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#61
07-17-2007, 01:03 PM
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Re: Big Stacked AKs
[ QUOTE ]
if you wait for the turn you might as well turn your hand face up [/ QUOTE ] Really? I still think people are getting caught up in the fact that villain does not know what you have. I cannot see how checking the turn makes our hand "face up". [ QUOTE ] i also think that betting protects your table image much better than checking behind with it. [/ QUOTE ] OP said nothing about table image. Edit: To be quite honsest, the best argument I have heard for not checking the turn is Adam's and it consists of "checking the turn for value is straight silly." Lastly, what this hand really comes down to (like many hands) is how bad/good is villain? If villain is good, he never has a pocket pair here and we should just check behind. If villain is bad, he is more likely to have a pocket pair, but he still has some unpaired cards in his hand some of the time. If he is bad enough to fold a pocket pair on this flop however, I agree that betting the flop is best. If he is good, he won't fold a PP on the flop. If he is bad, he will, and we should be bet. 
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#62
07-17-2007, 01:05 PM
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Re: Big Stacked AKs
[ QUOTE ]
Really? I still think people are getting caught up in the fact that villain does not know what you have. I cannot see how checking the turn makes our hand "face up". [/ QUOTE ] I think I'm going to run a slight experiment here.
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#64
07-17-2007, 03:55 PM
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Re: Big Stacked AKs
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Checking behind for value against any possible hands we are ahead of is straight silly Shove and take the big pot vs weak hands Shove and take the pot vs hands you are ahead of that fold Shove and win the flip vs really good hands that villain calls with [/ QUOTE ] Plz Add: Shove to fold out hands that otherwise would have paid you off on the turn. [/ QUOTE ] name one go Name a hand that is fodling to our shove on the flop, but paying us off on the turn when we hit a club, A, or K. Thanks
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#65
07-17-2007, 03:58 PM
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Re: Big Stacked AKs
Sherman, you're argument is essentially:
Check behind so when you hit on the turn, sometimes u can get a little value out of AQ if an A hits or KQ is a K hits. Maybe get a little value out of QcQ when a club hits? This is TERRRRRRIBLE
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#67
07-17-2007, 04:14 PM
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Re: Big Stacked AKs
[ QUOTE ]
Also, Sherman, when you check behind flop, and the turn is an offsuit 2, and whatever random pair he has open shoves the turn. What do you do? [/ QUOTE ] i think this is the most probable outcome from checking the flop. taking a free card shows weakness and villain could be jamming on turn with pair or no pair, then it is up to you to decide if he does or not. like i said, put the decision on villain.
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#69
07-17-2007, 04:33 PM
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Re: Big Stacked AKs
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Also, Sherman, when you check behind flop, and the turn is an offsuit 2, and whatever random pair he has open shoves the turn. What do you do? [/ QUOTE ] He's calling. [/ QUOTE ] Which is terrible, as we've lost the odds to do so.
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#70
07-17-2007, 04:46 PM
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Re: Big Stacked AKs
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Also, Sherman, when you check behind flop, and the turn is an offsuit 2, and whatever random pair he has open shoves the turn. What do you do? [/ QUOTE ] He's calling. [/ QUOTE ] Which is terrible, as we've lost the odds to do so. [/ QUOTE ] I was trying to point this out. If you check & turn bricks, I think it's very bad to have to decide whether to call. Why put yourself in position to have to make a hard decision?
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