Re: DERB
 

This sounds like a viable strategy. I'm surprised it took this thread this long to come up with this (also referrring to the post a bit above this where someone else also identifies this strategy).

It now seems most likely, as others have stated, that he gives up small ev, mostly pre-flop and with some call downs like the one in the hand earlier, and this causes his opponents to make lots of mistakes. Hence, he's probably running somewhere in the 1.5-2.5 range and is running good.

Edit: I'd like to add that i often play preflop like this against tight and/or predictable tags because the extra bets often do make them play incorrectly, and you really arent giving up much.

Re: AFTER THIS POST, I\'M FINISHED WITH 2+2.
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


Has anyone ever seen this guy chat?

Maybe he's the worlds first superbot programmed by NASA to help fund their space program.

[/ QUOTE ]

DERB chatting

[/ QUOTE ]


Thanks for the link. But which one is DERB? Is it Lojzka? And if so... why is everyone calling him DERB?

Re: AFTER THIS POST, I\'M FINISHED WITH 2+2.
 

Don't Ever Run Bad (see post 1)

Re: AFTER THIS POST, I\'M FINISHED WITH 2+2.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Don't Ever Run Bad (see post 1)

[/ QUOTE ]

I know that but he provides a link that purportedely has DERB speaking, but then he starts talking about this Lojzka. I thought maybe DERB was a alias for this player because the OOP didn't want anyone but 30/60 regulars to know who he was speaking about. Also, if Lojzka is DERB then that isn't really speech. Maybe his program tells him to smile whenever the word "cheating" is used.

next time you're at his table just type "cheating" over and over and see how many times he smiles.

Re: AFTER THIS POST, I\'M FINISHED WITH 2+2.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe his program tells him to smile whenever the word "cheating" is used.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think if i spent tons of hours building a bot then i'd also be clever enough to not have the bot smile when someone says cheating.

An Observation
 

I don't play in high or even middle stakes and I haven't been able to read this whole thread because it is so volumnous. I wanted to point out though, that in all the discussions about this guy working with someone else, you all seem to be looking for a player who has comparable horrid stats. What if he's working with a TAG?
This is an awesome thread. Real meat and potatoes stuff.
X

Re: AFTER THIS POST, I\'M FINISHED WITH 2+2.
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Maybe his program tells him to smile whenever the word "cheating" is used.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think if i spent tons of hours building a bot then i'd also be clever enough to not have the bot smile when someone says cheating.

[/ QUOTE ]


Ah, but what about the programmar thinking about what would need to be done if someone accused it of being a cheating bot? He would probably program the bot to use the smile emoticon whenever the word "bot" or "cheating" was used and then have it promptly leave the table thus not causing suspicion about it's non human charachteristics.

Re: AFTER THIS POST, I\'M FINISHED WITH 2+2.
 

Has anyone actually emailed party poker to have them look into this? I know their customer service is terrible, and the people you deal with don't understand much about poker, but at least if they keep their eye on this guy, if he's a bot he might be more likely to get caught.

Re: DERB
 

I told myself I was done with this thread a week ago, but I'm obviously not. I considered posting a new thread, but didn't want to annoy people - I'm sure people are sick of looking at this mangled mess.

Some things I find interesting. DERB is getting beat badly by the better players. That means he's torching the weaker players, just like Paluka said. He must be eating alive the weakest and tightest. I don't think he'd do that well against the bad 25 VIP type players who call too much.

I don't get to play with this guy much anymore because my sleep schedule has changed and there are so many more 30 games. I certainly don't this players win rate will continue in the full games and imagine that he will continue somewhere around break even. I'm waiting for my next database update to check. I'll probably start a new thread entitled DERB update as long as people aren't death sick of this topic.

Certainly my eyes have been opened somewhat to the idea of lagging it up at the higher limits. Floater and DERBS might be able to thrive up here and certainly adds some dimension to limit holdem.

It harkons back to a famous Phil Ivey quote about the difference between 30-60, 400-800, and 4k-8k (paraphrasing) where he suggests you don't know what you don't know until you've put serious time in at these limits.

After talking to some successful 300-600 players, I realized they had some blind ideas that I hadn't considered heavily and players were making plays, I thought no one was making. I guess this sort've outside of the box thinking goes up to the highest limits.

And lasty, specifically related to this thread, this DERB sucks and 30 17 cannot be sustained for any reasonable winrate, IMO [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Re: DERB
 

"
I told myself I was done with this thread a week ago, but I'm obviously not. I considered posting a new thread, but didn't want to annoy people - I'm sure people are sick of looking at this mangled mess."

yes

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]

After talking to some successful 300-600 players, I realized they had some blind ideas that I hadn't considered heavily and players were making plays, I thought no one was making. I guess this sort've outside of the box thinking goes up to the highest limits.


[/ QUOTE ]

Care to share?

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
"
I told myself I was done with this thread a week ago, but I'm obviously not. I considered posting a new thread, but didn't want to annoy people - I'm sure people are sick of looking at this mangled mess."

yes

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't open the thread anymore.

Re: DERB
 

So, uh, what happened to this guy?

Re: DERB
 

ssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
So, uh, what happened to this guy?

[/ QUOTE ]

i'm curious as well. is this guy still winning?

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So, uh, what happened to this guy?

[/ QUOTE ]

i'm curious as well. is this guy still winning?

[/ QUOTE ]

said victim pumped the pot in on the of the largest I've ever seen in the 30 that I happened to lose. Don't see them very often though.

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
Don't ever run bad. Party 30/60 player:

{{Hands 73,824 - VIP 30 - R 17 - NF 21 - ag 2.0
Total winnings: $114,281

Routinely 3 bets small pocket pairs from bb, caps certainly dominated hands.

Fishy?

[/ QUOTE ]

Doesn't this include mostly shorthanded play?

Re: DERB
 

</font><blockquote><font class="small">En réponse à:</font><hr />
</font><blockquote><font class="small">En réponse à:</font><hr />
Don't ever run bad. Party 30/60 player:

{{Hands 73,824 - VIP 30 - R 17 - NF 21 - ag 2.0
Total winnings: $114,281

Routinely 3 bets small pocket pairs from bb, caps certainly dominated hands.

Fishy?

[/ QUOTE ]

Doesn't this include mostly shorthanded play?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, he has only recently become a SH player. These stats are from back in the day.

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]


No, he has only recently become a SH player. These stats are from back in the day.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is he stilling using the same screen name? I play his buddy all the time and confuse them...

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Don't ever run bad. Party 30/60 player:

{{Hands 73,824 - VIP 30 - R 17 - NF 21 - ag 2.0
Total winnings: $114,281

Routinely 3 bets small pocket pairs from bb, caps certainly dominated hands.

Fishy?

[/ QUOTE ]

Doesn't this include mostly shorthanded play?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, he has only recently become a SH player. These stats are from back in the day.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ryan's got his finger on the pulse of the IGC.

Re: DERB
 

damnit! what is the friggin screenname? someone just say it, god this is so dumb.

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
damnit! what is the friggin screenname? someone just say it, god this is so dumb.

[/ QUOTE ]

Lojzka:

Summary for $30/60 Limit
Hands Played 31128
VP$IP 29.47%
BB/100 1.01
Preflop Raise 18.02%
PreflopAggression 1.57
PostflopAggression 2.78
Folded SB to Steal 70.26%
Folded BB to Steal 33.98%
Attempted to Steal 45.4%

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
damnit! what is the friggin screenname? someone just say it, god this is so dumb.

[/ QUOTE ]

Lojzka:

Summary for $30/60 Limit
Hands Played 31128
VP$IP 29.47%
BB/100 1.01
Preflop Raise 18.02%
PreflopAggression 1.57
PostflopAggression 2.78
Folded SB to Steal 70.26%
Folded BB to Steal 33.98%
Attempted to Steal 45.4%

[/ QUOTE ]


Screename changed. Now it's Brizganc.

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]

Screename changed. Now it's Brizganc.

[/ QUOTE ]

One of the many clowns that manages to hit 2 or 3 outers on me every hand I'm in with him. That, or go runner runner while raising the whole way.

In fact, ever since exactly the day the tables got restricted to 25, all I am doing is winning money off of the solid players (fortunately) and losing it to the clowns as fast as I make it. That seems backwards of the way it should be. My "loss to" column in PT reads like a who's who of Slovenia.

I don't want to be Dan Druffesque, but I'm just saying... [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Nigel

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
My "loss to" column in PT reads like a who's who of Slovenia.

[/ QUOTE ]

[img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: DERB
 

I'm down 2500 to him in 50/100 in the last week. I want to jump.

Re: DERB
 

My "loss to" column in PT reads like a who's who of Slovenia.

Bring it bad boy

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
My "loss to" column in PT reads like a who's who of Slovenia.

Bring it bad boy

[/ QUOTE ]

C'mon now, you're not one of them, are you? I mean, your VPIP is under 40, isn't it? [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
My "loss to" column in PT reads like a who's who of Slovenia.

Bring it bad boy

[/ QUOTE ]

C'mon now, you're not one of them, are you? I mean, your VPIP is under 40, isn't it? [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm Scotch-Irish with rock like principles preflop(until I 3 bet you with 89s), and tazmanian devil post flop play.

I'm not really sure were the nickname came from.

Re: DERB
 

WOW Conspiracy theorist?

Re: DERB
 

Oh god no. It's back.

As long as this thread is up, does anybody have a decent sample of this guys hands SINCE this thread started?

Interesting personal update... I have argued by stats that this guy is probably just lucky many times. Since then, I've had the pleasure of sitting with in a shorthanded 30/60 game with DERB and watching him play. I found him to be very reasonable, and while aggressive, a solid player. One thing I noticed him do often was folding the river for 1 bet in spots where I think most people would have paid off. If he's doing this based on player specific information, then I think DERB could in fact be a winner (though certainly still running well at the time this thread originated).

I know others have crazy hands for him, but I haven't seen anything personally to suggest he must be losing and is 4 standard devs away from his true win rate. 1 - 2 BB / 100 feels about right. He does get involved with the weak players a lot, and his aggressiveness pays off against the right opponents.


my 2 cents.
Eric

Re: DERB
 

Now that I know who you guys are talking about...

I don't think he's lucky or cheating. I thought he was a fish at first, but after enough hands with him I'd guess he's a very talented hand reader who gets away with loose pre-flop play because he's much better than average at post-flop. Plus, he plays the metagame well and adjusts his play to individuals. As Eric pointed out, he makes the maximum from weak players.

I'm betting he's one of those "naturals" and has probably written some custom PT-type statistical tools to help himself adjust to specific players.

I know he made considerable adjustments when playing against my girlfriend (who kills the party 30-60). She was thrashing him in the beginning but he changed his play against her just like you're supposed to. We thought he was just getting lucky until we went over the hands carefully. She'll get up from the table when he sits down now, and she's by far and away the best postflop player I know.

I call him the Borg.

On the other hand, maybe he's just a lucky fish.

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
Now that I know who you guys are talking about...

I don't think he's lucky or cheating. I thought he was a fish at first, but after enough hands with him I'd guess he's a very talented hand reader who gets away with loose pre-flop play because he's much better than average at post-flop. Plus, he plays the metagame well and adjusts his play to individuals. As Eric pointed out, he makes the maximum from weak players.

I'm betting he's one of those "naturals" and has probably written some custom PT-type statistical tools to help himself adjust to specific players.

I know he made considerable adjustments when playing against my girlfriend (who kills the party 30-60). She was thrashing him in the beginning but he changed his play against her just like you're supposed to. We thought he was just getting lucky until we went over the hands carefully. She'll get up from the table when he sits down now, and she's by far and away the best postflop player I know.

I call him the Borg.

On the other hand, maybe he's just a lucky fish.

[/ QUOTE ]

I haven't found that he hand reads even remotely well. He usually horribly overplays his hand and then hits his miracle. But that's just against me, so I can't speak for other's experience with him.

Re: DERB
 

In fact, this basically describes my experience with all the guys who have PFR%'s higher than my VPIP.

I really don't understand how they don't go broke, but there they are night after night, 4-8 tabling the full games.

I wish someone would explain it to me, because I feel like I may be playing poker backwards if these guys can win.

Nigel

Re: DERB
 

The bad players do go broke. I assure you.

Re: DERB
 

Since the new one got locked...

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
The bad players do go broke. I assure you.

[/ QUOTE ]
ive said it before... derb is not a bad player... he is quite good... he wins alot, and i think he will continue to win.
he has one huge hole which is paying off the river with hands that could not possibly be good... like no way. it kinda funny.

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
Since the new one got locked...

[/ QUOTE ]

And why did it get locked? Dcifir- is fun bad?

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
Since the new one got locked...

[/ QUOTE ]

Why do you think the new one got locked?

what does this add to the forum?

if you have a problem and a good argument for why THIS one should be opened, PM me.

Barron

Re: DERB
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Since the new one got locked...

[/ QUOTE ]

And why did it get locked? Dcifir- is fun bad?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is news and gossip. not strategy.

Barron