Rebuilding the Cubs

[Your Mom]

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hahahahahahahah

I guess that's about as good of a counter argument I could expect from a Cubs fan. Better luck next time.

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Please don't lump all of us Cub fans into the same group as the dbag YourMom.

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Way to contribute nothing. If you have a better plan for the Cubs, let's hear it. Same to you Illini Lou.

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Umm im the one that started the thread ... read the OP. Thats my plan

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Keep 5 guys and get a new manager isn't really a plan.

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And arguing over whether or not a field helps a guy not even on our team is?

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I agree, we went off on a tangent a bit, but I offered my analysis on probably half the team before that.

[Your Mom]

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And might I add, fictitiously rebuilding a club is hard because there are so many independent factors that weigh into the decisions that are made. And when ownership could care less about wins and losses, most of our dream moves will never come close to reality.

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Surely, you can answer the questions I just posted if you were Tribune/Hendry/MacPhail.

[Jack of Arcades]

Once again, Coors this year has not been as much of a hitter's park as it has in the past. It's a slight hitter's park, but nothing special.

[IlliniLou]

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we keep Lee,Zambrano,Barrett and Cedeno, everyone else is expendable.

the argument that we havent had a SS since Dunston is crap,as is the same with a 3rd baseman. who cares if we havent had a solid player in a certain position, the only solid position we've ever had was Sandberg at 2nd. We havent won in decades, almost a century, so you dont keep someone around just because we havent had somethin in awhile. This is why we continue to lose, because of thinking like this, we are never continuously tryin to improve.

Murton has a drawback, his power isn't really worth anything and his arm is about as strong as a 2nd basemans.

So what do we do? Listen to all offers, take what we can get cuz we're not goin anywhere this year or next. Re-build but do it right, dont half ass it like we have been for decades. Dusty Baker also should be replaced, maybe Bob Brenly or Lou Piniella. They both have WS rings. Fine players for not hustling, for not being into the game. Light a fire under their ass, its their job, its the game they've played since they were kids, its supposed to be their life. Start having them act like it.

Im a pissed off Cubs fan and I need new ownership and personnel or im gonna go crazy. What do the rest of you Cubs fans think?

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Do you try to resign Pierre. Do you give Theriot the 2B job? Do you try to sign a big hitting LF? You make no mention of Jones, who has been productive and has 2 more years left on his contract? Are you trading him? Are you keeping Marshall or Marmol in the rotation? Are you trading Ramirez? Dempster? Erye? Howry? Williamson? Are you bringing up Pie in the second half?

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Pie needs another year in the minors, so we keep Pierre around until next years trading deadline, we keep Jones unless the Yankees offer some good position player prospects. Theriot can be given the job if we find a taker for Walker, the kid needs time in the minors still too. The odds of us signing a big time hittin LF are slim to none given the condition of our team so no on that. If anything, try and swing a trade for up and coming outfielder that has no room to play for bullpen help for them. Trade Howry, keep Eyre cuz left handed bullpen help is harder to find. Get rid of Novoa, let Guzman fill the Novoa role. If possible, trade Ramirez for prospects (one pitching and one outfielder). If trading Ramirez, trade bullpen help and something else to the White Sox for Josh Fields(3rd base prospect). Baker should be fired immediately for Piniella or Brenly. Even Hendry can manage, he did manage in his earlier days. Ownership change is the most glaring need, can't do any changes if management has no guts to do anything.

[Your Mom]

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Once again, Coors this year has not been as much of a hitter's park as it has in the past. It's a slight hitter's park, but nothing special.

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fair enough.

[Your Mom]

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we keep Lee,Zambrano,Barrett and Cedeno, everyone else is expendable.

the argument that we havent had a SS since Dunston is crap,as is the same with a 3rd baseman. who cares if we havent had a solid player in a certain position, the only solid position we've ever had was Sandberg at 2nd. We havent won in decades, almost a century, so you dont keep someone around just because we havent had somethin in awhile. This is why we continue to lose, because of thinking like this, we are never continuously tryin to improve.

Murton has a drawback, his power isn't really worth anything and his arm is about as strong as a 2nd basemans.

So what do we do? Listen to all offers, take what we can get cuz we're not goin anywhere this year or next. Re-build but do it right, dont half ass it like we have been for decades. Dusty Baker also should be replaced, maybe Bob Brenly or Lou Piniella. They both have WS rings. Fine players for not hustling, for not being into the game. Light a fire under their ass, its their job, its the game they've played since they were kids, its supposed to be their life. Start having them act like it.

Im a pissed off Cubs fan and I need new ownership and personnel or im gonna go crazy. What do the rest of you Cubs fans think?

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Do you try to resign Pierre. Do you give Theriot the 2B job? Do you try to sign a big hitting LF? You make no mention of Jones, who has been productive and has 2 more years left on his contract? Are you trading him? Are you keeping Marshall or Marmol in the rotation? Are you trading Ramirez? Dempster? Erye? Howry? Williamson? Are you bringing up Pie in the second half?

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Pie needs another year in the minors, so we keep Pierre around until next years trading deadline, we keep Jones unless the Yankees offer some good position player prospects. Theriot can be given the job if we find a taker for Walker, the kid needs time in the minors still too. The odds of us signing a big time hittin LF are slim to none given the condition of our team so no on that. If anything, try and swing a trade for up and coming outfielder that has no room to play for bullpen help for them. Trade Howry, keep Eyre cuz left handed bullpen help is harder to find. Get rid of Novoa, let Guzman fill the Novoa role. If possible, trade Ramirez for prospects (one pitching and one outfielder). If trading Ramirez, trade bullpen help and something else to the White Sox for Josh Fields(3rd base prospect). Baker should be fired immediately for Piniella or Brenly. Even Hendry can manage, he did manage in his earlier days. Ownership change is the most glaring need, can't do any changes if management has no guts to do anything.

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Ok, now we're talking. I think I would like Pinella or even Bowa as manager. We need someone to light a fire in their ass. Don't think Hendry wants to manage. He gave that up at Creighton a while ago to do what he's doing now, although he was very good at Creighton (I live in Omaha and followed them very closely then.) I would need some real good prospects to trade ARam because I don't think we have anything better. He's a proven hitter and has showed a real good glove this year. I really have no idea what Theriot can do. Need to see him, Murton, and Cedeno in there every day to continue evaluating (lol). Agree that Pie needs another year. There was lots of talk of maybe Carlos Lee being interested in coming. Def. something we should explore. I do think we need to sign a free agent pitcher in the offseason - a #2 or #3 type guy. So our rotation would be Z, Prior, new signee, Marshall, and Marmol. I really don't think that's too bad a rotation. We're stuck with Rusch so he and Guzman are probably both in the pen and spot start when/if someone (ok, Prior) gets hurt. This assumes we don't resign Maddux or maybe he retires and will be our pitching coach. Jones stays - he's done nothing wrong really once he figured out how to tag up on a fly ball, although he can't throw worth [censored]. Pierre is interesting, but we should explore all of our CF options including him. Should get rid of Mabry - he sucks. Perez will stay but he shouldn't start nearly as often as he does, but he's a decent defensive replacement and can hit right handed halfway decent. Barrett is fine - at least above avg. hitter. Blanco's a good defensive backup. Pagan seems to have some talent so he should stick around. Walker needs to be traded. We should see if we can get anything for Williamson. No one wants Novoa. I wonder what Rich Hill could bring, although it seems too early to give up on him the way he dominates AAA. Guzman seems like another Juan Cruz, so we can deal him if someone wants him bad enough. I think Dempster is better than he has shown, but they should use the second half to find out - it would help if he got some regular work.

[pirateboy]

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And might I add, fictitiously rebuilding a club is hard because there are so many independent factors that weigh into the decisions that are made. And when ownership could care less about wins and losses, most of our dream moves will never come close to reality.

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Surely, you can answer the questions I just posted if you were Tribune/Hendry/MacPhail.

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Of course they can. I'm Doug Coffin though, so don't expect me to have the answers.

[crockpot]

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The Cubs are one of the most profitable franchises in the MLB, mainly due to their idiotic fans willing to put up with retards in the front office year after year.

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God I hate fairweather fans.

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after enough time on this forum, two things are clear to me:

1. 2+2ers hate fans who pack the stadium when the team is losing
2. 2+2ers hate fans who only care about the team when they're winning

clearly, the only fan the posters here like is one who never comes to games at all.

[crockpot]

i want dusty out of power as badly as anyone, but why does everyone keep pointing to lou piniella as the answer? this is the same guy who, with the mariners in the 90s, accomplished less with more talent than just about any team in history. his reputation is built at least as much on his tirades as his actual management. he's not a fan of OBP or of putting high-OBP guys at the top of the order, which is the primary change the cubs need to make.

davey johnson is a significantly better choice, if he wants the job. hell, bring in earl weaver.

[IlliniLou]

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The Cubs are one of the most profitable franchises in the MLB, mainly due to their idiotic fans willing to put up with retards in the front office year after year.

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God I hate fairweather fans.

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after enough time on this forum, two things are clear to me:

1. 2+2ers hate fans who pack the stadium when the team is losing
2. 2+2ers hate fans who only care about the team when they're winning

clearly, the only fan the posters here like is one who never comes to games at all.

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you, my friend, are a very wise man