Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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Kennedy + Melky + Some good prospect I don't know about...how short of cabrera is that

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Kennedy + Melky + Tabata + 2 more of our top rated pitchers = MC...maybe

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

ah my fault... go back and read my first post again tho

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
Kennedy + Cano + Melky + Some good prospect I don't know about...how short of cabrera is that

EDIT- forgot cano sry kyleb

so ya how short is that? I would do that... cano is close to replaceable... and melky is easily replaced and improved upon

[/ QUOTE ]

This would easily be one of the dumbest trades of all time if it ever happened

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Kennedy + Cano + Melky + Some good prospect I don't know about...how short of cabrera is that

EDIT- forgot cano sry kyleb

so ya how short is that? I would do that... cano is close to replaceable... and melky is easily replaced and improved upon

[/ QUOTE ]

This would easily be one of the dumbest trades of all time if it ever happened

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Don't be an ass... just explain why you think so... no reason to discourage throwing around ideas

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Kennedy + Cano + Melky + Some good prospect I don't know about...how short of cabrera is that

EDIT- forgot cano sry kyleb

so ya how short is that? I would do that... cano is close to replaceable... and melky is easily replaced and improved upon

[/ QUOTE ]

This would easily be one of the dumbest trades of all time if it ever happened

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't be an ass... just explain why you think so... no reason to discourage throwing around ideas

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The fact that your asking me to explain why is nuts.
This is the kind of thinking that [censored] the yankees for the past 5-6 years. Lets trade 5 of our up and coming players for 1 really good player.


The same goes for the morons who want to trade for Santana with something like Hughes + Melky + Tabata + misc. etc

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
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Kennedy + Cano + Melky + Some good prospect I don't know about...how short of cabrera is that

EDIT- forgot cano sry kyleb

so ya how short is that? I would do that... cano is close to replaceable... and melky is easily replaced and improved upon

[/ QUOTE ]

This would easily be one of the dumbest trades of all time if it ever happened

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't be an ass... just explain why you think so... no reason to discourage throwing around ideas

[/ QUOTE ]

The fact that your asking me to explain why is nuts.
This is the kind of thinking that [censored] the yankees for the past 5-6 years. Lets trade 5 of our up and coming players for 1 really good player.


The same goes for the morons who want to trade for Santana with something like Hughes + Melky + Tabata + misc. etc

[/ QUOTE ]

I said 4 players melky (meh) cano+kennedy and some other prospect... Miguel Cabrera is Young himself... They would be better right away, and better in the long run.... if i was saying hughes or joba I would agree with you, but i'm not

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

So anyway back to my question, would the marlins do that? or what else would they need

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Kennedy + Cano + Melky + Some good prospect I don't know about...how short of cabrera is that

EDIT- forgot cano sry kyleb

so ya how short is that? I would do that... cano is close to replaceable... and melky is easily replaced and improved upon

[/ QUOTE ]

This would easily be one of the dumbest trades of all time if it ever happened

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't be an ass... just explain why you think so... no reason to discourage throwing around ideas

[/ QUOTE ]

The fact that your asking me to explain why is nuts.
This is the kind of thinking that [censored] the yankees for the past 5-6 years. Lets trade 5 of our up and coming players for 1 really good player.


The same goes for the morons who want to trade for Santana with something like Hughes + Melky + Tabata + misc. etc

[/ QUOTE ]

I said 4 players melky (meh) cano+kennedy and some other prospect... Miguel Cabrera is Young himself... They would be better right away, and better in the long run.... if i was saying hughes or joba I would agree with you, but i'm not

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Yes lets trade one of the best players on our team and a future star and all we'll be leaving is a massive hole at 2nd base.

Oh and while we are at it lets thrown in Melky and why not one of our future starting pitchers for next year and beyond...hmm lets toss in Sanchez to..who needs him.

Blah blah blah...why don't we just trade all of our prospects and young players on the team for 2 or 3 studs like Cabrera, Santana, etc

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

BECAUSE

Melky sucks at CF and they need a better one anyway and kennedy isn't that likely to be a stud, just a solid pitcher that money could easily buy.... cano is a big deal.... BUT IT'S MIGUEL CABRERA!!!!!!!!

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

Oh ya and I've been meaning to mention:

There was a BP article a while back saying that the yankees should trade melky and cano + other stuff I don't remember for Cabrera

I jus wanted to let you sound like an illogical ass first, didn't take long

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
Oh ya and I've been meaning to mention:

There was a BP article a while back saying that the yankees should trade melky and cano + other stuff I don't remember for Cabrera

I jus wanted to let you sound like an illogical ass first, didn't take long

[/ QUOTE ]

then BP are idiots.

We'd have to give up Melky + Cano + Kennedy + Horne or Sanchez or Tabata to match what others are going to offer for Miguel.

If BP is saying we should give up all of that for Miguel then they are retardo. We shoulda just offered Arod 300 million instead and kept all those prospects

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

The mistake of AROD not being resigned should be viewed as a sunk cost...

that should have no effect on the MIGGY trade besides that we now need a 3B

you continue to be illogical and arrogant but you do seem knowledgable, more so than myself

Give me some floors and ceiling comparisons for Horne Sanchez and Tabata... unless they're guaranteed studs, this trade makes sense for the yanks

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
The mistake of AROD not being resigned should be viewed as a sunk cost...

that should have no effect on the MIGGY trade besides that we now need a 3B

you continue to be illogical and arrogant but you do seem knowledgable, more so than myself

Give me some floors and ceiling comparisons for Horne Sanchez and Tabata... unless they're guaranteed studs, this trade makes sense for the yanks

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Its basically this..we trade for Cabrera and give up X+X+X+X+X...we now need a 2nd baseman, a #4 starter, if Andy retires a #3 and #2 starter. a CF. and an entire bullpen + we need to resign our closer and catcher + the disaster that is 1st base. And in a year or two we may need a new 3rd basemen because Miguel has to be moved to 1st base.

OR

We can trade much much less for LaRoche or Tejada.

Not to mention...we NEED [censored] PITCHING!!

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

cano is not easily replaceable are you nuts. he is a 10 WARP3 player at second base and is arb-eligible.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
cano is not easily replaceable are you nuts. he is a 10 WARP3 player at second base and is arb-eligible.

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Yes, please explain why Cano is replaceable whoever said that. Especially considering that he is still young and may eventually develop 30 HR power.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

trading cano for cabrera in any deal is beyond stupid

god onlinebeginner just get over your irrational hate for melky and irrational love for the soon to be broken down aaron rowand

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

its LaRoche or Tejada tradewise...otherwise well end up with some FA scrub or maybe Crede

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

Cano... must... STAY!

<-------------

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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its LaRoche or Tejada tradewise...otherwise well end up with some FA scrub or maybe Crede

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Please?

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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Cano... must... STAY!

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hes the most valuable guy on the roster. mcab is obv tempting, and they are close in overall value, but cano just blows the thing out the water by being so much cheaper.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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its LaRoche or Tejada tradewise...otherwise well end up with some FA scrub or maybe Crede

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or that scrub barry bonds

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
Kennedy + Cano + Melky + Some good prospect I don't know about...how short of cabrera is that

EDIT- forgot cano sry kyleb

so ya how short is that? I would do that... cano is close to replaceable... and melky is easily replaced and improved upon

[/ QUOTE ]

Cano is the least replaceable of all the Yankee trade candidates.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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cano is not easily replaceable are you nuts. he is a 10 WARP3 player at second base and is arb-eligible.

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i never said this, I said close to replaceable... and I didn't mean long term or in terms of money... I just meant this coming years production

Miguel could be in GOAT caegory as a hitter, and he's still young giving up cano shouldn't be deemed as so bad by u guys, since the player we'd be getting in the blockbuster deal is also a young guy

The whole we need pitching, agreed but kennedy's production for this coming year is also easily replaceable, and come 2009 1 or 2 big name FA SP will be signed....

and it's not an irrational hate for melky... he's just not good enough to be a starting CF for the yankees... maybe in a couple years, but I don't wanna wait that long if he has to start in the mean time... plus with the defensive scrubs we have at the corners WE NEED A BETTER DEFENSIVE CF

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

Sublime,
I'm just gonna put it in this thread, hopefully you read it.... you said cano and cabrerara straight up would only be a marginal deal for the yankees... explain this, because everything I looked at has MIGUEL as a top 5 hitter all-time for his age...

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

Also stat nerds... who is beter defensively Jones or Rowand? There was one metric floating around that seemed a little iffy...can someone help me out here

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
Sublime,
I'm just gonna put it in this thread, hopefully you read it.... you said cano and cabrerara straight up would only be a marginal deal for the yankees... explain this, because everything I looked at has MIGUEL as a top 5 hitter all-time for his age...

[/ QUOTE ]

OBG, do you know what baseball-reference.com is? If not, check it out. I guarantee you will find it really cool. Let me try to answer part of the question. Cano has averaged a 123 OPS+ the last two years. The typical second baseman is probably a 90 OPS+. Making that trade gives you a 150 OPS+ DH. Not only does this hurt team flexibility (where do you play posada in a couple years?) but finding at least a 120 OPS+ DH should be fairly easy without giving up your 43 extra points at 2B, that leaves you 13 pts ahead of the trade scenario. Add in the fact that Cano is under your control for longer and is much cheaper.

Now I don't know how good Cano is defensively, if he's a butcher its a different story, but if he's good the he's probably as valuable as Miggy because Miggy has no defensive value.

Next year the Yanks get way more offense keeping Cano and signing Bonds to DH, or getting Tejada to play third. If they could sign Jones or Hunter for CF, trading Melky to get Tejada would make sense.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

Dc,
You make some good points, but for some reason i'm the one that likes rowand... but whatever

and yes I know what baseball-refrence.com is, infact i recall reading an article a while ago saying that they should trade cano and melky + other stuff i don't remember for MIG

also this isn't fantasy baseball...Theres a better chance AROD comes back as opposed to them signing bonds

lasty MIGGY would play 3b/1B As well as some DH

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
Sublime,
I'm just gonna put it in this thread, hopefully you read it.... you said cano and cabrerara straight up would only be a marginal deal for the yankees... explain this, because everything I looked at has MIGUEL as a top 5 hitter all-time for his age...

[/ QUOTE ]

Look at Cano. He is a likely HOFer at 2nd base. Well in the sense that if he doesn't fall off the cliff or get injured. MCab is a 1st baseman. And a good one, but his numbers aren't the same at 1B.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sublime,
I'm just gonna put it in this thread, hopefully you read it.... you said cano and cabrerara straight up would only be a marginal deal for the yankees... explain this, because everything I looked at has MIGUEL as a top 5 hitter all-time for his age...

[/ QUOTE ]

Look at Cano. He is a likely HOFer at 2nd base. Well in the sense that if he doesn't fall off the cliff or get injured. MCab is a 1st baseman. And a good one, but his numbers aren't the same at 1B.

[/ QUOTE ]

your starting a team from scratch...you really think cano is that comparable to miguel?

... not to mention the yankees replacement level players are higher than average due to their blessed financial situation.. they can always sign an above average guy... so premier players are more valuable to them

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
Dc,
You make some good points, but for some reason i'm the one that likes rowand... but whatever

and yes I know what baseball-refrence.com is, infact i recall reading an article a while ago saying that they should trade cano and melky + other stuff i don't remember for MIG

also this isn't fantasy baseball...Theres a better chance AROD comes back as opposed to them signing bonds

lasty MIGGY would play 3b...not DH

[/ QUOTE ]

Defensive metrics are fuzzy, but Andrew Jones has often been rated among the all time greats, Rowand hasnt and Jones is the better hitter. Of course Jones may have eaten himself out of his talent. You'll find out what Cashman thinks when you find out who he targets, he's got at least three FA options to upgrade at CF, if he keeps Melky it will say something.

And BRef doesnt have articles, its a repository of detailed stats, I think you are confusing it with primer or another site.

Not sure why you think Bonds is unsignable, he's a natural fit and is likely to be signable on a short term deal. Either way my point is that there are many options to get good offense out of the DH spot, its even possible Giambi could rebound and hit close to Miggys level.

The problem is for all of his hitting prowess and the runs he creates with his bat, Miggy is going to give a alot of them back with his iron glove. If Cano is a plus defender at a prime position like 2b the difference in defensive value can overcome their difference in hitting. Tejada is a plus defender, playing him at SS would be worth way more than Miggy. Miggy would have to DH and you'd be stuck with no hit 3b and 2b, so how does that improve the team?

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sublime,
I'm just gonna put it in this thread, hopefully you read it.... you said cano and cabrerara straight up would only be a marginal deal for the yankees... explain this, because everything I looked at has MIGUEL as a top 5 hitter all-time for his age...

[/ QUOTE ]

Look at Cano. He is a likely HOFer at 2nd base. Well in the sense that if he doesn't fall off the cliff or get injured. MCab is a 1st baseman. And a good one, but his numbers aren't the same at 1B.

[/ QUOTE ]

your starting a team from scratch...you really think cano is that comparable to miguel?

... not to mention the yankees replacement level players are higher than average due to their blessed financial situation.. they can always sign an above average guy... so premier players are more valuable to them

[/ QUOTE ]

Online,
Cabrera has NO DEFENSIVE VALUE. Cano has value by playing defense. Offense isn't everything you know. If Cano saves 1/4 a run per game on defense, that ends up being 40 runs over a season.

Not to mention that if Cabrera went to the Yankees, he would end up being a DH in a year or 2. NY could just keep Cano, and find a DH elsewhere. If Cabrera was awesome defensively, no one would argue w/ you.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

Given their current contracts. Yes, Cano ~ MCab

Cab will make 25 mil or so and be done faster than Cano.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

not only that where are the yankees going to find a replacement 2b

rowand will be great for a year and then fall off a cliff - he is injury prone and center fielders don't age well. melky is an average defensive center fielder imo, and he will improve as a hitter.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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your starting a team from scratch...you really think cano is that comparable to miguel?


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If you were starting a small market team, then yes, Cano>Cabrera.

It's all moot since the Yankees aren't starting from scratch. They are a championship caliber team that has holes that need to be filled. If you trade Cano, arguably the second best 2b in MLB, you are creating a hole to fill a hole. Melky is easily replaceable via free agent, Kennedy's short term production is easily replaceable. Those are also two nice fits for Florida. The key is the 3rd/4th players. The Yankees have a very deep farm system and can give up two middle tier prospects (Ramirez, Gardner) or give up another top flight guy (Jackson, Betances). That would definitely be worth it from the Marlins POV (save money, fill black hole in CF). The question is, would anybody pony up more? The answer is, maybe.

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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There was a BP article a while back saying that the yankees should trade melky and cano + other stuff I don't remember for Cabrera

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Pretty sure this never happened

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

Andy MacPhail, the Orioles' president of baseball operations, said yesterday he is looking for players who are either ready for the majors or close to it, and it is unlikely that he would require one of the Yankees' big three to be part of a deal for Tejada.

MacPhail seemed impressed with the job Cashman has done in rebuilding the minor-league system, saying the talent extends beyond the three pitchers.

One of the Orioles' top needs is in the outfield, the one area other than pitching that the Yankees actually have some legitimate prospects. Brett Gardner, who stole 39 bases in 99 games between Double-A Trenton and Triple-A Scranton this year after swiping 58 in the minors in 2006, is the closest to being ready for the big leagues, though lower-level prospects such as Jose Tabata and Austin Jackson are considered to be better long-term players.

The Orioles could take one of the outfielders along with a mid-level pitching prospect for Tejada, who hit .296 with 18 home runs and 81 RBI in 133 games this year. Tejada missed 29 games after breaking a bone in his wrist when he was hit by a pitch, but he had played in all 162 games in each of the previous six seasons.

Baltimore also would have interest in Kyle Farnsworth, as relievers Chris Ray and Danys Baez will miss the entire 2008 season following Tommy John surgery. Farnsworth pitched for the Cubs when MacPhail was an executive in Chicago.


Uhh..Cash...trade for Tejada please

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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Andy MacPhail, the Orioles' president of baseball operations, said yesterday he is looking for players who are either ready for the majors or close to it, and it is unlikely that he would require one of the Yankees' big three to be part of a deal for Tejada.

MacPhail seemed impressed with the job Cashman has done in rebuilding the minor-league system, saying the talent extends beyond the three pitchers.

One of the Orioles' top needs is in the outfield, the one area other than pitching that the Yankees actually have some legitimate prospects. Brett Gardner, who stole 39 bases in 99 games between Double-A Trenton and Triple-A Scranton this year after swiping 58 in the minors in 2006, is the closest to being ready for the big leagues, though lower-level prospects such as Jose Tabata and Austin Jackson are considered to be better long-term players.

The Orioles could take one of the outfielders along with a mid-level pitching prospect for Tejada, who hit .296 with 18 home runs and 81 RBI in 133 games this year. Tejada missed 29 games after breaking a bone in his wrist when he was hit by a pitch, but he had played in all 162 games in each of the previous six seasons.

Baltimore also would have interest in Kyle Farnsworth, as relievers Chris Ray and Danys Baez will miss the entire 2008 season following Tommy John surgery. Farnsworth pitched for the Cubs when MacPhail was an executive in Chicago.


Uhh..Cash...trade for Tejada please

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If this article is article this NEEDS TO HAPPEN

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

trading for miggy is probably a bad move

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

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trading for miggy is probably a bad move

[/ QUOTE ]

how so?

Re: ***yankees official offseason thread*****
 

his power has been declining substantially in recent years and he's never been a big OBP guy. not a wise investment.