ZeeJustin the next to get caught multi accounting Party MTTs

[meleader2]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Anyone know who Curtains is???

[/ QUOTE ]

He's a poster on STT forums. Bunch of multi-accounters over there. I have been working hard all morning at reporting them.

[/ QUOTE ]


you're a goddam retard. i have several hundred HH's before the new party release on Curtains while observing, to review to help my own game/inputing info into SNGPT and to PM him for reasons for his play in particular instances. in NONE of them have i noticed anyhting odd or strange.

you need to come off your goddam pedestal.

[betadecay]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Cmon guys.
It's nice and all that multi accounters are being punished, but there is nothing worse than being a snitch.

I have alot more respect for someone who uses multiple accounts to maximize EV, than for someone who taddles.

[/ QUOTE ]

this attitude both disgusts and disheartens me ... such a misguided sense of honor and morality.

i hope you at least realize that terms like "rat" and "snitch" were created by the criminals themselves in order to manipulate others to keep quiet about their wrongdoing.

it's your life and you can choose to keep quiet while others do wrong if you wish. but don't you dare claim that do so is the honorable thing to do. by keeping quiet, you are, at best, a coward and, at worst, an accomplice.

[/ QUOTE ]

I just don't like how it seems to be going down. I don't have a problem with people emailing party saying it seems like there are lots of multi accounter's and party should work harder to find them. But these threads seem like a "look at me! look who i busted!" way of catching cheaters.
If you truly feel like these cheaters are directly hurting your profit, by all means, rat them out. But if the only reason you're doing this is to start threads showing how cool you are that you ratted someone, I have no respect for you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Although I understand some of the attitudes are a little overboard, I think it is very wrong to not drop a dime on a cheater. We are all part of the same community here. Anyone cheating is stealing from the rest of us as a whole. They are compromising the integrity of the game we ALL play.

[Ibanez8185]

Here is a good post by gidders on P5s that was pretty funny, I bet most people here would agree. http://www.pocketfives.com/A3722CF8-...36AA86C40.aspx

[DVaut1]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just to end all of the baseless curtains blaming:

On December 18, 2005 on a private forum curtains made the following post:
[ QUOTE ]

There is a common trend among people to use multiple accounts when they play in a multitable tournament. There are many reasons why this is a disgusting and unethical practice but they often use excuses like "oh ill sit out if it happens to me" or "Oh Ill make sure it won't affect my play" or blah blah. But ok what do you do if you have something like Kxh and your "alter ego" has the ace of hearts...now you know you have the nut flush draw, you cannot unknow this knowledge and it can theoretically affect gameplay in your favor. In any case the advantages are relatively small, assuming you don't plan to abuse things if you find yourself at the same table as yourself, however there are still advantages nonetheless.

I just want to make a blanket statement that if I know of anyone who does this on a regular basis, I will lose all respect for you. You are stealing my money everytime I enter the same tournament as you, and I will have nothing to do with you in any way whatsoever should I find out that this is a common tactic you use in online play.



PS - This thread was brought about by a player who randomly decided to tell me that he planned to use 3 accounts to play a big tourney tomorrow. I know this player isn't the only one to do this, and I wish it was frowned upon a lot more than it is.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYI the PS was not referring to ZJ either.

[/ QUOTE ]

If this is true, then let me be among the first to apologize to curtains for any insinuations I made. I did not say he cheated but only that it would have been wrong to not say anything if he did know. I commend his comments here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I never once thought curtains was a cheater. I think it's clear his heart is in the right place. I commend his efforts to try to be an ethical voice in a morass of relativism.

But I question why he kept his knowledge that this kind of cheating was happening within the confines of his friends. Can we agree this is something we all deserved to know?

Edit: I have alot of sympathy for curtains since there were others who clearly knew but said nothing. He just has the unfortunate luck of ZJ mentioning him in his OP.

[NanaAnna]

[ QUOTE ]
I am 100% certain that Curtains has NEVER in his entire life used two accounts to play on the same table.

Now that you can 10 table on party I don't know of a single legitimate player that uses multiple accounts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Does this mean you knew of players that did before 10 tabling was allowed?

[ QUOTE ]

This has probably been mentioned already here, but it should be said again. Long before ZJ got busted or this witch hunt started Curtains was extreemly vocal about how unethical he felt that using multiple accounts to enter a multi was.

[/ QUOTE ]

And when ZJ told Curtains he was using Multi accounts? Chirps, chirps. He had a chance to follow through with his convictions, but never spoke out and out a cheater.

Actions speak louder than words.....

[TxSteve]

But I question why he kept his knowledge that this kind of cheating was happening within the confines of his friends. Can we agree this is something we all deserved to know?

[/ QUOTE ]

[Bud Light]

[ QUOTE ]
Just to end all of the baseless curtains blaming:

On December 18, 2005 on a private forum curtains made the following post:

[ QUOTE ]


There is a common trend among people to use multiple accounts when they play in a multitable tournament. There are many reasons why this is a disgusting and unethical practice but they often use excuses like "oh ill sit out if it happens to me" or "Oh Ill make sure it won't affect my play" or blah blah. But ok what do you do if you have something like Kxh and your "alter ego" has the ace of hearts...now you know you have the nut flush draw, you cannot unknow this knowledge and it can theoretically affect gameplay in your favor. In any case the advantages are relatively small, assuming you don't plan to abuse things if you find yourself at the same table as yourself, however there are still advantages nonetheless.

I just want to make a blanket statement that if I know of anyone who does this on a regular basis, I will lose all respect for you. You are stealing my money everytime I enter the same tournament as you, and I will have nothing to do with you in any way whatsoever should I find out that this is a common tactic you use in online play.



PS - This thread was brought about by a player who randomly decided to tell me that he planned to use 3 accounts to play a big tourney tomorrow. I know this player isn't the only one to do this, and I wish it was frowned upon a lot more than it is.


[/ QUOTE ]


FYI the PS was not referring to ZJ either.

[/ QUOTE ]

The bolded part above is clearly not correct. Curtains has been actively defending ZJ in this thread.

You guys with a decent moreal compass need to lead the way on this. If you see people discuss cheating in your private forums then report them. I sure as hell can't do anything about it because I'm one of the "fish" who isn't in your club and who you have no problem cheating money out of.

Actually, I couldn't do anything before, but I can and will do something now.

[mbpoker]

[ QUOTE ]
Rakeback: benefits you, benefits affiliate, does not hurt other players.

[/ QUOTE ]

Right. But it hurts Party. That's why there is a rule against it. Do you think Party can move against players or affiliates who cheat them?

[CardSharpCook]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Anyone think Zee used to cheat at "Magic: The Gathering" also?

[/ QUOTE ]

ya. Cheating is a big part of any competitive game with money on the line. Most succesful people exploit their edges. That is why they are succesful. It's people that don't realize this that makes cheating profitable. Palming cards, overdrawing, switching cards after the tourney starts , misrepresenting info were all rampant in MTG tourneys. If you were one of the cheaters you didn't cheat other cheats and they didn't cheat you. Because you both knew what to look for. It's the clueless ones you cheat. And their is a lot of em everywhere.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am one of the clueless as I am going to come to bat for Justin as I did for Josh. I really don't believe that Justin is a "born cheater". I think he looked at the ethics of this question and came to some incorrect conclusions.

1. it is wrong to be able to change your name to avoid your rep in SNGs. No one else can (save once every 6mo)

2. It is wrong to have multiple entries in the same tourney.

However, this is not nearly as bad as other forms of cheating. Indeed, I can see how it is easy to rationalize this minor form of cheating. I completely believe Justin when he talks of his ways to prevent himself from knowing his hole cards when on the same table. This is an honorable young man who just didn't look at the complete equation. Speaking of him as an incorrigible cheater is reprehensible. That is not the Justin that we all know. He is a good guy, he just doesn't realize that this is cheating.

[betadecay]

[ QUOTE ]

And when ZJ told Curtains he was using Multi accounts? Chirps, chirps. He had a chance to follow through with his convictions, but never spoke out and out a cheater.

Actions speak louder than words.....

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]

FYI the PS was not referring to ZJ either.

[/ QUOTE ]

guess he has another oppurtunity.