No Limit Bots ? Kwickfish says yes.

[traxamillion]

So Bots aren't even illegal?

[metamath]

interesting hypothetical question... what about the possibility of a bot mimicking the style of aba/durrr?

[KurtSF]

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That would imply the bot would be a winner at 10/20 or 15/30, games that are typicall drastically different online than 5/10.

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That's right.

There has been documented proof of bots beating 30/60 online, including beating 2+2ers.

Check it.

[JayTee]

The argument that bots can't beat high stakes because poker is a "game of incomplete information" seems pretty week. All players lack the information. I think you have to consider that what may seem intuitive to you can ultimately be logically deduced. Every decision that a player makes can be expressed mathematically. Just because humans don't solve equations in their head while playing means nothing. The question is: How complicated does the programming have to be to make these difficult decisions? Thinking that it is impossible seems flat out wrong.

[Victor]

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dmitedly, this is without considering a program like PTrack implemented into the bot, which im sure is possible.

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wtf, why would you not consider this? i would always consider this as crucial if making a bot.

[Victor]

lets go a step further in that they can create a unique profile for every player. and they can remember how u play certain situations and exploit it.

[stinkypete]

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the bot has no idea how other people play their hands, the bot knows nothing about their styles, if they are tilting or what ever.

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why do you think that?

[Artsemis]

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lets go a step further in that they can create a unique profile for every player. and they can remember how u play certain situations and exploit it.

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This is why bots CAN win and will eventually probably be able to beat any human in the long run. If a human knows how to adapt to the feel of the game, a bot can be programmed the same way.

As for the legality question -- I had a thread in the Zoo last week that covered that. I think most people agree'd it just depends on the sites' rules on if it's "okay" or not -- legality-wise, I don't think anything is "illegal" in online poker in terms of prosecution. Just "rules" and morals is about as far as it goes.

[Victor]

another huge advantage is that bots can access pokerstove type ev information in real time.

humans are forced to approximate except for the relatively few commone situations that we have run sims on and still remember.

[lgas]

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Is a bot really going to be able to go "hmm my opponent played that hand unusually aggressively, I will expect more of the same from him this session"? And then a few minutes later when it becomes clear that opponent is now folding instead in marginal spots because he is aware of his image, that now we should start being *more* scared of that player's short term future aggression because they know we know they look like a maniac at the table? Also, timing tells, and so on...

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Yes.

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The first bots that beat these games will not play super-LAG. They will be like 15/13 TAG.

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Who says these are the first?

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...the person who code that bot has to be a ALOT better player than the bot...

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Not necessarily true. One of my biggest leaks that is hard for me to fix is that I make bad calls when I know I'm beat because I just want to see if I was right about what my opponent got there with. If I programmed a bot, I would not include this leak in its programming.