Flop: (4.33 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB calls.

Turn: (3.16 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB calls.

River: (5.16 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, marchron checks.

Final Pot: 5.16 BB

Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF">
BB has Jc Td (straight, king high).
marchron has Qc Qd (three of a kind, queens).
Outcome: BB wins 5.16 BB. </font>

Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

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march ron do you ever lose a hand? lol

bet obv

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Sure, not only this one, but this one at a different 3/6 table not five minutes later:

Ultimate Bet 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: marchron is MP2 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">marchron raises</font>, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, BB calls.

Flop: (4.33 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB calls.

Turn: (3.16 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB calls.

River: (5.16 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, marchron checks.

Final Pot: 5.16 BB

Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF">
BB has Jc Td (straight, king high).
marchron has Qc Qd (three of a kind, queens).
Outcome: BB wins 5.16 BB. </font>

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The river check behind is sexy

Re: in which I only complete 99 from the SB
 

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The river check behind is sexy

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Seconded.

Care to share the thoughts behind that, Marchron?