My Side of the Story

[JoshNjuice]

First, I should note that Vanessa is a friend of mine. I've been following her progress for the past several months and her results speak for themselves. I have a lot of respect for her and her play. I was very surprised to see accusations that she has etiquette issues. I don't know MsGluck, so I did a little hunting around (searching 2+2 for her posts and using Google) to see what she's all about.

As of this writing, MsGluck has 34 posts on 2+2. I was curious, so I went through and read them all (it didn't take long). I noticed a few patterns: most of her posts are about herself; she hasn't made a single strategy post; many of the posts about herself were promotional ("You can see me on TV here" or "I usually play here" or "Thanks for all the compliments! You guys are the best!"); she broke her usual posting pattern to bash an up-and-coming pro for having bad poker etiquette in a "hot or not" thread that had nothing to do with etiquette.

I also did some hunting around to see what else I could find about this alleged etiquette issue that Vanessa has. The first thing that jumped out at me was that Vanessa has had a lot of recent success, and yet I hadn't ever heard anything about her etiquette issues that MsGluck has mentioned. Vanessa's results for the past year can be seen here: Hendon Mob database

All those cashes for pretty significant amounts of money and not a single peep anywhere about her terrible poker etiquette? That seems odd to me. I also noticed that MsGluck and Vanessa both played at the Bodog tournament in Costa Rica, where MsGluck says "I don't remember seeing her at all." This is only my interpretation, but it seems to me like she's implying, "Vanessa's a nobody. Don't even pay attention to her!" Seems like Vanessa would be easy to spot since she apparently spends most of her time breaking the rules of poker etiquette and generally ticking people off.

I'm not genius, but it looks to me like MsGluck has detected potential competition and is trying to snuff it out. Thanks to the poker boom, there's a lot more to poker than grinding it out in cash games or tournaments. There are endorsements, TV shows and a lot of other sources of revenue. But there are only so many opportunities to go around, and this is a dog eat dog world. Basically, MsGluck's post seems unsubstantiated and unprovoked, except to preemptively defame Vanessa's character in a public forum.

While I was hunting around, I stumbled upon MsGluck's MySpace (here: MySpace profile ). I was surprised to see that one of her Friends is... Liz Lieu! So, her post could basically read, "My good friend Liz, another professional female poker player who could be threatened by Vanessa, says that Vanessa has bad etiquette! Also, I heard she was a jerk when she had a higher flush than some other guy. OH! And someone told me that someone at a table said that Vanessa said she's not even afraid of Doyle!" That seems like an awful lot of he-said-she-said.

Again, I haven't seen any of this information anywhere except in MsGluck's post and Liz' blog entry that was copied and pasted onto 2+2. I think I've made my point.

Why don't we let Vanessa's actual play, results and the poker public's opinion dictate Vanessa's public image? This unprovoked and petty nonsense really has no place in a public forum. If someone (or some people) has a problem with something Vanessa does or says at the table, then that someone should talk to her about it privately.

I'm not trying to attack anyone personally, I'm just trying to speak up on behalf of a friend. Vanessa is a class act and I see no reason for this kind of nonsense.

Best regards to everyone

JoshNjuice

[Peter666]

MsGluck is also hot and can do all the self promoting she wishes. In fact, I call for a mud wrestling match between the two girls to settle this issue.

[burningyen]

[ QUOTE ]
In fact, I call for a mud wrestling match between the two girls to settle this issue.

[/ QUOTE ]
Finally, the voice of reason.

[wpr101]

[ QUOTE ]
MsGluck is also hot and can do all the self promoting she wishes.

[/ QUOTE ]

She seems like a biotch from this post. Her myspace is all like poker promotion. All of her friends are successful poker players? Does she sleep around or something? Does she have any non-poker friends.

I agree it is BS to have 32 posts none related to strategy. Atleast contribute to the forum if you are going to be here; especially if you are a "pro" like she claims to be. Raymer sets the example here.

[wpr101]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for post Vanessa, I think that clears up a lot of the accussations against you.

Btw, do you have any response to James Van Alstyne's remarks on the circuit about not shaking his hand after you were eliminated? After he received all the 'stories' about your slow roll play, he called your reaction 'poker justice'.

As well, I suggest you call the cardplayer circuit show out because they basically bad mouthed you at the 'final table preview show' and tried to ruin your reputation to potentially thousands of poker players worldwide. Just an idea to set the record straight there as well.



[/ QUOTE ]

According to Vanessa, WE are all wrong about her... Me, Liz Lieu, James Van Alstyne, The Circuit. It's funny to see how a law student would cover something like this up. Well done! I never insulted you looks or your intelligence, I merely exposed your bad poker play. Which it seems you still can't own up to. This will be my last post about this nonsense. Good Luck everyone!

[/ QUOTE ]

You merely exposed her bad poker play? Honestly who the hell do you think you are? I play 12 tables at a time and everyday someone tells me to go f myself or slowrolls quads. It's part of the game. Watch some Matasow re-runs; that's out of line. But did you ever see Raymer complain? NO.

[thedarknight]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for post Vanessa, I think that clears up a lot of the accussations against you.

Btw, do you have any response to James Van Alstyne's remarks on the circuit about not shaking his hand after you were eliminated? After he received all the 'stories' about your slow roll play, he called your reaction 'poker justice'.

As well, I suggest you call the cardplayer circuit show out because they basically bad mouthed you at the 'final table preview show' and tried to ruin your reputation to potentially thousands of poker players worldwide. Just an idea to set the record straight there as well.



[/ QUOTE ]

According to Vanessa, WE are all wrong about her... Me, Liz Lieu, James Van Alstyne, The Circuit. It's funny to see how a law student would cover something like this up. Well done! I never insulted you looks or your intelligence, I merely exposed your bad poker play. Which it seems you still can't own up to. This will be my last post about this nonsense. Good Luck everyone!

[/ QUOTE ]

You merely exposed her bad poker play? Honestly who the hell do you think you are? I play 12 tables at a time and everyday someone tells me to go f myself or slowrolls quads. It's part of the game. Watch some Matasow re-runs; that's out of line. But did you ever see Raymer complain? NO.

[/ QUOTE ]

dude you need to calm down. she's not promoting anything on her myspace page..if she was, she would be adding random ppl she doesn't even know but she doesn't even do that. calm the eff down...she just spoke her mind and is backing a good friend? what's wrong with that? you guys are turning jean into the bad person here just because one of vanessa's friends can easily sway you? i didn't realize how easily influenced you posters can be.

you don't even know how possibly bad vanessa's behavior could've been. I'm not saying it was, but you weren't even F*cking there.. calm down. there is no more point to this argument...it's just a she said/she also said deal. we won't know..we'll never know...end of story.

[wheatrich]

[ QUOTE ]
I was curious, so I went through and read them all (it didn't take long). I noticed a few patterns: most of her posts are about herself; she hasn't made a single strategy post; many of the posts about herself were promotional ("You can see me on TV here" or "I usually play here" or "Thanks for all the compliments! You guys are the best!"); she broke her usual posting pattern to bash an up-and-coming pro for having bad poker etiquette in a "hot or not" thread that had nothing to do with etiquette.


[/ QUOTE ]
And how many strategy posts does Vanessa have here? Then a bash of Ms. Gluck for changing the direction of a topic in a forum (one that was about Vanessa to begin with...)? Oh no lock her away and throw away the key!!!

[ QUOTE ]
The first thing that jumped out at me was that Vanessa has had a lot of recent success, and yet I hadn't ever heard anything about her etiquette issues that MsGluck has mentioned.


[/ QUOTE ]
Ugh, your jealousy argument kinda goes down here--a seventh in a WPT event I think is very (very very very) unlikely to get her any endorsement stuff [especially given that I don't know of any winners that have any...]. With regards to anyone having posted any bad etiquette about her--you do realize that the topic would have been the following.
SOMEONE YOU'VE NEVER HEARD OF HAS BAD ETIQUETTE!!! Which before that tourn nobody had. (despite the recent "successes") Obviously it wouldn't be a post in the forums that anyone would actually bother to read so there's no point in posting it.

[ QUOTE ]
"where Ms. Gluck says "I don't remember seeing her at all." This is only my interpretation, but it seems to me like she's implying, "Vanessa's a nobody. Don't even pay attention to her!" Seems like Vanessa would be easy to spot since she apparently spends most of her time breaking the rules of poker etiquette and generally ticking people off."


[/ QUOTE ]
Or she could literally not remember her being there... either or. You do realize that even Hellmuth doesn't go off every hand right?

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not genius

[/ QUOTE ] Yeah, no kidding, lol. (sorry but I had to do that)

[ QUOTE ]
I was surprised to see that one of her Friends is... Liz Lieu! So, her post could basically read, "My good friend Liz, another professional female poker player who could be threatened by Vanessa, says that Vanessa has bad etiquette! Also, I heard she was a jerk when she had a higher flush than some other guy. OH! And someone told me that someone at a table said that Vanessa said she's not even afraid of Doyle!" That seems like an awful lot of he-said-she-said.

[/ QUOTE ]
Huh? Did you just bash her for defending her friend? (albeit obviously more of a she started it here kind of thing) Liz still has more success (I believe that's not only in my view but overall so far) than Vanessa has which even makes less credibility towards regarding your threat idea.

[ QUOTE ]

Why don't we let Vanessa's actual play, results and the poker public's opinion dictate Vanessa's public image? This unprovoked and petty nonsense really has no place in a public forum. If someone (or some people) has a problem with something Vanessa does or says at the table, then that someone should talk to her about it privately.


[/ QUOTE ]
I fully agree with you on that last line. However, we don't know how good her play is nor do we know what the results completely are since we obviously don't know any kind of net gain. (obviously the last cash should make her well in the + side of things)

[ QUOTE ]

I'm not trying to attack anyone personally, I'm just trying to speak up on behalf of a friend. Vanessa is a class act and I see no reason for this kind of nonsense.


[/ QUOTE ]
You spend almost the entire long post attacking someone then say "it's not personal". I hate it when people do that.


With regards to this situation I don't know personally nor have played with any of the players involved in this discussion. If Vanessa is a class act and all I'm sure that'll show over time. Maybe I'll even be fortunate enough to find out.

Sorry about the inconsistency with regards to names in this post--I never know what I'm supposed to put with regards to Ms Miss or Mrs and I hate calling people by first names if I don't know them.

I certainly can't blame both of you for defending your friends but I'd prefer if nobody started with theories (like the threat) or gossip that's so vague it's hard to even begin to believe (like the I heard this and this) etc.

[wpr101]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for post Vanessa, I think that clears up a lot of the accussations against you.

Btw, do you have any response to James Van Alstyne's remarks on the circuit about not shaking his hand after you were eliminated? After he received all the 'stories' about your slow roll play, he called your reaction 'poker justice'.

As well, I suggest you call the cardplayer circuit show out because they basically bad mouthed you at the 'final table preview show' and tried to ruin your reputation to potentially thousands of poker players worldwide. Just an idea to set the record straight there as well.



[/ QUOTE ]

According to Vanessa, WE are all wrong about her... Me, Liz Lieu, James Van Alstyne, The Circuit. It's funny to see how a law student would cover something like this up. Well done! I never insulted you looks or your intelligence, I merely exposed your bad poker play. Which it seems you still can't own up to. This will be my last post about this nonsense. Good Luck everyone!

[/ QUOTE ]

You merely exposed her bad poker play? Honestly who the hell do you think you are? I play 12 tables at a time and everyday someone tells me to go f myself or slowrolls quads. It's part of the game. Watch some Matasow re-runs; that's out of line. But did you ever see Raymer complain? NO.

[/ QUOTE ]

dude you need to calm down. she's not promoting anything on her myspace page..if she was, she would be adding random ppl she doesn't even know but she doesn't even do that. calm the eff down...she just spoke her mind and is backing a good friend? what's wrong with that? you guys are turning jean into the bad person here just because one of vanessa's friends can easily sway you? i didn't realize how easily influenced you posters can be.

you don't even know how possibly bad vanessa's behavior could've been. I'm not saying it was, but you weren't even F*cking there.. calm down. there is no more point to this argument...it's just a she said/she also said deal. we won't know..we'll never know...end of story.

[/ QUOTE ]

Honestly dude, her only posts on her have nothing to do with poker; I don't care much for gossip. I feel like Vanessa made her account in order to reply to these accusations. Until I see some decent posts from her in MTT or STT forums then I really don't have much respect for Gluck.

[SUCKAAAA]

Post deleted by Dids

[BartHanson]

Tickle fight between Ms Gluck and Vanessa on L@TB?