Re: Button steal checkup
 

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I don't think I'm asking anything clever here. Villains range could be relatively wide or not wide given these conditions. Some villains who play well postflop will call a wide range here. No need to tell me not to ask.

See what I did there?

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Huh? I guess I don't. I wasn't telling you not to do anything... just pointing out that the information wasn't really absent.

Sure, some good players are looser in SB than others, but it's still a fairly safe assumption that a tight aggressive pro isn't making a habit out of CCing in that spot. Also, if joker had a read that specific -- and in live play you usually don't -- he probably would have included it.

Re: Button steal checkup
 

I didn't have much more of a read than this... I've played with the guy before (won't say his name in case he lurks here); he's older than us (40s) and has a stud background, but has made his living at holdem in recent years.

His hesitation before calling the raise indicated to me that a) he's not used to just calling from the SB in button-steal situations; b) he has a hand that might call for 3-betting and is considering a deceptive line for some reason; c) has a hand that he usually folds but is considering getting involved to see what happens; d) etc. etc.

Re: Button steal checkup
 

jesus you should have said he was old. call and fold turn ui

Re: Button steal checkup
 

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jesus you should have said he was old. call and fold turn ui

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my live game is a little rust but wouldn't this depend on if pj is a young whipper snapper or not?

Re: Button steal checkup
 

id call flop and 2 bet a diamond turn. also fold on turn unless u improve.

Re: Button steal checkup
 

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jesus you should have said he was old. call and fold turn ui

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Hey! I resemble that remark.

Re: Button steal checkup
 

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What's your line now? What are the benefits of 3-betting here? If you do 3-bet, do you take a free turn card? Do you bet the turn and take a free showdown? What if your 3-bet gets 4-bet? If you just call, are you raising a diamond turn on a semibluff? If you don't improve, are you calling the turn and folding the river? Calling down? How bad is folding the flop?

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Wow, that's a lot of questions. I'm not smart enough to tackle all of them, but fwiw it seems like any plan that involves 3-betting the flop or semi-bluffing could be considered "getting out of line" (not that there's anything wrong with that [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]).

Against his range in this spot, we're behind a large % of the time. I think calling the flop and folding the turn unimproved is ok. If he fires the river and you haven't made 2 pair, trips, a straight, or a flush, fold.

Re: Button steal checkup
 

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jesus you should have said he was old. call and fold turn ui

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actually you should say he has a stud background. call and fold turn ui.

Re: Button steal checkup
 

If this old guy is making his living at holdem, then he would know to 3 bet a big A preflop. This sounds like its a small suited ace and he figured it was too good to throw away on button steal but did not want to 3 bet. Call flop and fold unimproved turn.