Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Mohawk is publicly traded???

O RLY

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]


4) The guy posting on Pocketfives about his account being compromised in July seems like a bit of a whack-job. However, it is indeed possible that his account was hacked from "the inside", and that GRAYCAT and DOUBLEDRAG were also compromised accounts. Also note that GRAYCAT and DOUBLEDRAG were the first cheating accounts on the scene, while STEAMROLLER and DOUBLEDRAG only started cheating after they got more blatant. Oh... just remembered this: Two different people have reported to me that STEAMROLLER had flashed between $200k and $500k on the table in the past, bragging that he had "wired it in". There was no record of STEAMROLLER winning at that point, so that gives even more reason to believe that it's a staff account.


[/ QUOTE ]

Take a look at my second to last post in this thread about this. The same thing happened to my roomate Phwap who used to play high stakes NL on the site.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Is there a chance these cheaters could be prosecuted in multiple jurisdictions? They cheated players from the United States and several other countries. Could those countries issue arrest warrants for each of those involved?

Could this be construed as wire fraud in the United States? What about money laundering, income tax evasion, etc? It sounds as if most of those involved are citizens of the United States. They seem to be 'jetsetters' and travel all over the world. Should they be watching out for each countries feds at each airport?

I did not see this covered so I am sorry if it was covered and missed it. I think Adanthar and several other posters are attorneys. Thanks in advance for any information you can add.

Thank you,

Jim Kuhn

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
KBZ,

I 100% agree with you. Without any regulation, even the "established" places carry lots of risks. However, sticking w/ the biggest sites is likely to at least reduce the risk somewhat.

[/ QUOTE ]

100% agree with this.

I have actually said this for years, which is why I laughed at young punks who would flash 200k bankrolls at smaller sites.

All sites have some degree of risk, but the "Big Two" (Full Tilt and Pokerstars) have too much to lose if a major scandal unfolds. Therefore, it is in their best interest to always run an honest shop.

The smaller sites -- even medium-sized ones like AP and UB -- always pose a greater risk for trouble. This includes both sides of the security coin -- cheating by the staff (as in this situation) and being a victim of bogus cheating accusations (i.e. getting your funds frozen/confiscated for no reason). The latter is actually a much greater danger than the former, but now we see that both can happen.

It is true that smaller sites often have better games than Tilt and Stars, but you're giving up some security and peace of mind. Like everything else in life, it's a risk-reward situation. I do play on small sites, but honestly, nothing that happens at these places surprises me. I try to keep my roll functional but relatively small in those places.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

these guys are crooked. the scott and phil toms of the world need to be taken down. someone needs to get the FBI involved in this mess.

has anyone contacted the costa rican version of the FBI yet?

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
these guys are crooked. the scott and phil toms of the world need to be taken down. someone needs to get the FBI involved in this mess.

has anyone contacted the costa rican version of the FBI yet?

[/ QUOTE ]

lol I give up

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
Mohawk is publicly traded???

O RLY

[/ QUOTE ]

wtf, the tribe is publicly traded? Must be a "business enterprise" corporate entity owned by...the tribe...tribal members...?.... Chief ...

Edit
gg

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
Mohawk is publicly traded???

O RLY

[/ QUOTE ]

yep, NYSE. I tried to tell you all this, but it got lost in the myriad of posts. That's probably also a partial reason Stars is keeping mum. They know where their bread is buttered.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

As far as I'm concerned, no matter what happens jumping forward, the cover up after the fact and the failed attempt to keep the victimized players stolen funds is enough for me to finally realize AP's time in online poker is OVER.

I think it's time we realize that it really doesn't matter what happens from here on out. The cover up is so grievous in itself. Online poker has never witnessed theft and lying on this magnitude from a once respected poker room. AP is now the new Dutch Boyd.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

ticker symbol?

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal *DELETED*
 

Post deleted by Mat Sklansky

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

DanDruff, excellent work in this entire debacle.

A little OT and I'm sure you're aware of this, but you looked like a pretty big tool on the WSOP telecast a year or two ago. Bad editing by ESPN or what? They couldn't have tried much harder to make you look like a douche.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
has anyone contacted the costa rican version of the FBI yet?

[/ QUOTE ]LOL, at Costa Rican version of the FBI, in spite of American beliefs, the FBI is not the worlds police force... Methinks that the equivalent policing authority in Costa Rica is probably on the "take"...

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Here's another one:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/83/24...0e5a7892ae.jpg

It came from here

[/ QUOTE ]

What kind of a last name is Tom?

[/ QUOTE ]

alll those flickr pics call him "Fred"

[/ QUOTE ]

His name is Fred Roman as can be seen on his nametag.
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/1...edromanez7.jpg

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
DanDruff, excellent work in this entire debacle.

A little OT and I'm sure you're aware of this, but you looked like a pretty big tool on the WSOP telecast a year or two ago. Bad editing by ESPN or what? They couldn't have tried much harder to make you look like a douche.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol

More pics of wife obv

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
has anyone contacted the costa rican version of the FBI yet?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, they said the bloafing factor was ignorable. ???

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
ticker symbol?

[/ QUOTE ]

http://finance.google.com/finance?q=NYSE:MHK

Down 0.58 in the last week, must be the one gobbomom was talking about.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohawk_Industries

[ QUOTE ]
Mohawk Industries is an American company that supplies residential and commercial flooring and other home products. It is one of the two largest carpet manufacturers in the world. It is exchanged on the New York Stock Exchange under the listed security MHK.

The company was founded by four brothers from the Shuttleworth family in 1878. By 1908, the company was flooded with orders for its extremely popular carpet, Karnak.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL. Excellent sleuthing.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
ticker symbol?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know, it's listed under Mohawk. Also, Adanthar, in the info. I was researching on them, it says that they were started on/ by the influence and of a very important New York politician. no name. (Why would a NY politician help set up a Canadian industry?) I'm sorry to say it again, but this goes deep.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
Is there a chance these cheaters could be prosecuted in multiple jurisdictions? They cheated players from the United States and several other countries. Could those countries issue arrest warrants for each of those involved?

Could this be construed as wire fraud in the United States? What about money laundering, income tax evasion, etc? It sounds as if most of those involved are citizens of the United States. They seem to be 'jetsetters' and travel all over the world. Should they be watching out for each countries feds at each airport?

I did not see this covered so I am sorry if it was covered and missed it. I think Adanthar and several other posters are attorneys. Thanks in advance for any information you can add.

Thank you,

Jim Kuhn

[/ QUOTE ]

I just read in my law book, and a country has jurisdiction over every criminal offense committed within their land borders. However, a country ALSO has jurisdiction if a criminal offense is commited, and reaches till within the county's border. Yahoo, american based company, has broken french law in the past, and was prosecuted for that.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'm sorry to say it again, but this goes deep.

[/ QUOTE ]

As deep as the floor?

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ticker symbol?

[/ QUOTE ]

http://finance.google.com/finance?q=NYSE:MHK

Down 0.58 in the last week, must be the one gobbomom was talking about.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohawk_Industries

[ QUOTE ]
Mohawk Industries is an American company that supplies residential and commercial flooring and other home products. It is one of the two largest carpet manufacturers in the world. It is exchanged on the New York Stock Exchange under the listed security MHK.

The company was founded by four brothers from the Shuttleworth family in 1878. By 1908, the company was flooded with orders for its extremely popular carpet, Karnak.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL. Excellent sleuthing.

[/ QUOTE ]


seriously??? well, sh** I never even considered the carpet industry!!!!!

Well, anyway, what I said about the MIT/ NY politician connection is still legit.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Good Job Teddy.

Geez, do all this guys have revolving names. Worse than Lee Jones/Poker Stars proposed revolving screen names.

gg

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
DanDruff, excellent work in this entire debacle.

A little OT and I'm sure you're aware of this, but you looked like a pretty big tool on the WSOP telecast a year or two ago. Bad editing by ESPN or what? They couldn't have tried much harder to make you look like a douche.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't want to get into this 2+-year-old discussion again, and I especially don't want it polluting this thread.

But here is the short answer: Yes, I did/said some things I regret during that telecast. I actually wish they instead broadcasted the event I won a month later, where I was subdued and very polite/courteous to everyone. However, I was also made to look much worse by ESPN editing and Norman Chad's constant nasty commentary. The most offensive thing, however, was the fact that they chopped up my exit interview to intentionally change the context of what I was saying. For that reason, if I ever make another ESPN final table, I won't do any interviews with them. I came one river ace away in the 2007 1k Rebuy event from being able to go through with that plan.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]


- There have also been references to Scott Tom now living and/or operating/pulling strings out of Panama. Oscar may be there too, evidenced by this page which appears to be a list of individuals granted residency status by the government of Panama, and has a listing for two Americans named "Oscar Hilt Tatum IV" and "Oscar Hilt Tatum III" for April 9th, 2007. (Note that their records don't have any listing for Scott Tom, at least not since Sept 2005 when the database begins.)

[/ QUOTE ]


Seems like a conspiracy

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm sorry to say it again, but this goes deep.

[/ QUOTE ]

As deep as the floor?

[/ QUOTE ]

As deep as shag carpet?

gg

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ticker symbol?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know, it's listed under Mohawk. Also, Adanthar, in the info. I was researching on them, it says that they were started on/ by the influence and of a very important New York politician. no name. (Why would a NY politician help set up a Canadian industry?) I'm sorry to say it again, but this goes deep.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is wrong....there is a Mohawk that sells carpets but that is not the same company.

In 2006 the Kahnawake's were considering an IPO on the London Stock Exchange. As far as I can tell, after the UIGEA, that never happened.

The Kahnawake regulations were set up by Frank Catania, a former gaming regulator in New Jersey.

IPO 2006
Meanwhile, the The Mohawks of Kahnawake are considering participating in a London share offering that would raise money for an international network of computer centres to serve the online gambling industry and other e-businesses.

The Kahnawake economic development commission expects to finalize an agreement as early as this week to take a 40-per-cent stake in an Isle of Man company looking to issue shares on the London Stock Exchange's junior AIM market, said John (Bud) Morris, chief executive officer of the development commission.

The commission owns Mohawk Internet Technologies, whose computer servers have made Kahnawake one of the world's most popular jurisdictions for hosting online gambling sites. MIT, home to scores of casino, poker and bingo sites, is negotiating a contract that would see the Isle of Man company - Continent 8 Technologies PLC - offer its servers to international customers as part of a larger "grid" of data centres.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
DanDruff, excellent work in this entire debacle.

A little OT and I'm sure you're aware of this, but you looked like a pretty big tool on the WSOP telecast a year or two ago. Bad editing by ESPN or what? They couldn't have tried much harder to make you look like a douche.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't want to get into this 2+-year-old discussion again, and I especially don't want it polluting this thread.

But here is the short answer: Yes, I did/said some things I regret during that telecast. I actually wish they instead broadcasted the event I won a month later, where I was subdued and very polite/courteous to everyone. However, I was also made to look much worse by ESPN editing and Norman Chad's constant nasty commentary. The most offensive thing, however, was the fact that they chopped up my exit interview to intentionally change the context of what I was saying. For that reason, if I ever make another ESPN final table, I won't do any interviews with them. I came one river ace away in the 2007 1k Rebuy event from being able to go through with that plan.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah I didn't mean to get into that, but it's something that I was curious about since you seem very smart and likeable in this thread and others but ESPN portrayed you as some egotistical online poker douche in that telecast.

Bottom line, f the media. Amirite?

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

From the ABCnews article:

[ QUOTE ]
"It looks like the Potripper account is registered to AJ Ripper and Scott Tom's e-mail turned up. But I can't say for sure that someone else wasn't using his account, or it wasn't someone else sitting at his computer," Johnson said.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's an error isn't it?

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/Sto...500&page=1

I know we have come up with a few alias last names for AJ, that wasn't one of them was it or did I miss it?

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

gm,

This scandal is really going to floor people.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Yeah, the guy was clearly rushing the article out and made a couple of factual errors. Nothing big, though.

incidentally, I'm kinda impressed that he couldn't find my cell number but called my mom at work. gg reporter sleuthing.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
these need more love imo

[/ QUOTE ]
people need to not quote large posts with multiple images in them and then add no content

imo

Re: My $.02 about online poker and cheating
 

[ QUOTE ]
I've been banned before.

[/ QUOTE ]
obviously not for long enough

Re: My $.02 about online poker and cheating
 

Man I wish AP would issue their next lie....err Statement.

Im getting bored

Re: My $.02 about online poker and cheating
 

Latest report:

Scott Tom will be releasing a book in 2008 called "IF I DID IT".

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/1...edromanez7.jpg

The guy in all these pictures is - Fred Roman, Affiliate Relations Manager for Absolute Poker

Re: My $.02 about online poker and cheating
 

The general public will realize very soon that AP is full of it, once they tell the media a different story again.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just got this email:

"John Ethans - a Customer service manager"

[/ QUOTE ]

Ha! This guy blatantly lied to me over two years ago regarding a withdrawal of mine, then refused to put me in contact with his supervisor after I showed screenshots that proved he was a liar. He said, "My supervisor already knows about you." I was like uhhhh okay, and never played there again.

By the way, I was the guy who got the original email in cliff note bullet #15 where AP first acknowledged the allegations against Scott Tom. My intent by contacting them was just to get my account permanently closed, and I had sent numerous emails both before and after receiving that statement. My account was JUST closed today, after they tried to assure me over and over again that they are investigating the claims.

They really think we are going to forget how they ALREADY acted in the past.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

Hollywood needs to make this into a movie some day. If it goes as deep as some have speculated, they probably will.

carry on

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

[ QUOTE ]
http://tinyurl.com/36sdcj
Scott Tom and Oscar's new wife (above) were also on that plane with him.

[/ QUOTE ]
Solid detective work teddy.

"However, the transient Gilda Patricia Cortés Chinchilla, five months pregnant, was transferred to the Hospital for evaluation Cima San Jose."

That appears in the google translated version. From what I'm told, that is the name that the IP address was registered to with Amnet. According to the same source, it is Scott Tom's wife.

The other three passengers were Scott Tom, Oscar and Oscar's wife.

Re: We haven\'t won yet: latest (10/19) cliff\'s notes on AP scandal
 

All,

I bet the AP guys are all chilling in their pools at their mansions w/ hot chicks just prepared to release statement after statement revealing "new information" and "steps to provide security for players."

I fully expect one of the upcoming statements to thank guys like Nat and Ad for helping bring this to light and helping them continue to provide the most secure and trusted place for poker players to play online. Probably a deposit bonus or freeroll too.