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| View Poll Results: Do my friends owe for Sunday night? | |||
| Yes, cheap bastards |
   
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60 | 61.86% |
| No, you are the cheap bastard |
  
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37 | 38.14% |
| Voters: 97. You may not vote on this poll | |||
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Thread Tools | Display Modes |
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#701
10-31-2006, 03:37 PM
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Re: Curtains vs PoG
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] If he does not fall apart at the seams he may very well play 20. f3 in reply to 19.. Qd5+ and use f2 for his rook. It may appears awkward but he's up a pawn, so he's allowed to be a bit backwards for now... [/ QUOTE ] We have a lot of good choices against 20.f3. I don't really think it's best. I looked at 20...Qc6 maybe intending Qc2. Also 20...Rc6 and doubling rook ideas only gain by having the pawn on f3. And 20...Nd7 is still possible too. [/ QUOTE ] I don't understand how you can say we can't get a Rook on c2 but we can get a Queen there. That's inconsistent. It's one or the other, right? Or am I missing something deeper here? 
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#702
10-31-2006, 03:46 PM
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Re: Curtains vs PoG
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It seems like Tim's idea Qd5 Kg1 Ne7 works, where nothing else quite does. His answer to f3 with Qc6 also looks strong. Anyone sees a problem with these lines? D. [/ QUOTE ] I thought the line was Rc6 not Qc6, it really helps to put moves number together as I see some of these post running together and some folks are defending various positions at the same time.
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#703
10-31-2006, 03:51 PM
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Re: Curtains vs PoG
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] If he does not fall apart at the seams he may very well play 20. f3 in reply to 19.. Qd5+ and use f2 for his rook. It may appears awkward but he's up a pawn, so he's allowed to be a bit backwards for now... [/ QUOTE ] We have a lot of good choices against 20.f3. I don't really think it's best. I looked at 20...Qc6 maybe intending Qc2. Also 20...Rc6 and doubling rook ideas only gain by having the pawn on f3. And 20...Nd7 is still possible too. [/ QUOTE ] (NajdorfDefense wrote  I don't understand how you can say we can't get a Rook on c2 but we can get a Queen there. That's inconsistent. It's one or the other, right? Or am I missing something deeper here? [/ QUOTE ] You quote two different people, neither of which said (in the quoted text) it was impossible to get a rook or a queen on c2, so what are you talking about? And who are you talking to?
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#704
10-31-2006, 03:53 PM
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Re: Curtains vs PoG
Nd7 sorry after Kg1
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#705
10-31-2006, 04:14 PM
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Re: Curtains vs PoG
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I don't understand how you can say we can't get a Rook on c2 but we can get a Queen there. That's inconsistent. It's one or the other, right? Or am I missing something deeperhere? [/ QUOTE ] I think the idea is that... f3 is not very good and Qc6 seems to refute it. 19...Qd5+ 20. f3 Qc6 21. Bd2 ( I don't really see a better move, maybe there is one? )...Qc2 where as without f3 the same Qc6 idea doesn't work as well e.g 19...Qd5+ 20. Kg1 Qc6 21. Be3 Qc2 22. Qxc2 Rxc2 23. Rfc1 Rec8 24. Rxc2 Rxc2 25. Rc1 It is also hard to get the rooks to the second, as white has time to move the B and contest the files. In Summary: Qd5 seems good, and the follow up Nd7 after Kg1 ( since f3 is bad) seems promising. D.
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#706
10-31-2006, 04:27 PM
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Re: Curtains vs PoG
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I think the idea is that... f3 is not very good and Qc6 seems to refute it. 19...Qd5+ 20. f3 Qc6 21. Bd2 ( I don't really see a better move, maybe there is one? )...Qc2 [/ QUOTE ] Refute what how? 19. ...Qd5+ 20. f3 Qc6!? White has a free move, how can you state it's been refuted.... Bg5, Ba3, for the sake of what not.. What are you doing with the c2, we've got Rf2 it's not like white has to roll over an die and if you exchange down....
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#707
10-31-2006, 05:00 PM
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Re: Curtains vs PoG
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With Rc6 followed by Rc8 and a later Nb4, we dominate the c2 square. The bishop can't defend it and if he defends with Rc1 we still play...Rc2, if he exchanges RxR we also exchange RxRc2 and have a defended Rook on c2. He cannot take our second rook with his Q because the Knight defends it. [/ QUOTE ] If this idea turns out to be dangerous to white, he will just counter Nd5 with Bd2. The d5 square is just a dead end for the knight when that happens, as it would be captured if it ever moves to b4. He can even answer 19...Rc6 with 20.Bd2.
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#708
10-31-2006, 05:10 PM
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Re: Curtains vs PoG
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19. ...Qd5+ 20. f3 Qc6!? White has a free move, how can you state it's been refuted.... Bg5, Ba3, for the sake of what not.. What are you doing with the c2, we've got Rf2 it's not like white has to roll over an die and if you exchange down.... [/ QUOTE ] 21.Bd2 is what I would expect. Then 21...Qc2 22.Qxc2 Rxc2 23.Rf2 and now we have options like Rec8, Nd5, or even h6 relieving back rank trouble and allowing the knight to stay comfortably on f6 for now (because 23...Nd5 24.Re1 Rec8 25.Re5 is icky for us). But 20.f3 opening the second rank is just an ugly move in an ending with 6 major pieces on the board. We should probably just avoid exchanges and stack on the d-file to keep all the rooks on in this case.
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#709
10-31-2006, 05:12 PM
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Re: Curtains vs PoG
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[ QUOTE ] With Rc6 followed by Rc8 and a later Nb4, we dominate the c2 square. The bishop can't defend it and if he defends with Rc1 we still play...Rc2, if he exchanges RxR we also exchange RxRc2 and have a defended Rook on c2. He cannot take our second rook with his Q because the Knight defends it. [/ QUOTE ] If this idea turns out to be dangerous to white, he will just counter Nd5 with Bd2. The d5 square is just a dead end for the knight when that happens, as it would be captured if it ever moves to b4. He can even answer 19...Rc6 with 20.Bd2. [/ QUOTE ] ...and you're saying ...Qd5+ f3 Rc6 Bd2 and what's our line now?
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