Re: the ol\' call-4bet
 

a) The pot is so big after getting raised on turn that hero should call down.
b) We should fold to the raise because our hand is like never good after he call/caps and then raises turn.
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These are always tough situations. I have to say the turn donk is pretty bad. I tend to express opinions in these situations based on my version of reality (which is not normal). My opinion is that you should calldown and hate yourself. I mean OMG you have top2. He could have A9 or T9 (or QJ). So yeah I think we are going to see both vils have worse hands often enough. If villain is drawing with QJ, that cuts into our calldown odds though. One more bonus is you are paying 2 more bets to get a better read on his weird c/r aggroness. Also, you probably need a plan B if frenchy raises in order to avoid getting trapped.

Buzz

Re: the ol\' call-4bet
 

Well,

There are some reasonable two-pair hands you beat - A9, T9

Sets can be figured in there – TT and 99 most likely if out there

Then of course massively overplayed TPTK…..

Perhaps even QJ doing some value betting.

I’d say there’s enough hands out there you beat, or can draw out against that you want to see the turn aggressively and the river cheaply

Sarge[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Re: the ol\' call-4bet
 

all,

it's funny because i was actually devil's advocating again when i suggested folding the turn. i'm getting to showdown here ~always. interesting that some of you aren't!


sarge,

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I’d say there’s enough hands out there you beat, or can draw out against that you want to see the turn aggressively and the river cheaply

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so does this mean that you like the turn donk? do you 5bet the flop and lead instead? something else?

Re: the ol\' call-4bet
 

[ QUOTE ]
all,

it's funny because i was actually devil's advocating again when i suggested folding the turn. i'm getting to showdown here ~always. interesting that some of you aren't!


[/ QUOTE ]

please report back with a count to this effect.