The big Fossilman hand of yesterday

Easy E · #1 07-15-2005, 09:41 AM

Mike Matusow made a comment to Card Player about the hand that crippled Greg yesterday- I was wondering if it was as out-of-line a play as Mike made it out to be.

"some IDIOT loses his mind and tries his hardest to go broke and..I think that bothers me more than anything" AND "How bout throwin your hand away when you flop no pair and no draw, ever heard of doin that?"

I'm assuming Mike is referring to this hand:
" Ayhan Alsancak has the button in seat 5, Raymer raises, and Kanter calls. The flop comes 6c-5d-3h, and there's a bet and a call. The turn card is the 7h, Kanter bets $600,000, and the two players are quickly all in. Raymer shows pocket kings (Kd-Kh), and Kanter has Qh-Jh. Kanter has a flush draw, and needs to catch a heart to win the pot. The river card is the 2h, and Kanter makes his flush to double up through Greg Raymer."

Does anyone have more details on the preflop and flop betting, along with the turn back-and-forth? Because it's possible Greg was trying to steal on the flop. Could Kanter realistically represent the straight(s) here?
Any chance Fossilman is making a move on the turn, or reads Kanter as doing so (rather than a semi-bluff)?

canis582 · #2 07-15-2005, 09:46 AM

This just shows how hard it is to get to the last 27 of 5,800 without taking a major suckout. Think of all the times you got sucked out on playing a 5+.50 torney with 400 people.

Online247 · #3 07-15-2005, 09:47 AM

.

capone0 · #4 07-15-2005, 09:49 AM

No, Kanter, semibluffed big on the turn with a flush draw + 2 overs and sucked out after getting reraised by Raymer.

Jordan Olsommer · #5 07-15-2005, 09:51 AM

[ QUOTE ]
The flop comes 6c-5d-3h, and there's a bet and a call. The turn card is the 7h, Kanter bets $600,000, and the two players are quickly all in.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sigh - this is why I don't think I'll ever understand the pros' plays. If I went all-in with KK and one opponent on a board like this in a $5 SNG, I would invariably be shown a 4, and I wouldn't think to blame bad luck as much as my own stupidity for pushing all-in with one flippin' pair when there was a one-card straight on board.

I just don't get it.

BlackAces · #6 07-15-2005, 09:51 AM

According to Greg in his exit interview, Kanter called a $150K raise, then called a half-pot bet on the flop. On the turn, Greg bet again, Kanter raised, and Greg set him all-in. Kanter had no choice but to call on the turn, because he WAS pot-committed, but the call on the flop was a little weak.

ohkanada · #7 07-15-2005, 09:52 AM

Well Greg discussed the hand on cardplayer.

Blinds 20-40 with an ante of 5k, Greg made it 100k before the flop which is his standard raise.

On that flop Greg bets 150k and his opponent with 2 overs and a backdoor flush calls.

On the turn, Greg bets 300k, the opponent makes it 800k and Greg pushes and his opponent calls. His opponent started with 1.8 million so he put 1.5 million or so as a 4:1 underdog.

Ken

Felix_Nietzsche · #8 07-15-2005, 09:58 AM

....with a backdoor flush......then later the Party Poker Donkey Takes Out Phil Ivey. This Kantor guy has seven gold horseshoes up his @ss.

Regardless, I'm VERY impressed with Raymer to do so well. He is the real deal. I am disappointed that it took some fool chasing a runner-runner to take him out. No justice in poker. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

capone0 · #9 07-15-2005, 09:59 AM

Thing is, hands like this happen all the time, big tourney or not. I've been backdoor drawed, runner runnered, perfect, perfected, etc. so many times when I didn't win a tourney. But when I win tourneys, I "avoid" these beats. Getting sucked out on big time for a lot of chips is a fact of life. The reason Greg won last year is he avoided beats like this, not because he's that much better than any of us, but because he was lucky to avoid them. This year he was unlucky to avoid it. Honestly 4 to 1 underdog isn't that bad. Not great either.

capone0 · #10 07-15-2005, 10:01 AM

You people act like Raymer is the only person in the world that get's runner runnered. I feel bad for him losing to this, but hands like this happen every minute of the day. They happen at the WSOP, they happen at the 25/50 NL tables online they happen at the .01/.02, they happen. If Greg lost to perfect, perfect, I would feel a lot worse. Runner, Runner is a pretty common loss to a flush.