Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

[ QUOTE ]
I believe raising the flop is your best chance (and the cheapest way) to quickly get him to fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Care to elaborate on which games you play..? In my games (party mid stakes) this happens like 1 in a million.

Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

Also. Raising the flop because you want him to fold air is bad as well. With a pot this small its much better to let him keep bluffing his 6 outer.

raising here will in general never fold a better hand so when he folds it was with a hand where the value of him bluffing again on the turn is better.

I am sorry, but raising the flop is terrible!

Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Also. Raising the flop because you want him to fold air is bad as well. With a pot this small its much better to let him keep bluffing his 6 outer.

[/ QUOTE ]

Some fold air, but some don't. Many loose players will never fold to a flop raise regardless of what they have (I think it's called the "half-in" rule). Force him to make bad calls, not bluff-bets.

Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Also. Raising the flop because you want him to fold air is bad as well. With a pot this small its much better to let him keep bluffing his 6 outer.

[/ QUOTE ]

Some fold air, but some don't. Many loose players will never fold to a flop raise regardless of what they have (I think it's called the "half-in" rule). Force him to make bad calls, not bluff-bets.

[/ QUOTE ]

So now you want to raise the flop for value? I am confused. Do you want him to fold his air or call with air? as far as I can see you first wanted him to fold right now and now you want him to make bad calls with air..? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Also, if you want to raise for value. Please to be stating the range you put him on because I highly doubt there is any value in a flop raise with K high here.

Dude! raising the flop is terrible!

Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

I like this play better than the other bluff raises. I know the ILP said he thought the Qhigh one on the end was correct, but I just thought it looked like spew.

On this hand I can see this villain donking into you with a T, 9, or small pkt pair desperately hoping that you think he has a 4. Of course he could also do this with total crap, but in that case your KQ high is good and the raise is unneccessary. I think the parlay of the chance that you fold out a T, 9, or smaller pkt pair makes this play ok. for others reading this I would never try this play below 5/10 as noone will ever fold. Occasionally at 5/10 or higher it seems you can get people to b/f the river, this just doesn't happen at .25/.50-3/6.

Also it would help if you would give some reasons why he seemed bad. I would be much more willing to make this play against a bad TAG, a passive-nit, or LAG than some other types.

Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

[ QUOTE ]
I use to never bluff raise the river. Now I cant help myself

[/ QUOTE ]
haha this is why I've never made a value bluff raise hand post. the last thing I need are TAGs doing this to me

this looks alright though I'd rather have some sort of read.

Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

i wouldn't take 7-1 that he has a folds a 9 or T

Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

[ QUOTE ]
i wouldn't take 7-1 that he has a folds a 9 or T

[/ QUOTE ]


bad players aren't bet/folding a T or 9 here ever, that's why they are bad players.

they probably checked the turn because of the A

and for what it's worth, if this guy folded, you were probably winning with KQ anyway.

I liked the q9 hand, because better non pair hands can fold, but here, there are no better non pair hands, and ppl don't fold pairs, so basically, your raise does nothing but charge you 1BB when behind, and net you 0BB when actually ahead.

Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

don't bluff raise nut-no-pair

Re: Another river bluff raise.
 

this is why I never bluff-raise the river. I thought this was one hand we had a chance to rep an A, a flush, or the 4 and actually fold out pairs that are beating us. Apparently the consensus is that noone ever folds a better hand here.

I'm sure I'm giving up some equity by not having this play in my arsenal, but I think I would misapply it to often to gain anything from it.