Best Big Men to Ever Play the Game

[Assani Fisher]

[ QUOTE ]
well, assani, that settles its. irrefutable evidence indeed. nothing is more certain than the hypothetical predictions of observers.

[/ QUOTE ]

Victor, I don't really understand what you want me to say here. It seems to me as if we have two choices:

-To simply not rank Sabonis at all

-To go by the info we have and rank him to the best of our abilities


If you want to choose the former, then thats fine. But I'd rather, for the sake of debate, chooes the latter.

I never claimed that I had great evidence for Sabonis. I'm just ranking him as best as I can. What exactly do you disagree with here??

[Assani Fisher]

[ QUOTE ]
Assani,

You make comments about not ranking players like Wilt and Russell because they didn't play in your lifetime, so you didn't see them.

Did you see lots of Sabonis in his prime? Or are you just basing this on what other people say? Why can you do this with Sabas but not Wilt/Russell/others?

[/ QUOTE ]


How exactly have I ranked Sabonis anymore than I ranked those two?

I cannot rank players exactly if I didn't see them, but I have no problem with putting them in general tiers. For example I put guys like Wilt and Russell in the first tier and guys like Sabonis in the 2nd tier. But I feel uncomfortable ranking them amongst others in their tiers.

In other words, if you're asking me to give a very general ranking of a player, then I have no problem with going off of what I've heard from qualified sources. But if you're asking me to give an exact opinion, then I don't feel comfortable or qualified to do that unless I have firsthand evidence.

[Uncle Wimp]

[ QUOTE ]
I think part of the issue about Chamberlain is that he truly towered over the rest of the league, for many years. So many people tend to give him less credit for his accomplishments and assume he was less "skilled." I don't know whether that's fair.

[/ QUOTE ]
It's not fair. Wilt led the NBA in assists one year, iirc. The guy understood the game.

[Jack of Arcades]

Wilt
Shaq
Russell
Kareem
Hakeem
Robinson
Duncan

[Assani Fisher]

1986 article exerpts....

The few Americans who have seen Sabonis play in recent years,
mostly professional scouts and college coaches, recount feats of
agility and marksmanship that sound all but superhuman. Pete Newell,
the director of player personnel for the Golden State Warriors of
the National Basketball Association, and a man widely respected for
his acute evaluations of the skills at the center position, is
lavish in his praise of Sabonis. "He could conceivably become the
greatest player in the game,' Newell says. "At seven-three, he is as
naturally gifted as any player I've ever seen, and he conducts
himself like a very athletic forward. He has tremendous hands and a
physique made to order for basketball. If he had played for an
American team last year, I'd have drafted him before Patrick Ewing.'
(The seven-foot Ewing was the first collegiate player selected in
last year's NBA draft, and so coveted were his talents that the
league instituted an unprecedented lottery for first pick in the
draft among the seven teams with the poorest records.)


Newell says, "I saw Sabonis make an unforgettable play last year in a
tournament in Hiroshima, Japan. A rebound bounced high off the rim
and over toward the corner. Sabonis went up for it way out there,
took the ball in one hand and--still up in the air, off balance--
swept the ball backhand, like a discus thrower in reverse, and hit a
teammate in stride downcourt eighty-six feet away for an easy layup.
I'd never seen a play like it.'





Guiding the American team in Spain this summer is Lute Olson, the
basketball coach at the University of Arizona. Olson has seen Sabonis
and the Soviet Nationals on a number of occasions and knows that the
American team, made up of the best available collegians, will be hard
pressed to stay with them. He says, "I saw Sabonis last year in the
finals of a tournament in Dieppe, France. His team was way ahead, and
he made three plays that to me were just unbelievable. Three times he
took defensive rebounds, led the fast break downcourt, pulled up, and
hit three-point shots.'





Bobby Knight, who
coached the victorious Olympic team in 1984, to say of him, "He may
be the best non-American player I've ever seen.'





Bill Wall, the executive director of the
Amateur Basketball Association of the U.S.A., who accompanied the
Russians on the tour, says, "Sabonis clearly outplayed Sampson in
that game.' Sampson was the first player selected in the NBA draft at
the end of the 1982-1983 collegiate season.





The Atlanta selection was neither mysterious nor
sinister, according to Marty Blake, the director of scouting for the
NBA, whose office evaluates the professional potential of every
promising basketball player in the world. Blake says, "Atlanta didn't
have to see Sabonis. Would you have had to see Ewing to know he was
the best player eligible last year? Of course not. Sabonis is in the
same class as Ewing."





Bill Walton, of the Boston Celtics, the league's Most Valuable Player
in 1978, is one of the few NBA centers who have seen Sabonis
firsthand. He admires Sabonis's game, which he saw most recently at
the June, 1985, European Championship, a tournament that the Russian
team won handily. "Even though I've never actually played against the
man,' Walton says, "every time I've seen him play he's been awesome.
I don't understand why some team just doesn't give him a million
dollars and get him over here. Sabonis would be a star in the NBA
right away. I can't think of one guy in the league who reminds me of
Sabonis --he can do it all.'




http://sabonis.4t.com/site/Sabonis_Liths.html

[Mano]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Vyse if you had to rank all current NBA players where would you put Ginboli, Bowen, Parker, Elson, and anyone else you want to rank on their team?

Then go ahead and do the same for these other great big men's championship teams.

[/ QUOTE ]

Here is Hakeem's team the first year he won a championship. See anyone as good as Parker or Ginobli in that lineup?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, that was an amazing year by Hakeem. If he had done that a few more times he'd definitely be in the top 5 discussion(and as is, hes still getting mentioned). I do think the fact that Jordan was retired hurts his case a little bit though.

[/ QUOTE ]

So how many of Duncan's rings came when Jordan was not retired? One of Duncan's rings came in a year when more than half the regular season was scrapped becaus of the lockout, which is more of a "diminishing" factor IMHO. Do you think any of the Spurs teams would have beat the Bull's with Jordan (Hakeem would have had to in order to "do it a few more times")?

[Assani Fisher]

Duncan's Spurs vs Jordan's Bulls would've been a great rivalry. I'm sure both teams would've won less titles if they had to play one another. Along with Bird's Celtics and Magic's Lakers and Kobe/Shaq's Lakers they're the 5 best teams of my lifetime.

[teamdonkey]

[ QUOTE ]
Duncan's Spurs vs Jordan's Bulls would've been a great rivalry. I'm sure both teams would've won less titles if they had to play one another.

[/ QUOTE ]

you're half right anyway.

[teamdonkey]

[ QUOTE ]
Duncan is one of my least favorite players in the history of the NBA but he's obviously a much bigger difference maker then KG and Karl Malone.
He's one of the best anchors on D in the NBA, Malone and KG aren't capable of that. David Robinson does not deserve to be ranked that highly.

[/ QUOTE ]

you mean the Karl Malone that is 2nd all time in defensive win shares, and the Kevin Garnett who's made the last 8 all-defensive teams?

[Assani Fisher]

Karl Malone and KG were very good defenders(KG especially).....neither were/are as good as Duncan there though.